Help me to understand..

[lionroar0]

He was always the second Eternal God of the Trinity. It was not until His birth that He became the Son of God.. This is true. But HE has always been the second in the triune God.. Therefore since He is eternal God that became flesh we see that Mary really only gave Him the flesh. For He has and always will be eternal God.

The Son of God is the second person of the Trinity. The Trinity has always existed but was not fully revealed till Jesus was born of Mary.

The Trinity in the OT was not fully revealed till the Incarnation. Jesus fully revealed the Trinity.

Peace

 

[GregoryTurner]

Keyword "revealed" If Jesus did not exist until the human birth, how was He "sent" by the Father? Also, how could He know and see what the Father does? He also states that He will "return" to the Father...

Grace be with you,
g

 

[MamaZ]

Actually He was revealed in the Prophecies.. This is why Jesus came and fulfilled the scripture.

 

[lionroar0]

Keyword "revealed" If Jesus did not exist until the human birth, how was He "sent" by the Father? Also, how could He know and see what the Father does? He also states that He will "return" to the Father...

Grace be with you,
g

Jesus as the second person of the Trinity did not fully exist.

The second person of the Trinity is Jesus who is both Human and Divine.

His Divinity has always existed with God. The Trinity was not fully revealed till Jesus was made incarnate.

Peace

 

[lionroar0]

Actually He was revealed in the Prophecies.. This is why Jesus came and fulfilled the scripture.

He was revealed when He was conceived and fullfilled the prophecies.


Peace

 

[GregoryTurner]

Jesus as the second person of the Trinity did not fully exist.

The second person of the Trinity is Jesus who is both Human and Divine.

His Divinity has always existed with God. The Trinity was not fully revealed till Jesus was made incarnate.

Peace

In the mighty words of Pete (O, Brother Where Art Thou!), "That don't make no sense."
Brother, please look at what Jesus taught... "Before Abraham was, I AM!" He didn't teach that He was half-way there.
The "Trinity" was not revealed to us, yes, but Jesus did fully exist.

Grace be with you,
g

 

[lionroar0]

In the mighty words of Pete (O, Brother Where Art Thou!), "That don't make no sense."
Brother, please look at what Jesus taught... "Before Abraham was, I AM!" He didn't teach that He was half-way there.
The "Trinity" was not revealed to us, yes, but Jesus did fully exist.

That movie did cross my mind earlier today. Good movie.

I did not say that Jesus did not fully exist. I said that He did not fully exist as the Second person of the Trinity till He took on flesh.

The Trinity could not be fully revealed till Jesus became Incarnate, because the second person of the Trinity is Jesus who is both human and divine.

Peace

 

[GregoryTurner]

He had to fully exist as part of the "Trinity" simply because He does not need to be human to do that. The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit were there from the beginning, hence, "before Abraham was, I am." Just because humankind did not know who He was until He was born does not count Him as not being a part of the "trinity" as we know it today. Here again I see this "man" stuff comin in.

Indeed very good movie. I don't like the language so much but it has a great message. My favorite part is where Delmer utters the great southern theme of joining in with our friends...."I'm wit yoo fellers!"

Grace be with you,
g

 

[MamaZ]

I did not say that Jesus did not fully exist. I said that He did not fully exist as the Second person of the Trinity till He took on flesh.

Oh yes He most certainly did.. We read this is John..
Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Joh 1:2 He was in the beginning with God.
Joh 1:3 All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.
Joh 1:4 In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men.
Joh 1:5 The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it.
Joh 1:6 There came a man sent from God, whose name was John.
Joh 1:7 He came as a witness, to testify about the Light, so that all might believe through him.
Joh 1:8 He was not the Light, but he came to testify about the Light.
Joh 1:9 There was the true Light which, coming into the world, enlightens every man.
Joh 1:10 He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him.
Joh 1:11 He came to His own, and those who were His own did not receive Him.
Joh 1:12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name,
Joh 1:13 who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.
Joh 1:14 And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us, and we saw His glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth.

 

[MamaZ]

We see that Jesus was indeed part of the trinity before He became flesh.

 

[GregoryTurner]

Oh yes He most certainly did.. We read this is John..
Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Joh 1:2 He was in the beginning with God.
Joh 1:3 All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.
Joh 1:4 In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men.
Joh 1:5 The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it.
Joh 1:6 There came a man sent from God, whose name was John.
Joh 1:7 He came as a witness, to testify about the Light, so that all might believe through him.
Joh 1:8 He was not the Light, but he came to testify about the Light.
Joh 1:9 There was the true Light which, coming into the world, enlightens every man.
Joh 1:10 He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him.
Joh 1:11 He came to His own, and those who were His own did not receive Him.
Joh 1:12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name,
Joh 1:13 who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.
Joh 1:14 And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us, and we saw His glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth.

Hello? Why does no one else get this?

Grace be with you,
g

 

[WarriorAngel]

It was revealed in the Prophecies....
Think about that.

Mary was already 'created' to be...
God knew she would exist, He created her already and waited for the appointed time in which she [the choosen woman] would be Mother to His precious Son.

She wasnt choosen on the fly...
God took extra measures to produce her to ensure His plan for salvation would unfold...
But also, it was her will He relied on. He knew He could count on her because of the way He would make her...

But that doesnt mean she wasnt free to decline, just as Eve was free to decline staying under the trust of God in Eden.

Therefore, God preordained WHO she would be...
End result, she is the Queen of Heaven.

Pre ordained at the beginning when HE set up Kingdoms on earth that would reflect the Kingdom of Heaven.

Yea, He taught mankind who would be king, and so forth, and how the set up would be.

This is a reflection of how it is in Heaven as it is on earth.

 

[GregoryTurner]

That don't make no sense. I am sure He "counted" on her will... Just as He counted on the will of Adam and Eve. Come on, don't be rediculous. She had just as much free will as did the former... There is nothing divine about Mary, she was made just like the rest of us sinners.

Grace be with you,
g

 

[WarriorAngel]

That don't make no sense. I am sure He "counted" on her will... Just as He counted on the will of Adam and Eve. Come on, don't be rediculous. She had just as much free will as did the former... There is nothing divine about Mary, she was made just like the rest of us sinners.

Grace be with you,
g

Adam and Eve were not created to be sinners.

 

[WarriorAngel]

Satan wanted to seperate man from God, God didnt want a division.
He wanted to test them...but He certainly didnt 'want' them to sin, and He definitely didnt 'want' to have to die for us so we would not be seperated.

YET due to the consequences of the actions [sin] He did just that.

It wasnt something He craved doing...
But remained faithful

Genesis 3:15.
The Woman AND her Seed..

 

[GregoryTurner]

Adam and Eve were not created to be sinners.

No kiddin'? That point went over both your heads The point is that Mary had FREE WILL just like Adam and Eve did. Hello?

Grace be with you,
g

 

[Thekla]

Hello? Why does no one else get this?

Grace be with you,
g

it helps now that punctuation, spaces, and upper and lower cases have been added by scribes and copyists etc over the centuries