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Hell is not what you think.

Discussion in 'Messianic Judaism' started by visionary, Feb 14, 2020.

  1. Tone

    Tone Star Fish Radiant Supporter

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    Okay.
     
  2. Tone

    Tone Star Fish Radiant Supporter

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    So, the unrighteous will experience eternal un-living...and this is hell?

    So, what do you make of:

    Revelation 20:14
    "And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death."

    ?
     
  3. Oscarr

    Oscarr Senior Veteran Supporter

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    The Bible talks about continued existence in eternity for everyone. We have a mortal physical body, but an immortal soul. Anyone who reads the Bible knows that! It doesn't say that we are "eternal beings" in so many words, but there is a lot more that show that we will end up in a conscious state in eternity, whether with the Lord or separate from Him.
     
  4. Tone

    Tone Star Fish Radiant Supporter

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    I think there has been a lot of philosophical speculation throughout the years.
     
  5. Emmsmom81

    Emmsmom81 Zealous for Christ. Homesick for Heaven.

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    The second death is eternity without flourishing in the glory of the life giver.
     
  6. Tone

    Tone Star Fish Radiant Supporter

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    Well, don't you think there has to be some amount of flourishing to be conscious?
     
  7. Emmsmom81

    Emmsmom81 Zealous for Christ. Homesick for Heaven.

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    Nope.
     
  8. pinacled

    pinacled walking with the Shekinah

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    Leave the dead where they are just as Yeshua said.

    And keep in mind the courtesy to address those who have spoken..
    Elder sis is encouraging the daughters of The Kingdom to sharpen iron.

    Keep up youngin
     
  9. Tone

    Tone Star Fish Radiant Supporter

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    Okey dokes. Yah bless you Sis, shalom!
     
  10. Emmsmom81

    Emmsmom81 Zealous for Christ. Homesick for Heaven.

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    I haven’t really got any clue what you are writing to me. Honestly, it is really confusing ramblings. Please don’t send me anymore messages. Good night.
     
  11. Kenny'sID

    Kenny'sID Well-Known Member Supporter

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    So many unreal views of Hell.

    What we know:

    "'And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
    "' (Matthew 25:30).

    It's outer darkness, meaning out, away from God, and I assume it's people are godless and not very nice.

    We have weeping and gnashing of teeth now, but if you have ever been there, think of how bad the situation was that caused it. So, I assume there will be a lot of those situations, and very unhappy people.

    Revelation 20:10, 15, “And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever. . . . Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire.”

    Hot? You bet, at least so many things seem to point in that direction. The worse part of hell, it's eternal.

    And on that happy note, I must retire.
     
  12. visionary

    visionary Your God is my God... Ruth said, so say I. Supporter

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    Another Greek word "Gehenna" occurs 12 times in the New Testament; 11 times in the Gospels and one time in the Epistle of James. Yeshua used "Gehenna" about 7 times. Some of the occurrences of "Gehenna" are in parallel passages, that is, they refer to the same event. "Gehenna" is the Greek form of the Hebrew "ge-hinnom." It literally means "valley of Hinnom" Sometimes it is referred to as the "valley of the sons of Hinnom." In the Old Testament "Tophet(h)" also refers to this place. (See Young's Concordance under Hinnom) "Gehenna" is a valley that lays on the west and southwest of Jerusalem. In the valley, Israel offered up its children as a burnt offering to a god who came to be known as Moloch.

    In Jeremiah, we hear God speaking to Jeremiah regarding this sacrifice, "And they have turned to Me the back, and not the face;though I taught them, rising up early and teaching them, yet they have not listened to receive instruction. but they set their abominations in the house which is called by My name, to defile it. And they built the high places of Baal which are in the Valley of the Son of Hinnom, to cause their sons and daughters to pass through the fire to Molech, which I did not command, nor did it come into My mind that they should do this abomination, to cause Judah to sin." (Jer. 32:33-35) Jeremiah says this valley would one day be called the "Valley of slaughter." (Jer. 7:30-33) This Scripture had its literal fulfillment in 70 A.D. at the destruction of Jerusalem.

    King Josiah, in his days, desecrated this place by tearing down all the idols, crushing or burning them, and burning human bones on them (probably those of the priests who presided over these rituals). A Jew was not allowed to touch anything that touched a dead human being. Please note, it was God's own people who were doing the burning, not God, and He said such a thing never entered His mind. Also note, not one single time in the entire Old Testament was this word "Ge-hinnom" translated "hell."

    In Yeshua' day, this valley was a city dump very much like modern dumps-always being filled, and therefore always having something for the fire to consume and worms to eat. ("where the worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.) It was a place fit only for waste. Should a Jew, God's "chosen" people ever be given a burial in "Gehenna," it would be the most humiliating thing that could ever happen to him. It would be like saying that one's life here on earth was completely worthless, fit only for the dump. For Yeshua to tell a religious Jew, such as a Pharisee, that his life, his religious works, his devotion to God were fit only for the city dump, was to insult him in the worst possible way. Jews went to great efforts to make their funerals great events. Some even hired professional "mourners" to cry at their funeral. Herod was going to have the leaders of Israel killed on his day of death so that Israel would mourn on his death. This is the kind of mentality Jews had regarding their life and they way they should leave this world. Even today, one will hear Jews say that the most important thing a person owns is his name. They will go to great lengths to keep their name alive. They will name buildings, start foundations, etc., to keep their name alive. Many, who no longer believe in a resurrection feel this is the only way they can stay alive beyond the grave-to have their name remain in the minds of future generations.

    Returning to "Gehenna," one can walk through this valley even today and return unscathed by its fires and untouched by the worms (maggets) which actually consumed a good part of the religious Priestly community of Israel in the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 A.D. Their bodies were piled up and their blood ran down into this very valley which Jesus prophesied would be the disgraceful burial place for hundreds of thousands of Jews of that very generation Yeshua was speaking to.

    Whatever this valley represented in the Old Testament must be carried over to the New Testament. Nowhere in the Old Testament is this place translated "Hell" and nowhere in the Old Testament is there a hint that this place referred to a place of eternal punishment after death. The word which Yeshua referred to most often which the King James Bible unfortunately chose to render "hell," in the New Testament, but did not do so in the Old Testament, is this word "Hinnom" or Ge-hinnom (valley of Hinnom) or "Ge-ben-hinnom" (valley of the sons of Hinnom) which was transliterated into the Greek as "gehenna." A thorough study of this place in the Old Testament will dispel much myth regarding its significance. The Scriptural references for such a study are: Josh. 15:8; 18:16; 2 Kings 9:7; 15:3,4; 23:10, 36, 39; Ez. 23:37,39; 2 Chr. 28:3; Lev. 18:21; 20:2; Jer. 7:30-32; 19:2-6; 32:35. Remember, this place is never referred to as "Hell" in the Old Testament. References to this very same place in the New Testament are: Matt. 5:22; 5:29, 30; 10:28; 18:9; 23:15; 23:33; Mark 9:43; 9:45; 9:47; Luke 12:5; James 3:6. It should be mentioned that most of these references come from Yeshua' mouth and every reference to this word "gehenna" was addressed to God's own people, not to the nations around Israel.

    The Greek word "tartarus" occurs one single time in the entire Bible and it is found in 2 Peter 2:4. It is the place where sinning messengers (angels) are reserved unto judgment.

    The English word "Hell" occurs 54 times in the King James Bible, and is a translation of 4 Hebrew and Greek words. Not one of the words has a meaning even closely related to the meaning theologians have given the English word "Hell." Many Bibles translated in the last one hundred years do not contain the English word "Hell." Almost all of them have found no justification for translating "Sheol" into "Hell." Therefore, almost all English Bibles do not contain any references to our modern concept of "Hell" in the Old Testament. From Genesis to Malachi, "Hell" has disappeared as a result of better translating. Many Bibles have eliminated the word entirely.

    Returning back to the subject of "Hell," we have found that the Hebrew word "Sheol" should never have been translated "Hell." The Jews today, whose Bible consists of the Old Testament do not translate it "Hell" because in no way does "Sheol" correspond with the images and doctrines the church associates with the word "Hell." The Greek word "Hades" is the equivalent of "Sheol" and has the same meaning.

    The Greek mythological place the Greeks called "Tartarus" occurs one time in the Biblical text to denote a holding place for messengers (angels) "til" judgment which indicates an eventual release from this place.
     
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