Hell is a correctional jail

[Ben12]

Do you not understand, that it is sin which separates us from a perfect, flawless, loving God, only reachable through the sacrifice Christ made for us? What did He die for? Did he die for the idea that all who were with sin would one day join this perfect Lord, thus meaning all he warned, said, and condemned as sin was a lie? It may not sound fair to you, it may not sound reasonable to you, but who are you to question what is ultimately, and purely good and right? Are you God? Has he set you up on his throne to see creation, the acts of men, the stain that is sin, through His eyes? I don't think so! We are not the judges here, we are not the ones who decreed such a thing! And it is not our place to call God's actions unfair, less we join the Devil in his rebellion! I have faith in a creator, that creator being He who is I Am, Lord Almighty, Jesus Christ! If the lake of fire, hell, or whatever name you wish to call it, is not a place of eternal condemnation, that all who go eventually rejoin God in paradise, then that makes the man who says He is the Truth, The Way, and the Life, a liar! And despite all your anger or indignant opinions, CHRIST IS NO LIAR!

Jesus is not a liar; it is man and his relious bias is where you find the lies and half truths.

​

Luke 3: 6 ​

(Amp) And all mankind shall see (behold and [a]understand ​

and at last acknowledge) the salvation of God ​

(the deliverance from eternal death decreed by God).​

​

Romans 5:18-20 (Weymouth’s)​

It follows then just as the result of a single transgression is a condemnation which to the whole race, so also is the result of a single degree of righteousness is a life giving acquittal which extends to the whole race. (19) for as thought the disobedience of one individual the mass of mankind were constituted as sinners, so also though the obedience of one, the mass of mankind will be constituted righteous. Now law was brought in later on so that the transgression might increase, but sin increased, grace is overflowed.​

​

1 Corinthians 15:22-24​

http://www.biblegateway.com/bg_versions/bgclick.php?what=2​

22For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.​

23But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.​

​

 

[7angel]

only one supposition. father and son, one goes to the Heaven and the other to hell.

The question is; the one that he went to the Heaven will be happy knowing that his son or his father is in hell?

If my son or my father is in hell, I would request God that pardons it, and would not be happy until my son or my father is with me

 

[SoundCard]

I never said going to Hell or anyone going is a happy thing. I never said I like it. But if one did, while the other didn't? That's on their hands I'm afraid. It would be their lack of Faith in Christ that did it. We've been warned time and time again. Our chance is here, now, in this life to come to know Christ and find salvation from that fate.

 

[Ben12]

The Bible declares that all men will be saved; many so called Christians could not even tell you that such scriptures are even in scriptures. If they did; they would do all in their power to hide this fact or change its meaning to suit theirs. There is so much more to God’s Word then heaven and hell; this Bible was written my men who were touched by God’s Spirit in such an awesome and deep way.

This is a debate; a debate long in coming. Religious men will preach against this word; they will yell it behind closed doors in their assemblies about how can someone not see the oblivious truth of eternal torment. We do see what you are saying; all of us at one time or another believed the way you do; BUT we also heard the reality of what God is doing in our spirits; then and only then can the real truth can be told. The glory of this FORUM is a place where we can come together and openly discuss this issue and many more. There are two main approaches to scripture; a spiritual Word within, and the outer shell, the hull, the chaff. We have been taught too long hearing what man is saying; it is time to let God speak; that is the last thing a religious man would dare try.

 

[Ben12]

I never said going to Hell or anyone going is a happy thing. I never said I like it. But if one did, while the other didn't? That's on their hands I'm afraid. It would be their lack of Faith in Christ that did it. We've been warned time and time again. Our chance is here, now, in this life to come to know Christ and find salvation from that fate.

That is where they are wrong; where does it say God's grace ends.

 

[SoundCard]

If one does not know Christ then one is not subject to God's grace. And if one is not under Christ they are under the Law, and by the Law their sins will be weighed, and by the law they will be judged.

 

[Ben12]

If one does not know Christ then one is not subject to God's grace. And if one is not under Christ they are under the Law, and by the Law their sins will be weighed, and by the law they will be judged.

Sure they are subject to God's grace; it is not there time. I understand what you are saying; But God must call someone before they have the ability to come. We are all dead spiritually; that is the curse. A dead man cannot see, hear touch, smell etc. That is especially true with a spiritually dead man. That is what grace is all about; God must call draw/drag us by His grace or we do not have the ability to awaken from this death state. God is not calling all people; He is only calling His firsts fruits.

John 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw (Gk(drag) him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw (Gk(drag) all men unto me.

1670 helkuo (hel-koo'-o);or helko (hel'-ko); probably akin to 138; to drag (literally or figuratively):

Corinthians 15:22-24​

22For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.​

23But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.​

 

[Tavita]

If one does not know Christ then one is not subject to God's grace. And if one is not under Christ they are under the Law, and by the Law their sins will be weighed, and by the law they will be judged.

Yes, that's true, so that means we should go back to the OT and look at how God deals with sin under the Law. We need to ask if God tortured anyone by fire or any other horrible act (of man's mind) for sin.

Jer 19:5 and have built the high places of Baal to burn their sons in the fire as burnt offerings to Baal, a thing which I never commanded or spoke of, nor did it ever enter My mind;

 

[SoulFly51]

What is also interesting is what corrupt translators have done with the word aion or aionios which simply means age or ages.

The two words that are mis-translated twelve ways:

1. eternal
2. Course
3. World
4. since the world began
5. from the beginning of the world
6. Ever
7. Forever
8. forever and ever
9. for evermore
10.while the world standeth
11. world without end
12. never.

Then you look at the fact that any of these words can be interchanged with each other.

The Pharisees, according to Josephus, regarded the penalty of sin as torment without end, and they stated the doctrine in unambiguous terms. They called it “eirgmos aidios” (eternal imprisonment) and timorion adialeipton(endless torment), while our Lord called the punishment of sin aionion kolasin (age long chastisement) so be you bias.

I cannot find the word eirgmos in the Bibles original language; by the way the true or root meaning of eternal is without beginning or end, man has a beginning so how can he be an eternal being.

Ecclesiastes 12:7
Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.

Yeah, I don't know what website you pasted that from or where (if you have any training at all) you were trained in Koine Greek, but this post is just wrong.

I looked up the word aionios in the stardard Koine Greek-English lexicon (used by Harvard, Oxford, Yale, and credible seminaries) and found the definition to be:

1) Pertaining to a long period of time, long ago
2) Pertaining to a period of time without beginning or end, eternal
3) Pertaining to a period of unending duration, without end

That's it.

Since long ago doesn't fit the context, it would have to be eternal or without end - thats it - nothing else.

 

[Nadiine]

Yes, that's true, so that means we should go back to the OT and look at how God deals with sin under the Law. We need to ask if God tortured anyone by fire or any other horrible act (of man's mind) for sin.

Jer 19:5 and have built the high places of Baal to burn their sons in the fire as burnt offerings to Baal, a thing which I never commanded or spoke of, nor did it ever enter My mind;

Well, this isn't a valid support example actually.
The SACRIFICES God demanded were of ANIMALS, not human children.
The high places of Baal (and all other human sacrificing of pagans), were SACRIFICING TO THEIR gods in order to recieve blessing and "appease" that god.
God said only animals were acceptable [blood] sacrifice for atonement to appease Him. (causing Him to "overlook" the sin, it didn't remove the sin).

Remember Cain & Abel? A sacrifice issue.

To say that God won't throw unregenerate souls into the Lake of Fire because He never intended for human sacrifice IS TO ALSO SAY THE SACRIFICE OF JESUS CHRIST IS WRONG!
CHRIST WAS A HUMAN SACRIFICE of sorts (GOD in flesh)
Using that example isn't valid or relevant becuz THE PURPOSE IS TOTALLY DIFFERENT.

Lake of Fire is the PUNISHMENT, blood sacrifice is for ATONEMENT of sin. The lost aren't atoned for or atoning for sin when judged.
The sentencing phase is in place and they're being PUNISHED under the penalty of law.

 

[Ben12]

Yeah, I don't know what website you pasted that from or where (if you have any training at all) you were trained in Koine Greek, but this post is just wrong.

I looked up the word aionios in the stardard Koine Greek-English lexicon (used by Harvard, Oxford, Yale, and credible seminaries) and found the definition to be:

1) Pertaining to a long period of time, long ago
2) Pertaining to a period of time without beginning or end, eternal
3) Pertaining to a period of unending duration, without end

That's it.

Since long ago doesn't fit the context, it would have to be eternal or without end - thats it - nothing else.

There you go with your credible seminaries; they are human build with a religious bias. I trust nothing of man and his religion. The true meaning of the word eternal means without beginning or end; today you will get all kinds of interpretations of this word Greek or English.

Some have arrogantly contended that the punishment must be everlasting because the same word is used of the life of God - eternal life - and if the punishment is not eternal then the life cannot be eternal. But that is an argument put forth by the ignorant, the result of the shallow reasoning of men who reach hasty conclusions not founded on the facts. "If the punishment ends then God's life must end, if the life is eternal then the punishment must be eternal," we are told!
In late years there has been much controversy over the meaning of the little Greek word AION. Certain deceivers, to further their unscrupulous ends and uphold their blasphemous and Romanish doctrine of eternal damnation, have maintained, contrary to and in spite of all revealed facts, that it means eternal. And our King James version renders it, together with the adjective AIONIOS as "age, course, eternal, for ever, evermore, for ever and ever, everlasting, world, beginning of the world, world began, world without end." What a horrible mixture!

But we need not remain in darkness, for fortunately the Word of God tells us precisely what this Greek word means. Too few have taken the time or energy to consider the real meaning of AION. It is the word from which we get our English word eon. Eon, according to Webster, means "a long period of TIME." Many attempts have been made to prove that eons are eternal. But this is more than a grave error, it is the height of stupidity, for the divine Author of the blessed Bible has not Himself used them in that way. AION nowhere means eternal! Its simple meaning is an age. In its plural form it means ages. This fact can be unquestionably and incontrovertibly demonstrated from numerous New Testament passages. A glance at any Greek concordance proves that the noun AION, or AGE, is not the synonym of eternity. A study of each case would make a library; so, leaving this task to the reader, we must content ourselves with adducing a few specimens to demonstrate the fact. It is usage that determines meanings - THEIR usage, not ours; the meanings that the holy prophets and apostles gave to their words rather than those that our English translators may try to give. Let me illustrate.

Furthermore, Lev. 24:8 states that the covenant given to Israel was an "everlasting covenant." Yet, it was conditional and based on Israel's obedience (Ex. 19:5-6). And the inspired writer of the book of Hebrews declares, "For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second. For finding fault with them, He says, Behold, the days come, says the Lord, when I will make a NEW COVENANT with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah... in that He says, A new covenant, He has made the first old. Now that which decays and waxes old is ready to VANISH AWAY" (Heb. 8:7 8, 13). Ah, did you notice? The everlasting covenant has been DONE AWAY! What a wonder, that! We are told that the "earth abides forever" (Eccl. 1:4), but Jesus said, "Heaven and earth shall pass away.. (Mat. 24:35).
Now for the New Testament:

Let us look at how the word AION is used in a number of passages. About 37 times in the New Testament it is rendered "world," twice as "worlds," twice as "ages," and once as "course." Every place where the word "eternal" appears, with but one exception, it is a translation of this word AION or its adjective form AIONIOS. Twice it is rendered "evermore." Ever place where the word "everlasting" appears, but one, it is this same word or its adjective form. With but thirteen exceptions, every place where the word "ever" appears it is the same word or its adjective form. And aside from all this confusion, the word also appears in the plural, and in a number of confusing combinations, such as "the aion of the aion," "the aion of the aions," and "the aions of the aions," etc.
Some of the passages where AION is found will give us added information concerning it. In Eph. 2:7 we find, "in the ages (aions) to come." In Col. 1:26 we find, "the mystery which has been hid from ages (aions). " In Eph. 2:2 we find "you walked, according to the course aion of this world." In Heb. 1:2 we find, "by whom also He made the worlds (aions)." In Heb. 11:3 we find, "the worlds (aions) were formed by the Word of God." In about fifteen instances, such as Mat. 12:32, 1 Cor. 1:20, etc., we find it rendered "this world (aion). " Twice we find "this present world (aion). " In Gal. 1:4 we find, "deliver us from this present evil world (aion)." In Eph. 6:12 we find, "the rulers of the darkness of this world (aion)." In 11 Cor. 4:4 we find, "the god of this world (aion)." In I Cor. 2:6 we find, "the wisdom of this world (aion)." In Lk. 16:8 we find, "the children of this world (aion)." In Mk. 4:19 we find, "the cares of this world (aion)." How much more understandable it would be if the translators had used the word age instead of world!

In Mk. 10:30 we find that there is not only this present aion, which is evil, but also "the world (aion) to come." In Lk. 20:35 we find, "but they that shall be accounted worthy to obtain that world (aion), and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry nor are given in marriage." In Heb. 6:5 we find, "and have tasted the powers of the world (aion) to come." And in Lk. 1:70, Jn. 9:32, etc., we find that the aion had a beginning: "since the world (aion) began."

And now in reviewing the Scriptures we have just quoted we note that this aion is something which has a king; it has princes; it is in darkness; it had a beginning; it has an ending; it is evil; it has wisdom; it has children who marry; it has cares. The aions we find were made by Christ, simply through His spoken Word, and we also find in Col. 1:26 that the mystery of Christ in us, the hope of glory, has been hidden from these aions.
Now, if AION means ETERNAL, consider how ridiculous the Word of God would be! The Holy Spirit would be found saying, "the mystery which has been hid from eternities;" "the mystery of Christ which in other eternities was not made known;" "in the eternities to come;" "You walked according to the eternity of this world;" "by whom also He made the eternities;" "the rulers of the darkness of this eternity;" "now once in the end of the eternities has He appeared;" "the harvest is the end of the eternity;" "since eternity began;" "in the eternities to come," etc. etc. Let the scholars whose business it is delve into the many intricacies of expression, and worry over the many grammatical combinations. Suffice it to say here that there have been "aions" in the past, there is this present "aion," and there are "aions" to come. And these all combined make up TIME, encompassing the whole of the progressive plan and program of God for the development of His creation.

Any thinking person should clearly see that if you translate the word AION which means an age by the word eternal, which has nothing to do with time, you immediately get the wrong idea. The same thing applies when the word AION is translated by the word world. It is incorrect and brings nothing but confusion. That is why so many Christians have been worrying about "the end of the world" when they should have been understanding God's special dealing here at "the end of the age." There is a great deal of difference between the expression, "He shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever," and the expression, "He shall be tormented day and night unto the ages of the ages." For ever and ever has no end. The ages of the ages do have an end, and their end will see every knee bowing and every tongue confessing that Jesus Christ is the Lord to the glory of God the Father. (Phil. 2:10; Rom. 14:10-11). The first expression forbodes complete hopelessness for billions and makes the faith of God of none effect. The second expression, which is completely correct, not only offers hope but expresses the ultimate fulfillment of the purpose which was purposed in Christ Jesus before the world began or before the ages were framed.creation.

 

[Ben12]

Well, this isn't a valid support example actually.
The SACRIFICES God demanded were of ANIMALS, not human children.
The high places of Baal (and all other human sacrificing of pagans), were SACRIFICING TO THEIR gods in order to recieve blessing and "appease" that god.
God said only animals were acceptable [blood] sacrifice for atonement to appease Him. (causing Him to "overlook" the sin, it didn't remove the sin).

Remember Cain & Abel? A sacrifice issue.

To say that God won't throw unregenerate souls into the Lake of Fire because He never intended for human sacrifice IS TO ALSO SAY THE SACRIFICE OF JESUS CHRIST IS WRONG!
CHRIST WAS A HUMAN SACRIFICE of sorts (GOD in flesh)
Using that example isn't valid or relevant becuz THE PURPOSE IS TOTALLY DIFFERENT.

Lake of Fire is the PUNISHMENT, blood sacrifice is for ATONEMENT of sin. The lost aren't atoned for or atoning for sin when judged.
The sentencing phase is in place and they're being PUNISHED under the penalty of law.

God's judgements are always balanced, and are always just. As I said earlier the word punish means pruned, chastised and it is NOT eternal. The Lake of Fire is only written about in the Book of Revelations which is a spiritual book not literal. The Book of Revelations is the most spiritual book in the Bible and all the hidden symbolisms are hidden though out the Bible. Book of Revelations is the Revelation’s of Jesus Christ with in us; not without. Yes there is a literal word that is written; but the message is deep and it is spiritual. Each one of the seven Churches speak of a literal local body; but there is a great and hidden symbolism for us today.

Revelations and Genesis are so pregnant with hidden mysteries it will totally bring you face to face with God’s GLORY and his plan for all mankind. Genesis is the foundation; where Revelation is the conclusion. God’s conclusions are always spiritual; just like His seconds are always more glorious and spiritual compared to His first.

Revelations 1:1

The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:​

This one little word is so reverent to the whole book Revelations; ‘signified” or signs and symbols. The Book Revelations can only be understood not as a book of prophecy, or literally; but as a very deep and awesome spiritual book by using signs and symbols that can only be found in the Bible.

Abel’s sacrifice was acceptable to God because of the symbolismof blood; notice for a true sacrifice you need the blood of Jesus and fire. God is a consuming fire; He will consume all the wood hay and stubble, but not the people; Cain on the other hand did not have an acceptable sacrifice because it spoke of works/sweat. Of course when you speak of the blood of Jesus; His blood sacrifice will annihilate the sin; but not the people. We are no longer under the law but grace; because of that better sacrifice.

 

[JMRE5150]

GThe Lake of Fire is only written about in the Book of Revelations which is a spiritual book not literal.

This merely your opinion.

 

[Ben12]

To say that God won't throw unregenerate souls into the Lake of Fire because He never intended for human sacrifice IS TO ALSO SAY THE SACRIFICE OF JESUS CHRIST IS WRONG!

I have always said the wicked will be pruned, chastised in the Lake of Fire, BUT not forever.

 

[Ben12]

This merely your opinion.

John was in Spirit on the Lord's day; no where does it say it was literal; plus the symbolism.

Revelations 1:1

The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:​

This one little word is so reverent to the whole book Revelations; ‘signified” or signs and symbols. The Book Revelations can only be understood not as a book of prophecy, or literally; but as a very deep and awesome spiritual book by using signs and symbols that can only be found in the Bible.

 

[Ben12]

Try checking out Ray Prinzing's Revelation's a postive Book on the Web. You see God's Word in a different light; positive; not doom and gloom.

 

[SoundCard]

I'll stick with the Bible, thanks.

 

[james415]

Lake of Fire is the PUNISHMENT, blood sacrifice is for ATONEMENT of sin. The lost aren't atoned for or atoning for sin when judged.
The sentencing phase is in place and they're being PUNISHED under the penalty of law.

Christ paid the price of sin once for all men.
There is nothing left to be punished for!

Hebrews 7:26-27 Such a high priest meets our need—one who is holy, blameless, pure, set apart from sinners, exalted above the heavens. Unlike the other high priests, he does not need to offer sacrifices day after day, first for his own sins, and then for the sins of the people. He sacrificed for their sins once for all when he offered himself.

Romans 5:18 Consequently, just as the result of one trespass was condemnation for all men, so also the result of one act of righteousness was justification that brings life for all men.

Matthew 18:12-14"What do you think? If a man owns a hundred sheep, and one of them wanders away, will he not leave the ninety-nine on the hills and go to look for the one that wandered off? And if he finds it, I tell you the truth, he is happier about that one sheep than about the ninety-nine that did not wander off. In the same way your Father in heaven is not willing that any of these little ones should be lost.

 

[Nadiine]

Christ paid the price of sin once for all men.
There is nothing left to be punished for!

Hebrews 7:26-27 Such a high priest meets our need—one who is holy, blameless, pure, set apart from sinners, exalted above the heavens. Unlike the other high priests, he does not need to offer sacrifices day after day, first for his own sins, and then for the sins of the people. He sacrificed for their sins once for all when he offered himself.

Romans 5:18 Consequently, just as the result of one trespass was condemnation for all men, so also the result of one act of righteousness was justification that brings life for all men.

Matthew 18:12-14"What do you think? If a man owns a hundred sheep, and one of them wanders away, will he not leave the ninety-nine on the hills and go to look for the one that wandered off? And if he finds it, I tell you the truth, he is happier about that one sheep than about the ninety-nine that did not wander off. In the same way your Father in heaven is not willing that any of these little ones should be lost.

Philippians 3:9
and may be found in Him, not having a righteousness of my own derived from the Law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which comes from God on the basis of faith,

John 3:

15so that whoever believes will in Him have eternal life. 16"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.

Romans 10:
4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes

You're either under CHRIST (born again) or you're under LAW.

I suggest you read the scriptures - they detail that FAITH is salvation, and only those who have FAITH in Jesus Christ are SAVED and not under judgment.

All else are under the law for their failure to atone for their sin.

 

[Ben12]

Philippians 3:9
and may be found in Him, not having a righteousness of my own derived from the Law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which comes from God on the basis of faith,

John 3:

15so that whoever believes will in Him have eternal life. 16"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.

Romans 10:
4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes

You're either under CHRIST (born again) or you're under LAW.

I suggest you read the scriptures - they detail that FAITH is salvation, and only those who have FAITH in Jesus Christ are SAVED and not under judgment.

All else are under the law for their failure to atone for their sin.

We know this God is not calling all people now.