healing and forgiveness

[Merlin]

This may not go over well
anyway, healing often requires forgiveness (by the sick person)
which people have trouble doing.

 

[LogosRhema]

Sources?

 

[PujolsNonRoidHomerHitter]

Chapter and verse please!

Go Cards!

 

[Merlin]

it's not specifically scriptural.
it's personal experience working with cancer, diabetes, etc.

it effects our natural abilities to heal.

 

[PujolsNonRoidHomerHitter]

it's not specifically scriptural.
it's personal experience working with cancer, diabetes, etc.

it effects our natural abilities to heal.

In that case, then I would agree that an unforgiving heart or spirit could result in POSSIBLY a variety of different health problems.

Go Cards!

 

[LogosRhema]

Its scriptural, but I'm not the one proving the case here...

 

[Merlin]

Its scriptural, but I'm not the one proving the case here...

forgiving is scriptural, but few realise the effects of not forgiving.

 

[LogosRhema]

forgiving is scriptural, but few realise the effects of not forgiving.

You can scripturally prove forgiveness and health as connected is what I was saying.

 

[Strong in Him]

This may not go over well
anyway, healing often requires forgiveness (by the sick person)
which people have trouble doing.

It depends what kind of healing you're talking about.

There is more to wholeness than physical healing, and past memories/hurts etc may well require forgiveness. SOME illnesses may be caused by bitterness because of a past hurt, or whatever, and if that was revealed (by the Lord, some people are well intentioned but don't actually know) to be the cause, then when forgiveness is offered, healing, physical and otherwise, will take place.

What are you saying? That if sick people were able to forgive, they'd be physically healed? Not ALL physical illness or disability is caused by unforgiveness.

 

[MamaZ]

Mat 18:33'Should you not also have had mercy on your fellow slave, in the same way that I had mercy on you?'
Mat 18:34"And his lord, moved with anger, handed him over to the torturers until he should repay all that was owed him.
Mat 18:35"My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart."

 

[Catherineanne]

This may not go over well
anyway, healing often requires forgiveness (by the sick person)
which people have trouble doing.

Which of Our Lord's acts of healing were conditional on any behaviour on the part of the person being healed?

 

[Catherineanne]

forgiving is scriptural, but few realise the effects of not forgiving.

I am not sure your logic is straight on this one.

If a person has a condition such as cancer, they are likely to suffer a huge range of emotional responses to that. If in this process they show anger, or express an unforgiving attitude to those around them, this is as much a symptom of their illness as the tumour itself. It makes no sense to say, if they could forgive, their cancer might not be so bad. It is the other way round. If they did not have cancer, they might not be so angry, and hence so unforgiving.

There but for the Grace of God go any one of us. God forbid that at such a time some smug person comes along and suggests that it is our own fault, even in the smallest way, because we don't forgive those around us who are perfectly well, and who have a whole lifetime ahead of them, when we see our own future shortened to weeks or days.

Lord, have mercy!

 

[Merlin]

It depends what kind of healing you're talking about.

There is more to wholeness than physical healing, and past memories/hurts etc may well require forgiveness. SOME illnesses may be caused by bitterness because of a past hurt, or whatever, and if that was revealed (by the Lord, some people are well intentioned but don't actually know) to be the cause, then when forgiveness is offered, healing, physical and otherwise, will take place.

What are you saying? That if sick people were able to forgive, they'd be physically healed? Not ALL physical illness or disability is caused by unforgiveness.

about 95% of chronic illness, whether cancer, diabetes, ALS, MD, Fibromyalgia, and on and on

 

[Catherineanne]

about 95% of chronic illness, whether cancer, diabetes, ALS, MD, Fibromyalgia, and on and on

You would appear to be blaming the victim for the crime, if you think that 95% of people with such conditions bring it upon themselves by being unforgiving. This is an appalling attitude, imo.

 

[MamaZ]

Unforgiveness eats at people..It causes many illnesses.. Notice that when Jesus healed many He told them your sins are forgiven?

 

[Merlin]

You would appear to be blaming the victim for the crime, if you think that 95% of people with such conditions bring it upon themselves by being unforgiving. This is an appalling attitude, imo.

truth can be appalling.
it's subconscious.
much like a phobia

 

[Strong in Him]

about 95% of chronic illness, whether cancer, diabetes, ALS, MD, Fibromyalgia, and on and on

And you can prove that can you?
In that case, why don't you do the medical profession a huge favour, go into the hospital wards and tell people they don't need expensive drugs, they just need to admit that they bear a grudge towards someone, repent and forgive? You'd put them out of a job - if you didn't get arreste and/or sectioned first, but at least the chaplains and ministers would have more to do.

truth can be appalling.

It's not the truth - you have offered no references, sources, details of scientific study/research or studies of people who have had cancer, repented of their unforgiving attitudes and were healed, or whatever. All we have is your statement that illness is caused by unforgiveness.

It's not that far from saying that you can earn your healing by forgiving, if you don't forgive you won't be healed; ergo if you're not healed, it's your own fault, or at least your responsibility.

That is not truth.

 

[Strong in Him]

Unforgiveness eats at people..It causes many illnesses.. Notice that when Jesus healed many He told them your sins are forgiven?

It can; it doesn't automatically follow that all illness is due to unforgiveness.

Jesus was God (still is), he knew whether or not an illness was being caused by unforgiveness. And only God could forgive sins; Jesus showed that he too had that right and authority by healing their illness too. His miracles often confirmed, or pointed to, who he was.

 

[Merlin]

And you can prove that can you?
In that case, why don't you do the medical profession a huge favour, go into the hospital wards and tell people they don't need expensive drugs, they just need to admit that they bear a grudge towards someone, repent and forgive? You'd put them out of a job -, but at least the chaplains and ministers would have more to do.

been there, done that

It's not the truth - you have offered no references, sources, details of scientific study/research or studies of people who have had cancer,

i don't offer to prove Jesus is lord either.
just state it as fact.

 

[Strong in Him]

been there, done that

And? How many people were healed after they forgave someone? How many doctors resigned and said "you're right, we need to retrain as chaplains/ministers?" Furthermore, why aren't doctors being prosecuted for prescribing expensive medicines or damaging people's bodies with invasive treatments and procedures when all they have to do is tell their patients to forgive?

i don't offer to prove Jesus is lord either.

You don't have to - the NT says, in many places, that Jesus is Lord, and whatsmore, that no one can confess this truth without the Holy Spirit.

It does not say "95% of physical illness is caused by unforgiveness", and this is not a proven scientific fact. So how is it truth?