Have you ever known of a church that keeps personal notes on people in their databases?

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Ahh.. the ol' fear tactic, we have info on you, to keep them in line. Will inquisitions once again become politically correct?

Technically, they never stopped.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Not just typical contact data that would come off a visitor or new member sheet that you filled out, like address and phone. But for example, a pastor or other staff member interacts with someone in the church and forms an opinion of them, good or bad, and feels the need to document that information. So they go on their church's computer and let loose whatever they want, which can be seen by others on staff, present or future. Or they just document which Bible study classes you attended, along with comments like 'talks a lot' or 'has controversial views on the Bible.'

I've even heard of churches sharing information so that if the person changes from one church to another, the new church knows something about them, sort of like Facebook creating profiles on people and providing them to others.

I even saw a church use special software to help members do an annual spiritual evaluation which included divulging personal information about such things as sinful behavior or bad habits. The first web page or two as you went through the survey had you sign up with name and email before you get to the web page with disclaimer info you had to agree to, which included agreeing that the church had a right to share your information and discuss it with other churches. Um, excuse me? You want to WHAT? How sick is THAT? They knew exactly who failed to continue with the survey after reading the disclaimer cause they already had your name and email address at the beginning of the survey.

With all the controversial hoopla surrounding Facebook privacy, I can't help but wonder what info churches are collecting, and how many people would be livid if they knew about it. Do I trust churches to voluntarily disclose their policies on data collection? Absolutely not. I'm sure THEY believe that whatever THEY collect and store won't cause harm to anyone. But it causes harm to a person if the person doesn't like what they're doing, for whatever reason. It's not the church's job to decide what info a person would or wouldn't like being kept about them. It's the church's job to voluntarily offer full disclosure on what types of computer systems are being used to store info, what exactly could potentially be stored, who is authorized to create and store it, and who is authorized to see it, now or in the future. Then the person has a right to say, "No, delete it, and don't store any more ever again." (or alternatively, to never give them another dollar and leave).

Many of them, reportedly, get and maintain complete credit/ financial reports, especially of giving,
and where you sit is determined to some degree by how much the leader likes you, as well as your financial status with relation to the group.

 

[timothyu]

Many of them, reportedly, get and maintain complete credit/ financial reports, especially of giving,
and where you sit is determined to some degree by how much the leader likes you, as well as your financial status with relation to the group.

In other words they mirror the first gentile churches that built themselves on the old institutional standards of man.

 

[Seadish]

Not just typical contact data that would come off a visitor or new member sheet that you filled out, like address and phone. But for example, a pastor or other staff member interacts with someone in the church and forms an opinion of them, good or bad, and feels the need to document that information. So they go on their church's computer and let loose whatever they want, which can be seen by others on staff, present or future. Or they just document which Bible study classes you attended, along with comments like 'talks a lot' or 'has controversial views on the Bible.'

I've even heard of churches sharing information so that if the person changes from one church to another, the new church knows something about them, sort of like Facebook creating profiles on people and providing them to others.

I even saw a church use special software to help members do an annual spiritual evaluation which included divulging personal information about such things as sinful behavior or bad habits. The first web page or two as you went through the survey had you sign up with name and email before you get to the web page with disclaimer info you had to agree to, which included agreeing that the church had a right to share your information and discuss it with other churches. Um, excuse me? You want to WHAT? How sick is THAT? They knew exactly who failed to continue with the survey after reading the disclaimer cause they already had your name and email address at the beginning of the survey.

With all the controversial hoopla surrounding Facebook privacy, I can't help but wonder what info churches are collecting, and how many people would be livid if they knew about it. Do I trust churches to voluntarily disclose their policies on data collection? Absolutely not. I'm sure THEY believe that whatever THEY collect and store won't cause harm to anyone. But it causes harm to a person if the person doesn't like what they're doing, for whatever reason. It's not the church's job to decide what info a person would or wouldn't like being kept about them. It's the church's job to voluntarily offer full disclosure on what types of computer systems are being used to store info, what exactly could potentially be stored, who is authorized to create and store it, and who is authorized to see it, now or in the future. Then the person has a right to say, "No, delete it, and don't store any more ever again." (or alternatively, to never give them another dollar and leave).

Yes I have I won't go into detail but it was horrible! It was a way to see who would follow them blindly. Many many people were ostracized instead of being reached out to as they professed as they insisted on having all personal data. Thing is we saw it happen to a ridiculous number of people as we were there

 

[whereloveandmercymeet]

That’s scary. Doesn’t feel so much like a church but some kind of cult or something. I’d run fast in the opposite direction.

My church, you’re lucky if they actually updated your address properly when you told them for the fourth time after you moved. No fear of them retaining other information

 

[timothyu]

Yes I have I won't go into detail but it was horrible! It was a way to see who would follow them blindly. Many many people were ostracized instead of being reached out to as they professed as they insisted on having all personal data. Thing is we saw it happen to a ridiculous number of people as we were there

Your basic anti-Christ Christian institution follow the will of man over the will of God. But don't be too hard on them. The blind have lead the blind for centuries. The 'Church' started officially doing this 1700 years ago when it broadsided Jesus and His Gospel of the Kingdom and joined with the State to form a human superpower, which of course goes directly against what Jesus taught regarding the Kingdom.

 

[timothyu]

My church, you’re lucky if they actually updated your address properly when you told them for the fourth time after you moved. No fear of them retaining other information

My church didn't even check to see if the potlucks were being doubled up and everyone was bringing just buns. It's called freedom.

God says.. here is the Gospel of the Kingdom, take it or leave it. Either way you shall have the appropriate reward. God says choose my will over man's or stick to your default setting. Same rewards apply. God is not an enforcer. That is man's thing and obviously churches that micro-manage have an agenda not in line with God but more in line with the Adversary desperate to keep his minions under control while building walls to the Kingdom..

 

[Christlike777]

By law, our church has to keep track of tithes (of those who leave this address); to which year end tithing statements are required to be given out by law, for tax purposes. As far as a list of wrongs and rights, we do not have any documentation of church members, nor should we. Remember, love does not take into account the wrongs that have been suffered (1 Corinthians 13:5).

As far as sharing gossip information with others, the Word of God also tells us to refrain from that. Now, however, in terms of leadership and being kept in the light on certain characteristics of individuals that have certain prone behaviors, yes, this needs to be known. A person coming out of prison as a registered child sex offender should be made know to church leadership, so as to keep an eye on that person and his interaction with the kids in the church. Also, for church leadership, it is good to know (within reason) of issues that may arise between those in leadership; so one is not caught off guard, but I really stress that caution be exercised so that the information relayed in not being relayed just for informative reasons, but for counseling and prayer.

Now, if Joe Smo comes to be confessing that he cheated on his wife, I by all means would never tell another soul of his confession (even leadership). This is a confession and hopefully a repentance. No one else needs to know about this...not even my wife!

Now if another church came to me asking about a reference for someone who served in the church, I would be open and honest with my heart on the matter in such a way as to not share direct information about certain things that would make me hesitant in that individuals. I would instead say, "I don't think it is the right season for them to be serving right now. God is needing to work out some issues in their life."

 

[justme6272]

I would instead say, "I don't think it is the right season for them to be serving right now. God is needing to work out some issues in their life."

^ ^ Counts as the gossip based on someone's personal opinion.

No one gets a special exclusion to call it anything else. A better answer that doesn't violate scripture or confidences would be 'no comment.'

 

[Paidiske]

^ ^ Counts as the gossip based on someone's personal opinion.

No one gets a special exclusion to call it anything else. A better answer that doesn't violate scripture or confidences would be 'no comment.'

Sometimes we can't "no comment."

For example, it's now becoming part of the expected background checks for anyone doing anything with children, that a new church contact the old church and ask for a reference. If I had any hesitation about the suitability of someone for that role, I have a legal responsibility to make that clear.

Aside from that, though, my private notes/records of pastoral matters are mine and not shared. Nor should I be sharing my impressions of those with whom I work, without some appropriate reason.

 

[MariaJLM]

I'd be suspicious of any church keeping deeply personal information about their members. It's not their jobs. The only information they should be keeping is phone numbers, email addresses, baptismal records, marriage records, etc.