Hate Crimes Bill Passes U.S. House of Reps.

[GarrettC]

On Thursday, the House of Representatives approved a bill that would broaden the definition of federal hate crimes to include attacks based on sexual orientation. The bill was attached to a must-pass $680 billion defense policy bill that the Senate could approve as early as next week. source--washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/10/08/AR2009100804233.html?wprss=rss_nation

I must admit I do not support this bill. Not because it would make it illegal to attack or kill homosexuals, but because it would make it illegal to discriminate against them.
Unlike race, color, or national origin, homosexuality is a very morally-charged issue. Many Christians strenuously oppose homosexuality on religious grounds (Lev. 18:22, Gen. 19, 1 Cor. 6:9). If they own a business, and a homosexual applies for that business (esp. a business with religious affiliation), that person would be morally adverse to hiring the applicant. However, under the hate crimes bill, refusing to hire a homosexual person because of religious conviction would be illegal.

It also puts pastors in a bind. In 2005, a Swedish pastor was put on trial before Sweden's Supreme Court to see if he would go to jail for six months. His crime was preaching a sermon on the Biblical prohibitions of homosexuality. source--chalcedon.edu/articles/article.php?ArticleID=214
source--lifesitenews.com/ldn/2006/sep/06091302.html

Rep. Artur Davis (D-Ala.) admitted during a hearing on the bill that it could be used to prosecute pastors merely for preaching against homosexuality under the premise that they could be "inducing" violence in someone.
source--wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=96595

What does everyone else think about this?

Quick end note:
To those of you who would attack my position that the Bible condemns homosexuality because it only mentions two men, remember that in ancient times men were the ones that were dominant in almost all matters.

(1 Pe. 1:17 -- "Since you call on a Father who judges each man's work impartially, live your lives as strangers here in reverent fear.")

I will leave an analysis of the precise meaning of Lev. 18:22 and other verses dealing w/ homosexuality for a later date. Have to research and make notes on it first.

 

[blue stone yellow powder]

if its the story of the AOG pastor i am thinking of .


my pastor heard about this swedish pastor and inquired about it to our pastors in sweden.

evidently this pastor just didnt deliver a innocent biblical sermon on the sin of homosexuality .
he flaunted it around to news media and purposley egged on the swedish government .

Confessional lutheran pastors in sweden routinly not only in sermons but catechism classes teach that homosexuality is sin to both teens and parents .

Isnt it odd nothing happens to them and the swedish government is aware of that to?

The same thing in the usa .


if you want to make a big spectacle to puff your self up and show off how wonderful though art , at the exspence of repect for government how lousy they are. Beware the government may just show who the real fool is.

 

[bdolack]

if its the story of the AOG pastor i am thinking of .


my pastor heard about this swedish pastor and inquired about it to our pastors in sweden.

evidently this pastor just didnt deliver a innocent biblical sermon on the sin of homosexuality .
he flaunted it around to news media and purposley egged on the swedish government .

Confessional lutheran pastors in sweden routinly not only in sermons but catechism classes teach that homosexuality is sin to both teens and parents .

Isnt it odd nothing happens to them and the swedish government is aware of that to?

The same thing in the usa .


if you want to make a big spectacle to puff your self up and show off how wonderful though art , at the exspence of repect for government how lousy they are. Beware the government may just show who the real fool is.

You'd better do a bit more research about Ake Greene (the Swedish pastor). He did NOT flaunt it to the news media, etc. Check your facts.

 

[GarrettC]

if its the story of the AOG pastor i am thinking of .


my pastor heard about this swedish pastor and inquired about it to our pastors in sweden.

evidently this pastor just didnt deliver a innocent biblical sermon on the sin of homosexuality .
he flaunted it around to news media and purposley egged on the swedish government .

Confessional lutheran pastors in sweden routinly not only in sermons but catechism classes teach that homosexuality is sin to both teens and parents .

Isnt it odd nothing happens to them and the swedish government is aware of that to?

The same thing in the usa .


if you want to make a big spectacle to puff your self up and show off how wonderful though art , at the exspence of repect for government how lousy they are. Beware the government may just show who the real fool is.

Sorry, but I did my research on this one. Every article I found said that he did not flaunt it. He drew attention to it in the media after he was arrested.

 

[Rotator]

Hate crime legislation is the biggest waste of time/paper/effort in DC.

 

[mont974x4]

Hate crime legislation is the biggest waste of time/paper/effort in DC.

I agree. But the issue remains. Are pastors prepared to pay the penalty for teaching and preaching the truth? We must ask ourselves who we fear more, God or man? Paul endured such hardship for it, but still prayed for boldness. I pray I have half his courage.

 

[Yarddog]

On Thursday, the House of Representatives approved a bill that would broaden the definition of federal hate crimes to include attacks based on sexual orientation. The bill was attached to a must-pass $680 billion defense policy bill that the Senate could approve as early as next week. source--washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/10/08/AR2009100804233.html?wprss=rss_nation

I must admit I do not support this bill. Not because it would make it illegal to attack or kill homosexuals, but because it would make it illegal to discriminate against them.

This is a hate crimes bill and has nothing to do with job related discrimination, unless one of these things occur in the work place- physical assault, damage to property, bullying, harassment, verbal abuse or insults, or offensive graffiti or letters.

This is a good bill.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_crime#cite_note-ovrbwx-1

 

[MrJDSmith]

Time to break out the notebooks

 

[GarrettC]

This is a hate crimes bill and has nothing to do with job related discrimination, unless one of these things occur in the work place- physical assault, damage to property, bullying, harassment, verbal abuse or insults, or offensive graffiti or letters.

This is a good bill.

One concern is that a pastor could be arrested if he preaches a sermon against homosexuality that could be tied to a hate crime.

 

[Subdood]

"Hate" crime?

This is a horrific bill illegitimately born of a pernicious, insidious evil.

In all Marxist countries it's a crime to hold dissenting opinions about Marxism or about their beliefs/policies - just as it's a crime to "be" someone they capriciously happen not to "like." "Hate" crime is, on its face - complete hypocrisy.

The homosexual lobby is being used by Marxists to promote their agenda to make it a crime to believe in God. Marxism - itself a pernicous form of satanism - is intent on eradicating God from the minds and mouths of everyone via legislation - criminalizing belief in God.

That's all this "hate" crime bill represents - hatred for God.

 

[Subdood]

Proverbs 14:34 Righteousness exalts a nation,
but sin is a reproach to any people.

 

[Yarddog]

One concern is that a pastor could be arrested if he preaches a sermon against homosexuality that could be tied to a hate crime.

In what way? Preaching that the Bible teaches that it is a sin, does not comes anywhere close to meeting the standards for a hate crime. Now if they start telling their congregation to beat, kill, destroy their property, etc... then maybe. But they wouldn't be very good pastors if they did that. But then, would be be illegal for them to do that to others as well.

It's a good bill.

 

[Yarddog]

"Hate" crime?

This is a horrific bill illegitimately born of a pernicious, insidious evil.

In all Marxist countries it's a crime to hold dissenting opinions about Marxism or about their beliefs/policies - just as it's a crime to "be" someone they capriciously happen not to "like." "Hate" crime is, on its face - complete hypocrisy.

The homosexual lobby is being used by Marxists to promote their agenda to make it a crime to believe in God. Marxism - itself a pernicous form of satanism - is intent on eradicating God from the minds and mouths of everyone via legislation - criminalizing belief in God.

That's all this "hate" crime bill represents - hatred for God.

That's funny.

 

[lux et lex]

Perhaps some can't read the article that is posted. Let me quote a couple things...

"Supporters countered that prosecution could occur only when bodily injury is involved, and no minister or protester could be targeted for expressing opposition to homosexuality"

"...defined hate crimes as those carried out on the basis of race, color, religion or national origin."

Hmm. So those who are against hate crime legislation don't have a leg to stand on when it comes to preaching/speaking out against homosexuals (the first amendment protects this, you know). If you're so against it, would you be willing to lobby to remove all categories of hate crimes, even if this opened it up to lesser sentences and no consideration for religiously based crimes (as an example)?

 

[bdolack]

Here is an article I wrote for a local newspaper back in July:

[FONT=&quot]How "hate crimes" legislation affects you[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Warner "against discrimination"; Webb doesn't respond[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]An analysis of S. 909[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Consider this scenario: You head to Ridgeview Park to pick up your six-year-old son who's attending a birthday party there. When you arrive, you discover--to your horror--that he isn't with the other kids. Somehow he's slipped away.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Frantically, you begin searching while another parent notifies the police. And then you find him, standing behind some bushes with a man.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Now, this man hasn't touched your son yet but if you arrived just a few minutes later... you shudder to think what would have happened.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]"Get away from my son now, you pervert, or I'll kill you!" you scream at the stranger.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Guess what? Under S. 909--the Mathew Shepard Hate Crimes Prevention Act--you have just committed federal felony... a hate crime. And the stranger? Since he hasn't touched your son, even though you and the police know exactly what he would have done if you hadn't arrived in time, he'll walk.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]And, thanks to Senators across the nation—like our own Mark Warner—the above nightmare may very well become true.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]“Specifically, with respect to Senator Kennedy’s bill [S. 909], I believe we should do everything we can to provide local, state, and federal law enforcement the resources necessary to investigate and prosecute the perpetrators of these crimes,” Warner wrote in response to a letter I sent him expressing my concerns over the bill.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]At least Warner responded; Senator Jim Webb failed to answer a request for his position.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]S. 909 targets perpetrators of “hate crimes” who assault or threaten someone based on sexual orientation.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The way the bill is written, including the version that passed the House of Representatives, it protects pedophiles and others who practice what is normally considered deviant behavior. During committee debate in the House, a simple amendment was offered: “The term sexual orientation as used in this act or any amendments to this act does not include pedophilia.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]That amendment was shot down by a party line vote, the Democrats on the committee choosing to give federal protection to pedophiles.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Louie Gohmert, a Republican Congressman from Texas, stated that “when the legislature has the chance to include a definition and refuses, then what [judges] look at is the plain meaning of those words. The plain meaning of sexual orientation is anything to which someone is [sexually] oriented. That could include exhibitionism, it could include necrophilia [sexual arousal or activity with a corpse] … it could include urophilia [ sexual arousal associated with urine], voyeurism.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Judges will have no choice but to interpret the law to say these deviant behaviors are federally protected classes of people, says Gohmert, because the Democrats specifically refuse to define the term “sexual orientation.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Republicans in the House also offered an amendment that would include U.S. military veterans for protection when they are attacked for their service, but Democrats unanimously voted down the amendment.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The scope of the law actually goes far beyond prosecuting a person police claim committed a hate crime. Many opponents of the law believe it will eventually be used to silence any opposition to homosexual acts, especially by Christian pastors.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]It’s said that if a pastor preaches directly from the Bible on homosexuality, then someone who heard or read that sermon commits a hate crime, the pastor can be charged as an accessory. That would be an unconstitutional burden on our First Amendment rights to free speech and religion.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]It is critical that S. 909 be defeated in the Senate because President Obama has already announced that he will sign the legislation if passed. To let Senator Warner or Webb know you oppose S. 909, call the United States Capitol switchboard at (202) 224-3121 and ask for either office.[/FONT]

 

[bdolack]

Perhaps some can't read the article that is posted. Let me quote a couple things...

"Supporters countered that prosecution could occur only when bodily injury is involved, and no minister or protester could be targeted for expressing opposition to homosexuality"

"...defined hate crimes as those carried out on the basis of race, color, religion or national origin."

Hmm. So those who are against hate crime legislation don't have a leg to stand on when it comes to preaching/speaking out against homosexuals (the first amendment protects this, you know). If you're so against it, would you be willing to lobby to remove all categories of hate crimes, even if this opened it up to lesser sentences and no consideration for religiously based crimes (as an example)?

It doesn't matter one iota what supporters say the bill will do; what matters are the wording of the bill and past court interpretation of similar wording.

I have studied this bill thoroughly as part of my job. It will do a lot more than its supporters let on.

 

[Subdood]

That's funny.

Sick sense of humor...

 

[MrJDSmith]

Sick sense of humor...

no it appears quite healthy.

 

[GQ Chris]

so I see happening in the near future is that Pastors will be getting arrested for preaching that homosexuality is a sin?

 

[Yarddog]

so I see happening in the near future is that Pastors will be getting arrested for preaching that homosexuality is a sin?

Not a very good prophet are you?