has...

[hisbloodformysins]

Has anyone here moved on and can say they are "blessed" after their divorce with a great and successful relationship? I am skeptical.

HB

 

[DZoolander]

I can - yep.

I met my first wife at 19, and we were together until I was 28. Then for a lot of reasons (not really relevant here) - I divorced her.

To an extent - I viewed my first relationship as a relationship of circumstance...meaning...we started dating...took steps that would be like a lasting relationship (when we ought to have really thought it out beforehand or at some point during the time before getting married)...and stayed together most likely because we thought it was the right thing to do.

After going through my divorce - I decided that I was not going to make that mistake again. At 29 years old - I had the dating experience of an 18 year old... and truthfully...maybe not even that. She was one of the first people I ever really dated.

I wasn't going to get into another "serious" relationship until I had been in quite a few - and had really sampled the field. When I would eventually get into another one - it would be a real choice. I wasn't going to just evolve into a relationship because I was hanging out with someone all the time...which it seemed like a lot of people do.

So, I took a sabatical for about a year and a half...then started casually dating. I broke up with a number of women that were perfectly fine - and a couple of them probably would've made great wives - simply because I "wasn't done yet".

I dated around for about 3-4 years...broke up with a number of women...got to experience the whole dating life...got to know the various personality types/discovering what clicked with me - and then finally met my wife. At first I really had no intentions with her - but she really grew on me - and the decision felt right.

I had lots of weird little rules when I was dating people. I'm not spending the night at your house - and you're not spending the night at mine. In fact - when we go out - I'm going to your place - you're not coming to mine. That way I can rest assured that no-one is ever "too tired" to go home. I always went home.

That wasn't for any religious or pious reasons. I simply didn't want her stuff migrating over to my house, or my stuff migrating over to her house. I didn't want her "nesting" - because truth be known - I'm don't intend to know her in anymore 3-4 months - and that's my plan.

Sounds kinda crappy in a way - but ya know - I really had an aversion to ending up with "the next" girl that I dated. I wasn't going to make that mistake twice. When I eventually ended up with someone else - I wanted it to be for the right reasons. I wanted it to be because we truly clicked and I truly loved her. I wanted to discover that. I didn't want to just happen into it.

Lots of people end up in crappy situations - one after another...and I think it's because they *don't* take the time to really figure things out. They were attracted to a dirtbag to begin with...that's who they're attracted to next time as well. Same behavior - different face.

So, yeah, I think it's definitely possible. I think my wife absolutely rocks. My only advice to anyone going through it - though - is take some time to really figure out what you did to contribute to the first situation (who you were attracted to/etc) - and don't make those same mistakes again.

Ya know?

 

[hisbloodformysins]

For some reason i'm drawn to the quiet types... but they cause me the biggest headaches.

 

[DZoolander]

Quiet, or withdrawn? From your other posts it seems that one of your major problems with your husband is how non-expressive he is. That to me would denote withdrawn.

I dunno. One doesn't really need to be gregarious to be expressive with how they feel - so I feel like a distinction ought to be drawn between the two.

 

[hisbloodformysins]

Yes, definitely withdrawn. but i didnt' know that when we were dating that he would be that way. What's interesting about it is that i was emotionally neglected by my mom as a child. We were in her hair, and she did drugs. She wanted us on our side of the house, and she on the other and sent us to bed early so she could stay up and party with her friends. When i felt hurt or unloved by her i'd try to tell her about it and her response was "the world doesn't revolve around you" and that was that. I was very depressed as a kid, but eventually i moved out when i was a teen to another state with extended family due to acting out and starting to drugs my self. It's interesting how i met and married someone who acts a lot like she did. Not into drugs, and he's a christian.

I even had a serious boyfriend when i was 16 who acted like that too, and he cheated on me. I'm coming to believe that most men act like that.

My husband and i are talking about seperating.. well i should say that i'm talking about seperating from him.. and he's trying to put a guilt trip on me like "i can't believe you'd be willing to walk out on the kids.. they need both parents". He knows better then that, that i wouldn't walk out on the kids, even if i do move to a different location. But my response to him was "you already walked out on our marriage a long time ago, and the kids don't need to see two people staying together just for the sake of 'what's right' when they are miserable. i want my kids to be happy and don't want them to think they have to stay in a marriage when they are so miserable"

HB

 

[DZoolander]

What did he have to say about that?

 

[hisbloodformysins]

He likes to psycho analyze me and tell me what my problem is. I just ignore him anymore, he's not a psychiatrist and i'm certainly not paying him for his opinion.

But I don't know if my issues with him are enough to get a divorce. But I find myself strongly discontent and could easily have an affair if the opportunity presented itself. I don't know if i want to go on like this anymore. But I don't want to necessarily divorce either. So i'm kind of sitting on it for a while.

 

[HuntingMan]

Has anyone here moved on and can say they are "blessed" after their divorce with a great and successful relationship? I am skeptical.

HB

Absolutely.
I was blessed the moment I left that marriage and got away from the abuse and cheating.
And I was blessed even more when I finally realized that God is all I need to be happy.
And I was blessed beyond measure when He brought Laura into my life and gave me more than I could have ever imagined for a wife and a marriage.

But with so many heartbroken brothers and sisters out there, I really dont like to talk about it much because I dont want to feel like Im rubbing salt in anyone elses wounds.

 

[eatenbylocusts]

He likes to psycho analyze me and tell me what my problem is. I just ignore him anymore, he's not a psychiatrist and i'm certainly not paying him for his opinion.

But I don't know if my issues with him are enough to get a divorce. But I find myself strongly discontent and could easily have an affair if the opportunity presented itself. I don't know if i want to go on like this anymore. But I don't want to necessarily divorce either. So i'm kind of sitting on it for a while.

You took a vow before God. Divorce should be something of last resort because you have tried everything and it is what needs to happen for the health and safety of the spouse or kids. I don't know how your husband is as a father, but my ex was cruel to both me and my son and I still found my 5 yr old crying out in my parent's backyard a few days after I left with my son.

You shouldn't be thinking about how you might find someone better, you should be thinking about how you can glorify God and be the best parent to your kids. Your next relationship would have problems too. Subsequent marriages don't have a good track record according to the surveys and you still need to figure out why this one isn't working. If you haven't recieved help from a licensed counselor I would urge you to try that asap.

I know a bad marriage can be painful, but I do believe that many (not all)can be saved if we were willing to put in the long, painful work and submit to God and spouses.

I separated more than 10 years ago and have been divorced for almost 6. Are you willing to possibly be single that long or longer? If you're not you should work on your marriage unless having a string of failed relationships is ok with you. It won't be ok with the kids.

 

[DZoolander]

I agree with Locusts to a large extent (but differ with her conclusion a little bit).

I'll start with where I differ...

While I do believe that any relationship can be saved - I believe that it takes an extraordinary set of circumstances that you will rarely ever see to save them. To truly save a relationship - both people have to legitimately want to address the issues that are causing them conflict - and both people must want to make the appropriate changes in order to achieve that.

You simply won't find that most often in the world.

Most likely, if your marriage sucks, it sucks because when left to their own devices, one (or both) partners is not acting like the other believes a married partner should. Most likely - it's because that's how they *like* to behave - and that's how they *want* to behave.

You're going to have a really hard time getting someone away from how they *want* to behave.

Sure, you can whine and moan, you can threaten to abandon them, etc... and to an extent...that might scare them into momentarily shifting their behaviors to accommodate you... But more often than naught, you'll find that once the threat goes away, so does the change.

For any change to be meaningful - you have to believe that they would've wanted to change that behavior regardless of outcome. Meaning...if they knew they could keep you...would they change regardless? If you can't say "yes"...then most likely...you're gonna get stuck with the same bad behavior for the rest of the time you're with that person. If you can't say "yes" - then their changes right now are simply an appeasment - meant to keep you around until you find it more difficult to leave again in the future. It's just a way to wear you down.

So, do I agree that change can happen? Yes. I've seen it before. Do I believe that it's reasonable to expect it will happen? No. Because I believe it's the overwhelming exception - rather than the rule. It ain't even close to 50/50. I'd say it's closer to 95/5.

Keep one simple rule in mind. People are how they are because they like being that way. They're used to it. They *want* to be that way. They *like* being that way. That's who they *are*. Unless you can see them obviously unhappy with it - regardless of the consequences of losing you - then most likely you ain't gonna see true change.

So, that's where I differ from her. I simply don't see any benefit from hoping that you're one of the 5% out there that might actually see change - and wrecking your life in the process. If you've tried - and it hasn't worked - it's safer to assume you're part of that 95% and plan accordingly.

That being said...

I think she's 100% right on the fact that people make bad decisions when it comes to future spouses. People *aren't* willing to spend the appropriate time being single...and they find themselves gravitating toward what they're familiar with...which most often are new dysfunctional relationships which mirror the last.

Their perspective gets in the way...and they get scared... "Wow - I'm going to spend years single??? What if I don't end up with someone else??? What if I don't end up with someone better?" blah blah. I remember those thoughts when I went through a divorce myself.

I guess that's where faith comes in.

You're going to spend the next 6 years regardless - in something. Personally - I'd rather spend that 6 years outside of a crappy relationship with the possibility existing that I'll find something happy (with the fear of the unknown) - than spend that 6 years with the certainty that it will suck (as will all of the subsequent years after that). To me - the potential for happiness (and risk involved) weighs preferable to the certainty that what I have sucks (and the "security" derived).

Ya know?

 

[eatenbylocusts]

While I do believe that any relationship can be saved - I believe that it takes an extraordinary set of circumstances that you will rarely ever see to save them. To truly save a relationship - both people have to legitimately want to address the issues that are causing them conflict - and both people must want to make the appropriate changes in order to achieve that.

You simply won't find that most often in the world.

I agree with you pretty much, but that doesn't make it right to throw in the towel. When do we start being obedient to God? Only when we're likely to succeed? Our pastor is always saying to do what you can and leave the impossible to God. A vow is a vow. Everything possible should be done to save the marriage because God hates divorce. There are four children involved and they didn't get to choose this situation.

Saving a miserable marriage is hard because it involves humility, submission and changing behavior, but it is still the right thing to do probably in most situations. I also don't believe people act a certain way because they like to do it that way; they act that way because it's a habit and it's too hard to change. I'm sure there are some people who get off on conflict and torturing people, but I don't think the majority act badly because they like to be miserable.

 

[DZoolander]

I agree with you pretty much, but that doesn't make it right to throw in the towel. When do we start being obedient to God? Only when we're likely to succeed? Our pastor is always saying to do what you can and leave the impossible to God. A vow is a vow. Everything possible should be done to save the marriage because God hates divorce. There are four children involved and they didn't get to choose this situation.

Saving a miserable marriage is hard because it involves humility, submission and changing behavior, but it is still the right thing to do probably in most situations. I also don't believe people act a certain way because they like to do it that way; they act that way because it's a habit and it's too hard to change. I'm sure there are some people who get off on conflict and torturing people, but I don't think the majority act badly because they like to be miserable.

I agree as well

I guess the question becomes - is there a point where it's fine to throw in the towel? Or - ought people to devote their entire lives to that vain hope? At what point do you cross that line?

 

[DZoolander]

When do we start being obedient to God? Only when we're likely to succeed?

...or put another way...What do we do when God shows us that it's obvious that we're going to fail? What obligation do we have to ourselves in light of a spouse that cares not?

 

[eatenbylocusts]

...or put another way...What do we do when God shows us that it's obvious that we're going to fail? What obligation do we have to ourselves in light of a spouse that cares not?

I have peace that I did all that I could do while praying for God's help in the matter also. I have no doubt that leaving was the best thing for my son and the dd who was to be born a few months after I left. That peace made my son's tears bearable. My ex "fired" each counselor after they told him something he didn't want to hear. I was willing to try again after 6 week disappearances twice. He showed me over and over that nothing was going to change and God was someone he wasn't willing to submit to. I had Biblical grounds to divorce, but I still was willing to try.

So my answer is to use the Bible as the guide; are there Biblical grounds to divorce, have you tried counseling, have you asked for prayer from safe people at church, are you desparately seeking God's direction and help in the matter which includes being willing to see if there are changes that you need to make in your own behavior? I guess what I picture in my mind is that at the time a decision to leave is made the person should have peace that everything has been tried and they are not in a state of feeling anger towards the spouse, but more of a feeling of sadness because the spouse chooses not to work on the relationship. By this time the spouse who is leaving will have faced what they have been doing to hurt the marriage and/or what they've been doing to not make it better; and have changed that behavior. The other spouse has had time to observe this behavior for some time and still chooses to neglect the marriage. Ideally a mentor would be involved and they can give feedback.

 

[hisbloodformysins]

I separated more than 10 years ago and have been divorced for almost 6. Are you willing to possibly be single that long or longer? If you're not you should work on your marriage unless having a string of failed relationships is ok with you. It won't be ok with the kids.

You have a lot of wisdom here and i'm trying to grasp it. I have been working on my marriage while miserable for 10 years. It was bad from day one, even worse then it is now. I have and do think long and hard about the decision because I take my vows before God very seriously.

I began to read ezoo's post but decided to respond to this one while fresh on my mind and want to finish and respond more fully to what he said as well.

What I read in his post this far hits on something that has been on my mind. I'll explain it this way, if I haven't already. I think of my mil, who has been unhappily married for 40 plus years. The whole time she has taken her vows seriously and has been hanging onto Jesus as I'd like to describe it. Sure, her husband is a little softer in heart... but things really haven't changed. I don't want to live that way. You know, there are no guarentees. Just because we are putting our hope in the lord does not guarentee that our spouse is going to change, or like ez said, wants to change. I don't want to live that way. I don't want to be in my 60's and still hoping and praying for happiness in my married life.

I have and do consider what you said it, it's a very good point. Would I be content staying single when/if I leave my husband? This is something I think about a lot lately... I've concluded that I don't want to do it simply so I can be with another person, as a matter of fact I don't know if I ever could find happiness in another person. I think I would be ok to be myself. But as of right now in and of myself, I don't think I have the courage to divorce on my own. It is an extremely difficulty thing to do in so many aspects. Actually, I know that I can do it, I know I have the courage to do it, I just don't know if i'm ready to do it just yet. All these things go through my mind. If you'll allow me to elaborate, this is kind of therapeutic for me.

When I consider seperation, i reflect on all the time whether consciencly or subconsciencly I am always hoping my marriage will end somehow.. that i'll have the courage to get a divorce, what my life my be like without my husband in it. Part of me wants him to be unfaithful so that he'll leave me. I think of having an affair as a salvation in a way becaue that'll give me more motive to leave my husband.. in one way or another, i'll always stressed, majorly and unhappy because of my marriage. And i'll be honest with you, i think i've stuck it out longer then 90% of christians would have in my situation.

Part of me doesn't want to divorce.. and i have to ask why because in my mind it has to be for the right reasons.. because even though i'm unhappy, i'm safe in a lot of different ways, i'm comfortable, this is familiar.. what about the fear of being alone and starting my life over again at age thirty, and hurting my husband and how it'll effect the kids because no matter how hard you try to make a normal life for the afterwards they will always be shorted from having a family to belong to consisting of their biological mommy and daddy who's love for them can be unmatched. Instead they are "fit" into a new family structure that really isnn't their's and out of place.

I realize that seperating from my husband will break me and rip me apart just like it will other people in my life because of the damage I'd be causing everyone. But then again, if I continue to stay in this marriage what will it do to my soul? I will forever be discontent. Because I have been obediant to the lord and trusting in the lord and really making effort continously to work on my heart and my marriage.. .for 10 years! And after a certain amount of time one loses heart, they lose hope. They realize that even though the lord loves them and is faithful, there is no guarentee that their spouse will ever have a change of heart.

I live a false world... always regretting that i don't feel whole in my marriage.. that everyone around me is living their lives, loving eachother wholy.. and i'm always pretending but inside have a whole and feel so unhappy... always having to deal with my hearts natural desire to be happy. I've read books, i've tried counseling, i'm on anti-depressants. My husband is not willing to go to counseling. And the thing is that right now he is being real nice to me and trying to be there for me and being sensitive to me, but like EZ mentioned, how long will it last??

In my experience with my husband, it is only temporary, maybe a couple of months at the most because he loses his desire to treat me that way and goes back to his old careless ways. I've had enough. I don't have hope anymore but rather a realization that things are just never going to change and i need to be happy. For my kids. Yeah, i'll have to suffer the consequences of my children suffering consequences because of my decision. I really don't want that. But I can't live my whole life for my kids. One of these days they are going to grow up and move out then it'll be me and my husband then.. and we would definetly get a divorce then because it won't be the kids holding us together anymore. Why wait another 20 years when i've lived half my life time? Why not just make the break and get it over with? I also think i would be a better mom if i was happier because sometimes there's a trickle effect that when mom and dad aren't living in happy matrimony, the kids get the brunt of it. Despite our best intentions.

So yeah, i've put a lot of thought into this and i still am. At this time i am not ready to divorce.. but i'm still in the stage of counting the cost and evaluating everything that makes my marriage. The love that really is there.. and what it's worth and what can be done and so forth.

Thanks for your time.

HB

 

[hisbloodformysins]

I agree with Locusts to a large extent (but differ with her conclusion a little bit).

I'll start with where I differ...

While I do believe that any relationship can be saved - I believe that it takes an extraordinary set of circumstances that you will rarely ever see to save them. To truly save a relationship - both people have to legitimately want to address the issues that are causing them conflict - and both people must want to make the appropriate changes in order to achieve that.

You simply won't find that most often in the world.

Most likely, if your marriage sucks, it sucks because when left to their own devices, one (or both) partners is not acting like the other believes a married partner should. Most likely - it's because that's how they *like* to behave - and that's how they *want* to behave.

You're going to have a really hard time getting someone away from how they *want* to behave.

Sure, you can whine and moan, you can threaten to abandon them, etc... and to an extent...that might scare them into momentarily shifting their behaviors to accommodate you... But more often than naught, you'll find that once the threat goes away, so does the change.

For any change to be meaningful - you have to believe that they would've wanted to change that behavior regardless of outcome. Meaning...if they knew they could keep you...would they change regardless? If you can't say "yes"...then most likely...you're gonna get stuck with the same bad behavior for the rest of the time you're with that person. If you can't say "yes" - then their changes right now are simply an appeasment - meant to keep you around until you find it more difficult to leave again in the future. It's just a way to wear you down.

So, do I agree that change can happen? Yes. I've seen it before. Do I believe that it's reasonable to expect it will happen? No. Because I believe it's the overwhelming exception - rather than the rule. It ain't even close to 50/50. I'd say it's closer to 95/5.

Keep one simple rule in mind. People are how they are because they like being that way. They're used to it. They *want* to be that way. They *like* being that way. That's who they *are*. Unless you can see them obviously unhappy with it - regardless of the consequences of losing you - then most likely you ain't gonna see true change.

So, that's where I differ from her. I simply don't see any benefit from hoping that you're one of the 5% out there that might actually see change - and wrecking your life in the process. If you've tried - and it hasn't worked - it's safer to assume you're part of that 95% and plan accordingly.

That being said...

I think she's 100% right on the fact that people make bad decisions when it comes to future spouses. People *aren't* willing to spend the appropriate time being single...and they find themselves gravitating toward what they're familiar with...which most often are new dysfunctional relationships which mirror the last.

Their perspective gets in the way...and they get scared... "Wow - I'm going to spend years single??? What if I don't end up with someone else??? What if I don't end up with someone better?" blah blah. I remember those thoughts when I went through a divorce myself.

I guess that's where faith comes in.

You're going to spend the next 6 years regardless - in something. Personally - I'd rather spend that 6 years outside of a crappy relationship with the possibility existing that I'll find something happy (with the fear of the unknown) - than spend that 6 years with the certainty that it will suck (as will all of the subsequent years after that). To me - the potential for happiness (and risk involved) weighs preferable to the certainty that what I have sucks (and the "security" derived).

Ya know?

What can I say except that it's obvious you know what you are talking about, you've been there and done that and I completely agree with it, thanks for the affirmation!

As far as being single afterwards and those fears, i already have those fears.. so i know what you are saying. I agree that it's wise to wait. But my question is... how do we really know who the right person would be for us? All that we have to go on is our understanding.. or we try to find someone oposite that person just to find out that even on the complete opposite spectrum there are hang ups that you didn't know about. And when we grow, our needs change i think.

I don't want to get married again just to eventually grow discontent. I do fear the statitics of how successful remarriage is... statitics show that once a person divorces, they are far more likely to do it again, and again. I don't believe that there is any person who will be all bliss and a marriage that won't require effort.. but i fear that once i divorce.. i'll be a lot more likely to prematurely quit, if that makes any sense.

people need to be happy. They need to make effort as well. I'm having to come to conclusions. Thanks for sharing.

HB

 

[hisbloodformysins]

I have peace that I did all that I could do while praying for God's help in the matter also. I have no doubt that leaving was the best thing for my son and the dd who was to be born a few months after I left. That peace made my son's tears bearable. My ex "fired" each counselor after they told him something he didn't want to hear. I was willing to try again after 6 week disappearances twice. He showed me over and over that nothing was going to change and God was someone he wasn't willing to submit to. I had Biblical grounds to divorce, but I still was willing to try.

So my answer is to use the Bible as the guide; are there Biblical grounds to divorce, have you tried counseling, have you asked for prayer from safe people at church, are you desparately seeking God's direction and help in the matter which includes being willing to see if there are changes that you need to make in your own behavior? I guess what I picture in my mind is that at the time a decision to leave is made the person should have peace that everything has been tried and they are not in a state of feeling anger towards the spouse, but more of a feeling of sadness because the spouse chooses not to work on the relationship. By this time the spouse who is leaving will have faced what they have been doing to hurt the marriage and/or what they've been doing to not make it better; and have changed that behavior. The other spouse has had time to observe this behavior for some time and still chooses to neglect the marriage. Ideally a mentor would be involved and they can give feedback.

I agree

 

[hisbloodformysins]

I guess where i'm at right now while evaluating my marriage is that i'm waiting for my husband to quit acting... i guess tha's all the ammo i need to move on.

At this point my staying with him is very conditional, whether he realizes it or not, though i have told him that i'm kind of waiting to see how bad he wants me. Because if he's done.. there's no point in carrying on.

I already have a plan. I'm going to call a lawyer and get some legal advice.. see where i need to go from there.. already have a list of questions that i'll attempt to work out with my husband... and if i need to, once i get out from under the mortgage if he insists on keeping the house... which at this point he then, then i'll start looking for another place to live. All these plans are conditional of course upon what the lawyer has to say.

HB

 

[DZoolander]

lol - well - I find that when I discuss marriage with my fellow Christians - a lot of them understand my point of view - but a lot think that it goes against scripture. I suppose - from a fundie standpoint - I can see why.

To be honest - I could probably shut them down in argument by claiming (truthfully) that my wife was unfaithful...and therefore I had license to leave. However, in a lot of respects, delving into that to "justify" my decision seems kind of like a cop out. I'm not interested (really) in discussing my previous marriage...except in the context of how it relates to people that are also going through bad situations. In a sense - it feels to me that if I started talking about infidelity in my own situation - then it becomes solely about me - and what about people that are going through equally bad situations...where the spouse *hasn't* taken that step? Ought they to sit there and wait it out until it does happen - or get stuck in a horrible situation simply because that one line hasn't been crossed yet?

For example - ought someone to feel that they are doing wrong by leaving/divorcing/moving on with their life from an abusive spouse - simply because he hasn't put his penis in someone else yet? My honest gut feeling is "no" - however - if you listen to most of people's advice - that's what God wants you to do.

...and I disagree.

It seems we have this propensity to tell each other that you ought to be willing to martyr yourself at the hands of your spouse. I just can't accept that as being true. Your spouse is the only person in this world that has made an oath *not* to be like that to you. What do you envision that to be? Some sort of cruel Godly irony or something?

It seems to me that we have this propensity to tell each other that wanting to leave because your spouse is being a dirtbag somehow means you lack resolve - or that you lack fortitude. That you're just running because things got "tough". Once again - I couldn't disagree more. I have never met anyone that got a divorce because things got "tough". Every person I ever knew that got a divorce did it because their partner was intentionally and carelessly *making* things rough - intentionally so - for their own selfish desires in spite of their spouse. That's not the same thing.

I would undergo anything for my spouse. But I will not subject myself to anything my spouse wants to throw at me. I would willingly put my hand over a flame and allow myself to be burned if it meant my spouse would be better off for it. I would not allow her to grab my hand it put it over the flame. That's how I see it. In one - you're self sacrificing for the sake of being "together". The other - you're allowing your spouse to willfully harm you. I see a distinction there. One is Godly - the other is not...IMHO.

I think those are important distinctions...and I don't think people take those things into account. Most often - IMHO - we lump it all together - and I think that it is unfair to the person involved.

What to do with that...I don't know. Divorce is a tricky subject. Like people have pointed out - divorcing does not guarantee future happiness. Lots of people simply don't have it in them to have enough faith *in themselves* to also look at why they make the choices they do - and choose differently in the future. Lots of times - people get attracted to the same things in other people - and remarriage is simply just a matter of substituting a new face for the same crappy behaviors that made them leave the first one. The statistics for remarriage ain't good - like people have said. Often it's just a matter of finding a new person to eventually aquiesce to - just like you would've done if you'd stayed with the first person...and often they end up just as unhappy in the long run.

I believe all of those things to be true.

So - what to do? I dunno. It really varies person to person. What I believe - however - is that people need the right context to understand things in - so they can make their decisions accordingly.

 

[hisbloodformysins]

That is wise and true!

I want to be with my spouse for the right reasons, not because i feel like i have to. And if i eventually divorce him, i want it to be for the right reasons.. for myself. I have to be willing to be real about the real reasons.. and not simply find something to blame him for, but be willing to take responsibility for my unhappiness.

Like I can say that it wasn't fair for me to marry him in the first place. I didn't love him then, i wanted to love him but didn't. I can say that although he is the way he is... it doesn't necessarily make him a bad person, just not a good fit. I can't continue to beat myself up because I don't have the "character" to be happy with him being the way he is. I am not the supportive spouse that is ok with him working long hours like some women are and like he expects me to be. I am not able to feel loved even though he doesn't affirm me, some women just understand that about their men.. that they don't need their men to tell them or ever talk to them about it, they just know and understand. I am not that woman. I need some kind of affirmation, at least from him, because i have lots of doubts about it.

We actually talked about that last night. I realize a lot of my problem is low self esteem. I am always seeking validation from him and he usually just gets mad at me and refuses to give it. I told him last night that i feel bad about myself right now basically because i'm over weight.. i am trying to lose weight but it doesn't happen over night... anyways, i explained how i think when he does different behaviors, and he was actually open and told me he was glad we had that conversation... that it helped him understand me better... i've always tried to tell him that same thing before.. i don't know why he got it now.. if it's because he's open to it or because of the way i went about it ... i don't know... but that's off the topic.

I'm willing to say, if i did divorce him that yeah, he's a good guy.. not a scum bag like a lot of other men... he doesn't cheat on me that i know of (though i could bring up something to make him look bad, but i won't- because like ez i'm not out to get other people's approval by doing that). even though he did something that is like cheating, that's not my real reasons and i won't get any satisfaction by simply making him look bad here. He isn't abusive unless you consider neglect and carelessness abusive. He's a good dad. I'm just not happy. And I have to take responsibility for my needs and accept and love myself and be realistic about everything.

When we are willing to be real and open about ourselves about our needs and how we truly feel.... then when someone points it out or tries to expose it later... it won't be a shock or something that we have to defend... because we're already aware of it and have accepted it.

If someone says to me "you're being selfish" I can say "yes, I am". If they say "you are hurting your family" I can say "yeah, you're right, and I feel real sad about that". It doesn't matter what they try to accuse me of or throw at me, because i've already faced it all and worked it out myself.

I don't know what i'll end up doing.. it just feels good to be in this place. The lord knows what the outcome will be.

Thanks for listening.

HB