Harris’ plan to stop price gouging could create more problems than it solves

[BPPLEE]

Reich is what he is, an expert with lots of policy experience, and an economist who presents the view of the left wing of the Democratic Party.

Calling Reich a hack is meaningless and probably redundant for you, since you would likely all left-wing policy spokesmen as hacks.

No, just the really short ones

 

[BPPLEE]

Please review the effect of Nixon's price caps. Price caps are highly inflationary.

I’m in agreement

 

[iluvatar5150]

Price caps cause prices to be raised on other items, to make up for the loss.

If Item B goes up instead of Item A in response to price controls on Item A, that’s not inflationary; it’s just an ineffective policy. I have no issues with the claim that price controls don’t work.

fair enough

Are you saying that we should ignore what she is saying other than that these are the usual empty campaign promises trying to fix a problem important to voters?

I’m saying we should wait until she lays out some kind of plan.

 

[iluvatar5150]

Reich is what he is, an expert with lots of policy experience, and an economist who presents the view of the left wing of the Democratic Party.

Calling Reich a hack is meaningless and probably redundant for you, since you would likely all left-wing policy spokesmen as hacks.

He's not an economist. It's more accurate to say that he worked in (among other things) economic policy.

 

[BPPLEE]

He's not an economist. It's more accurate to say that he worked in (among other things) economic policy.

He’s a best selling author, worked in the cabinets of 4 presidents, teaches at a university and is very left leaning.

 

[iluvatar5150]

He’s a best selling author, worked in the cabinets of 4 presidents, teaches at a university and is very left leaning.

I'm familiar. I think it's probably too far to call him a "hack", but some of the stuff of his I've seen floating around Facebook kind of leans that way.

 

[BPPLEE]

If Item B goes up instead of Item A in response to price controls on Item A, that’s not inflationary; it’s just an ineffective policy. I have no issues with the claim that price controls don’t work.


I’m saying we should wait until she lays out some kind of plan.

@public hermit posted an article about it and it mainly dealt with the beef industry.

 

[iluvatar5150]

@public hermit posted an article about it and it mainly dealt with the beef industry.

Not in this thread they didn't.

 

[BPPLEE]

Not in this thread they didn't.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/harris-to-propose-federal-ban-on-price-gouging-9def888b

 

[iluvatar5150]

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/harris-to-propose-federal-ban-on-price-gouging-9def888b

Still pretty light on details.

I'm happy with the FTC cracking down on monopolies, in theory, but what I've seen of their efforts in tech has left me underwhelmed.

 

[Aldebaran]

If you want to cut farm subsidies, I'll gladly lock arms with you, but good luck getting that past the farmers and their politicians from the midwest.

Don't worry. There are now fewer farmers around here. Those subsidies clearly haven't been enough to allow them to stick around.
An Investigate Midwest analysis of census data found Wisconsin was hit particularly hard, suffering a nearly 4% decline in farmland, equivalent to 533,952 acres. It also lost roughly one in 10 farms and nearly one in three dairy farms between 2017 and 2022.

Ag Census Shows Midwest Farms Face Steeper Challenges

Every Midwest state other than Iowa lost farms from 2017 to 2022, according to the USDA Ag Census.

www.dtnpf.com

 

[HARK!]

Don't worry. There are now fewer farmers around here. Those subsidies clearly haven't been enough to allow them to stick around.
An Investigate Midwest analysis of census data found Wisconsin was hit particularly hard, suffering a nearly 4% decline in farmland, equivalent to 533,952 acres. It also lost roughly one in 10 farms and nearly one in three dairy farms between 2017 and 2022.

A dwindling supply of product, in a growing population, will drive up competition quickly.

I'll break this down into simple terms for those who might find this concept difficult to understand.

You're on an island. There are only enough meals to feed 9 people per day. There are 10 people on the island. Let the bidding for the food begin. You'll pay whatever you have to stay alive; and the guy who accepts the highest bidder's offer isn't gouging.

When Biden's wars kick into full swing you'll see a greater hike in food prices, not only because of the inflation (as our military expenditures are made with 100% borrowed money) but historically wars have put a strain on the productivity of agriculture.

That said, even at this time, the military is making record storable food purchases.

 

[Always in His Presence]

When did the government get the power to dictate how much a company can earn?

 

[HARK!]

Food prices, controlled by a handful of megacorps

Well since it's only a handful; maybe you can name them, and tell me what food prices they are controlling.

At the produce market, every morning the local farmers bring their produce, and the local food retailers begin the bidding for what lots of produce that they want for their stores or store chains.

At the seafood market, every morning the local fishermen bring their catches that they caught that morning, and the local food retailers begin the bidding for what lots of seafood that they want for their stores or store chains.

How do these alleged "megacorps" control what local retailers will bid?

 

[mark46]

He's not an economist. It's more accurate to say that he worked in (among other things) economic policy.

worked in?

He's not an economist. It's more accurate to say that he worked in (among other things) economic policy.

Reich has taught economic policy, but he does not have a PHD in Economics.

"he worked in economic policy"?

His background competence and experience are a bit more than that. He has been a primary spokesman in economic policy for the last four Democratic presidents.

Robert Reich - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[mark46]

If Item B goes up instead of Item A in response to price controls on Item A, that’s not inflationary; it’s just an ineffective policy. I have no issues with the claim that price controls don’t work.


I’m saying we should wait until she lays out some kind of plan.

You mean like Hillary Clinton did? If you want plans, they will be in the platform passed in a couple of days and soon forgotten. The president has little influence on the issues that she is addressing, certainly without Congress.

What we have gotten is what it is more important. We have seen her approach to the economic problems of our day.
=======
To be clear, I am fine that these pronouncements mean very little. These comments are economic nonsense and petty campaign pandering. Thankfully, that's all they are. BTW, if the president could do these things, Biden would have done them.

There is much to be done, but most requires legislation. Much can be done with government-business partnerships, but those are primarily local and already happening.
========

 

[iluvatar5150]

worked in?

Reich has taught economic policy, but he does not have a PHD in Economics.

"he worked in economic policy"?

His background competence and experience are a bit more than that. He has been a primary spokesman in economic policy for the last four Democratic presidents.

Robert Reich - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Right, he’s a policy guy. There’s a difference between a scientist and somebody who specializes in science policy. Likewise, there’s a difference between an economist and someone who specializes in economic policy.

 

[mark46]

HIGH FOOD PRICES
If you wish to lower food prices, then go to the sources of much of the high prices.

1) Unavailability of labor
We need hundreds of thousands more of legal workers. It is ridiculous for those in the Northeast and Northwest to import apples from Chile, South Africa and Mexico instead of picking apples in NY and Washington state. BTW, Washington orchards have offerred $25 an hour or more, focusing on college students with almost ZERO takers.

2) Cost of labor
I remember when farmers in California were forced to pay a somewhat reasonable wage to their workers. Prices went up. I've fine with that. I don't want folks working for $4 an hour so that I can have cheaper produce.

3) Transportation costs
These costs have gone way up, primarily because of lack of truck drivers, and the need to pay them more.

4) Agricultural subsidies
By their nature, these subsidies are inflationary. Are we willing to save some farmers by artificially increasing and stabilizing prices. Probably we are.

IF THERE IS CORPORATE GREED
Buy another product. Shop in another store. Have federal actions against any price fixing. The answer is NOT government interferences with market prices. [Note that there are "grocery deserts', greatly underserved areas where a local store can charge much more than elsewhere. The answer is to stimulate competition by providing grants to those who would open local stores and co-ops. Government price limits and profit limits are not the answer.

If the government wants the profitable companies to make less, the answer (a poor one" is an excess profits tax, or even higher corporate taxes at the top brackets. This is so much better than interfering with the open market for goods and services.

HOUSING
House prices are too high. OK. So the Harris answer is to give new buyers $25K each to spend. It takes a special kind of economic analysis to believe that this will bring prices DOWN.

Rent control limits on large corporate owners. The devil is in the details.

 

[BPPLEE]

HIGH FOOD PRICES
If you wish to lower food prices, then go to the sources of much of the high prices.

1) Unavailability of labor
We need hundreds of thousands more of legal workers. It is ridiculous for those in the Northeast and Northwest to import apples from Chile, South Africa and Mexico instead of picking apples in NY and Washington state. BTW, Washington orchards have offerred $25 an hour or more, focusing on college students with almost ZERO takers.

2) Cost of labor
I remember when farmers in California were forced to pay a somewhat reasonable wage to their workers. Prices went up. I've fine with that. I don't want folks working for $4 an hour so that I can have cheaper produce.

3) Transportation costs
These costs have gone way up, primarily because of lack of truck drivers, and the need to pay them more.

4) Agricultural subsidies
By their nature, these subsidies are inflationary. Are we willing to save some farmers by artificially increasing and stabilizing prices. Probably we are.

IF THERE IS CORPORATE GREED
Buy another product. Shop in another store. Have federal actions against any price fixing. The answer is NOT government interferences with market prices. [Note that there are "grocery deserts', greatly underserved areas where a local store can charge much more than elsewhere. The answer is to stimulate competition by providing grants to those who would open local stores and co-ops. Government price limits and profit limits are not the answer.

If the government wants the profitable companies to make less, the answer (a poor one" is an excess profits tax, or even higher corporate taxes at the top brackets. This is so much better than interfering with the open market for goods and services.

HOUSING
House prices are too high. OK. So the Harris answer is to give new buyers $25K each to spend. It takes a special kind of economic analysis to believe that this will bring prices DOWN.

Rent control limits on large corporate owners. The devil is in the details.

You forgot energy.

 

[Ana the Ist]

https://www.cnn.com/2024/08/16/business/harris-price-gouging-ban-inflation?cid=ios_app

Food prices have surged by more than 20% under the Biden-Harris administration, leaving many voters eager to stretch their dollars further at the grocery store.

On Friday, Vice President Kamala Harris said she has a solution: a federal ban on price gouging across the food industry.

“My plan will include new penalties for opportunistic companies that exploit crises and break the rules,” Harris said at a campaign event.

There’s just one issue: Harris’ proposal could create more problems than the one it’s trying to solve, some economists say.

Of course it could....really depends upon the whole way it's done.

It won't be done though....those companies she's threatening are funding her.