Hannah's prayer

[Paidiske]

Those questions are all valid, but at this point I was only asking about gender equality.

 

[Dave-W]

Those questions are all valid, but at this point I was only asking about gender equality.

OK.

Reform and Reconstructionist Judaism both say yes. But IMO they do it by not truly following the scriptures.

Orthodox and chassidic Judaism say no. Conservative Judaism tries to strike a middle ground between the 2 camps.

Messianic Judaism has the unique position understanding Torah needs to be applied THRU the New Covenant. As we are a fairly young movement, that is still being worked out as to what it looks like; so it remains a question.

IOW there is no easy answer to that question.

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

Hannah's 3rd prophetic statement within the prayer was ~ Exaltation of the poor to inherit glory

1 Samuel 2:8
He raises the poor from the dust
and lifts the needy from the ash heap;
he seats them with princes
and has them inherit a throne of honor.
“For the foundations of the earth are the Lord’s;
on them he has set the world.

From the old testament and from the new there are cross-references. Amazing the depth of Hannah's knowledge of God's ways. It makes me wonder what the common person of God's nation at that time knew about His ways ... was Hannah an exception or the norm?

Daniel 4:17
'The observers gave this command; the holy ones declared the sentence. This is so all people may know that the Most High God rules over every kingdom on earth. God gives those kingdoms to anyone he wants, and he chooses people to rule them who are not proud.'

Revelation 7:3
He said to them, "Do not harm the land or the sea or the trees until we mark with a sign the foreheads of the people who serve our God."

 

[Dave-W]

From the old testament and from the new there are cross-references. Amazing the depth of Hannah's knowledge of God's ways. It makes me wonder what the common person of God's nation at that time knew about His ways ... was Hannah an exception or the norm?

The high priest and his sons excepted, most of the priesthood was doing a pretty good job of educating the people at that time. Elkana was a Levite so he would have been around the priests on a regular basis.

IMO all of those things added up to her knowledge of God.

 

[FreeinChrist]

MOD HAT

This thread was moved from Egalitarian Christians to Deeper Fellowship as requested.

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

This is like musical chairs. The request was made and cancelled. I have much to say and nowhere to say it so until then ... it's like Purple Haze ... everyone still keeps clamoring for the same ole songs and the new ones never get played. It's rather funny.
(unties threads holding one back)

 

[gideon123]

There is a very rare wisdom in Hannah's prayer. It is a prayer of gratitude and adoration. The prayer 'defeats' the conventional wisdom of human - including our tendencies to analyse and debate. I believe this prayer was truly inspired by God.

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

Hannah's 4th prophetic statement was when she spoke of God protecting the saints.

1 Samuel 2:9
He will guard the feet of his faithful servants,
but the wicked will be silenced in the place of darkness.
“It is not by strength that one prevails;​

It's not by strength that one prevails .. when Christ empowers a saint for ministry He empowers that person both outwardly and inwardly. A soldier in any army is equipted for everything needed. As so also with the Lord. He supplies the equipting.

Jude 1:20-23 mentions things we must endeavor but Jude 1:24 says it's only the Lord who can keep us from stumbling.

1 Timothy 1:12
I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who gave me strength, because he trusted me and gave me this work of serving him.
Jude 1:24
God is strong and can help you not to fall. He can bring you before his glory without any wrong in you and can give you great joy.​

Hannah was exemplary as a women of powerful prayer. Her supplication was given in quite communion, but her praise was from the rooftops!

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

Hannah's 5th prophesy:
1 Samuel 2:10
those who oppose the Lord will be broken.
The Most High will thunder from heaven;
the Lord will judge the ends of the earth.
“He will give strength to his king
and exalt the horn of his anointed.”

God will judge the world.
Hannah understood what God was all about.

And God used her. Not just to fulfill the desires of her heart but to fulfill the desires of His heart too, and to bring in a new priesthood. One of the Nazirite vow. Numbers 6:2 Hannah also was an avowed Nazarite and God used her cooperation to accomplish His own desires.

Hannah lent Samuel to the service of the Lord much the same as God lent His Son to be of service to us.

Hannah is also the opening figure of the books that contain the central thought of how we can and should enjoy Christ, that being right with God is the condition of relationship. Also contained within those books of Samuel 1 & 2 are the negative side that is non-co-operation.

Her prophesies seen echoed in the old and new testament
Jude 1:15
... He is coming to punish all who are against God for all the evil they have done against him. And he will punish the sinners who are against God for all the evil they have said against him."
Psalms 96:13b
..He is coming to judge the world;
he will judge the world with fairness
and the peoples with truth.

Note also the first use of 'anointed' in reference to Christ. Anointing Definition and Meaning - Bible Dictionary

Hannah was prophesying about the King to come before the people had demanded a king over them at the end of Samuel's life years later!!

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

Hannah's 5th prophesy:
1 Samuel 2:10
those who oppose the Lord will be broken.
The Most High will thunder from heaven;
the Lord will judge the ends of the earth.
“He will give strength to his king
and exalt the horn of his anointed.”

God will judge the world.
Hannah understood what God was all about.

And God used her. Not just to fulfill the desires of her heart but to fulfill the desires of His heart too, and to bring in a new priesthood. One of the Nazirite vow. Numbers 6:2 Hannah also was an avowed Nazarite and God used her cooperation to accomplish His own desires.

Hannah lent Samuel to the service of the Lord much the same as God lent His Son to be of service to us.

Hannah is also the opening figure of the books that contain the central thought of how we can and should enjoy Christ, that being right with God is the condition of relationship. Also contained within those books of Samuel 1 & 2 are the negative side that is non-co-operation.

Her prophesies seen echoed in the old and new testament
Jude 1:15
... He is coming to punish all who are against God for all the evil they have done against him. And he will punish the sinners who are against God for all the evil they have said against him."
Psalms 96:13b
..He is coming to judge the world;
he will judge the world with fairness
and the peoples with truth.

Note also the first use of 'anointed' in reference to Christ. Anointing Definition and Meaning - Bible Dictionary

Hannah was prophesying about the King to come before the people had demanded a king over them at the end of Samuel's life years later!!

In Fact 1 Samuel 2:10 can be broken down to contain 5 prophesies in that one verse!
Going thru them one at a time paints a very complete picture of Christ's return.

1 Samuel 2:10
those who oppose the Lord will be broken.
The Most High will thunder from heaven;
the Lord will judge the ends of the earth.
“He will give strength to his king
and exalt the horn of his anointed.”

A. of A-E
The adversaries of the Lord shall be broken to pieces (v 10) (2nd advent of Jesus) (Zechariah 14 )

Jude 1:14-15 Enoch, who lived in the seventh generation after Adam, prophesied about these people. He said, Listen! The Lord is coming with countless thousands of his holy ones to execute judgment on the people of the world. He will convict every person of all the ungodly things they have done and for all the insults that ungodly sinners have spoken against him.​

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

B of A-E

1 Samuel 2:10
...The Most High will thunder from heaven;....”

Out of Heaven shall the Lord thunder upon His enemies (v 10) ( Ezekiel 38:17-21, Daniel 7:13-14, Zechariah 14)

Matthew 24:29-31
Immediately after the anguish of those days,
the sun will be darkened,
the moon will give no light,
the stars will fall from the sky,
and the powers in the heavens will be shaken.
30 And then at last, the sign that the Son of Man is coming will appear in the heavens, and there will be deep mourning among all the peoples of the earth. And they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he will send out his angels with the mighty blast of a trumpet, and they will gather his chosen ones from all over the world-from the farthest ends of the earth and heaven.


Revelation 19:11-19
The Rider on the White Horse

11 Then I saw heaven opened, and a white horse was standing there. Its rider was named Faithful and True, for he judges fairly and wages a righteous war.
12 His eyes were like flames of fire, and on his head were many crowns. A name was written on him that no one understood except himself.
13 He wore a robe dipped in blood, and his title was the Word of God.
14 The armies of heaven, dressed in the finest of pure white linen, followed him on white horses.
15 From his mouth came a sharp sword to strike down the nations. He will rule them with an iron rod. He will release the fierce wrath of God, the Almighty, like juice flowing from a winepress.
16 On his robe at his thigh was written this title: King of all kings and Lord of all lords.
17 Then I saw an angel standing in the sun, shouting to the vultures flying high in the sky: Come! Gather together for the great banquet God has prepared.
18 Come and eat the flesh of kings, generals, and strong warriors; of horses and their riders; and of all humanity, both free and slave, small and great.
19 Then I saw the beast and the kings of the world and their armies gathered together to fight against the one sitting on the horse and his army.
20 And the beast was captured, and with him the false prophet who did mighty miracles on behalf of the beast-miracles that deceived all who had accepted the mark of the beast and who worshiped his statue. Both the beast and his false prophet were thrown alive into the fiery lake of burning sulfur.
21 Their entire army was killed by the sharp sword that came from the mouth of the one riding the white horse. And the vultures all gorged themselves on the dead bodies.

TBC

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

C of A-E Hannah has combined prophesy within prophesy in verse 10

1 Samuel 2:10
..the Lord will judge the ends of the earth...”

The Lord shall judge the ends of the world ((v 10) (Daniel 7:9-14, Zechariah 14)

Matthew 25:31-46
And he will send out his angels with the mighty blast of a trumpet, and they will gather his chosen ones from all over the world-from the farthest ends of the earth and heaven.
Now learn a lesson from the fig tree. When its branches bud and its leaves begin to sprout, you know that summer is near.
33 In the same way, when you see all these things, you can know his return is very near, right at the door.
34 I tell you the truth, this generation will not pass from the scene until all these things take place.
35 Heaven and earth will disappear, but my words will never disappear.
36 However, no one knows the day or hour when these things will happen, not even the angels in heaven or the Son himself.[c] Only the Father knows.
37 When the Son of Man returns, it will be like it was in Noah's day.
38 In those days before the flood, the people were enjoying banquets and parties and weddings right up to the time Noah entered his boat.
39 People didn't realize what was going to happen until the flood came and swept them all away. That is the way it will be when the Son of Man comes.
40 Two men will be working together in the field; one will be taken, the other left.
41 Two women will be grinding flour at the mill; one will be taken, the other left.
42 So you, too, must keep watch! For you don't know what day your Lord is coming.
43 Understand this: If a homeowner knew exactly when a burglar was coming, he would keep watch and not permit his house to be broken into.
44 You also must be ready all the time, for the Son of Man will come when least expected.
45 A faithful, sensible servant is one to whom the master can give the responsibility of managing his other household servants and feeding them.
46 If the master returns and finds that the servant has done a good job, there will be a reward.

TBC

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

D&E

1 Samuel 2:10
..“He will give strength to his king

He shall give strength to His King (v 10) (Joel 2-3:2 )

Rev 19: 11-12 The Rider on the White Horse
Then I saw heaven opened, and a white horse was standing there. Its rider was named Faithful and True, for he judges fairly and wages a righteous war.
His eyes were like flames of fire, and on his head were many crowns. A name was written on him that no one understood except himself.​

1 Samuel 2:10
.. and exalt the horn of his anointed.”

He shall exalt the horn of His Anointed (Messiah) (v 10) (Isaiah 9:6-7, Zechariah 14)

Isaiah 9:6-7
6 For to us a child is born,
to us a son is given,
and the government will be on his shoulders.
And he will be called
Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
7 Of the greatness of his government and peace
there will be no end.
He will reign on David’s throne
and over his kingdom,
establishing and upholding it
with justice and righteousness
from that time on and forever.
The zeal of the Lord Almighty
will accomplish this.
Philippians 2:6-10
Though he was God,
he did not think of equality with God
as something to cling to.
7 Instead, he gave up his divine privileges;
he took the humble position of a slave
and was born as a human being.
When he appeared in human form,
8 he humbled himself in obedience to God
and died a criminal's death on a cross.
9 Therefore, God elevated him to the place of highest honor
and gave him the name above all other names,
10 that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow,
in heaven and on earth and under the earth,​

I love to find the seeds of the bible since they lay the foundation for all future reference to that subject in all the rest of the bible.
The great significance of her contribution to the bible should be recognised by all theology teachers and any who communicate the bible to others.

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

The children of the promise are not of the bondwoman but of the free

Galatians 4:26-27
But the heavenly Jerusalem, which is above, is like the free woman.
She is our mother. It is written in the Scriptures:
"Be happy, Jerusalem.
You are like a woman who never gave birth to children.
Start singing and shout for joy.
You never felt the pain of giving birth,
but you will have more children
than the woman who has a husband."
Isaiah 54:1
28 My brothers and sisters, you are God's children because of his promise,
as Isaac was then.
29 The son who was born in the normal way treated the other son badly.
It is the same today.​

We have the words of Hannah, Samuel's mother,
another barren woman used by God in effecting the
change of priesthood thru her anointing vow.

1 Samuel 2:5,8
Those who once had plenty of food now must work for food,
but people who were hungry are hungry no more.
The woman who could not have children now has seven,
but the woman who had many children now is sad.
:8 The Lord raises the poor up from the dust,
and he lifts the needy from the ashes.
He lets the poor sit with princes
and receive a throne of honor.
"The foundations of the earth belong to the Lord,
and the Lord set the world upon them.​

Repeated in Psalms 113:7-8

Psalms 113:7-8
7 The Lord lifts the poor from the dirt
and takes the helpless from the ashes.
8 He seats them with princes,
the princes of his people.​

The first prince was Israel, formerly called Jacob, who was the son of Isaac,
inheritor of the promise. From him came Joseph, reigning in maturity
and whose bones were brought back out of captivity to the promised land.

Job 36:7
He always watches over those who do right;
he sets them on thrones with kings
and they are honored forever.​

Joseph suffered at the hands of his brothers

Galatians 4:17
Those people zealously court you, but for no good; yes,
they want to exclude you, that you may be zealous for them.​

Footnotes:
(a) Those people They are the false teachers who were bothering
the believers in Galatia (Galatians 1:7).

In their zeal they exclude so as to include you with them in their false teachings.

In Christ there is no exclusivity

Romans 10:12
For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek,
for the same Lord over all is rich to all who call upon Him.​

Because of grace

Isaiah 54:4
Do not fear, for you will not be ashamed;
Neither be disgraced, for you will not be put to shame;
For you will forget the shame of your youth,
And will not remember the reproach of your widowhood anymore.
Romans 4:16
Therefore it is of faith that it might be according to grace,
so that the promise might be sure to all the seed,
not only to those who are of the law,
but also to those who are of the faith of Abraham,
who is the father of us all​

Father faith and mother grace produces the promise.

Genesis 21:9
And Sarah saw the son of Hagar the Egyptian,
whom she had borne to Abraham,
mocking.​

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

Deeds are what Christ looks at. God looked at the actions of Hannah and honored her greatly. In the same way Christ spoke of the woman who anointed Him for His buriel. Two bookends to a story.

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

The most significant thing (imo) that happened in the books of Samuel, happened while Samuel was still a boy, living in the care of the high priest, Eli.

That significant thing was the capture of the ark into the hands of the Philistines. The sons of Eli were provoking God by abusing the priesthood. It's not recorded how the priesthood of the tabernacle came back into effect at Shilo. The previous book in the bible had God confering instruction by judges that He had empowered.
The only link to priesthood was described in the actions of Dan. Less than memorial in print but in the unfolding of the bible what is not said about Dan is significant. They are not in the list of remaining tribes in Revelations 7:4-8

So when the unfaithful priests had taken the ark into battle, it fell into the hands of the enemy and proceeded to act on it's own w/o the Israelites. The ark itself did battle with Dacon, the false god.

The ark didn't return to God's people until David returned it to Jerusalem. David proceeded into Jerusalem dancing before it while his wife that had been given to him frowned on. (She was made to pay dearly for that not least in being left barren on David's decree but replaced by other wives of statute that also fell into silence)
But what had happened in the meanwhile was that God had placed a king at the people's demand. God had told David to abide in Hebron, which is the area of the field purchased for Sarah's buriel. David decided to obtain the city of Melchizadec instead.

So the ark was brought to Jerusalem but not w/o many trials and tribulations along the way. We can break that down slowly in the next while.

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

Why is the capture of the ark into the hands of the Philistines one of the highest demonstrations of God's ability in human affairs? Because it demonstrates that humans are not in control.

God is accredited with only one book ~ the bible. There is no other religion that has a book believed to be God-breathed instructions toward right and wrong. Every other religion has manmade books. God's ability to conduct human affairs is not according to mankind but only thru mahkind in the case of His written word. He chooses to do thru mankind but does not depend on mankind.

I look at the authenticity of the bible in this way:

Faith in the Reliability of the Bible

Faith in the reliability of the bible is comparable to someone who has a calculator who's components are said to be infallible yet they have no understanding as to why, compared to a Master Mathematician.
This is much like a simple faith in the bible as the word of God, with faith in Jesus' finished work, in His death and in His resurrection. And in knowing that gives you the confidence that is unshakable and places you at His throne of grace to supply all your needs. Your salvation is based on that. It's really all that's needed to have a fulfilling relation with Christ when it's minus all the trimmings of religion.

Compare that to the calculations of a master mathematician who understands mathematical problems in order to decipher the universe. Every question is worked out using another means (math/study) so that everything balances out, nothing is left out of the equation.

Everyone must have faith in believing the Word as to the work of God. If somehow faith is shaken then the onus is on that person to prove for themselves what has caused unbelief to creep in. We know Christ helps with us in our unbelief.

So if you no longer have simple faith then the onus is on you, the person who was called in the first place and was given faith to believe. Somehow the Spirit has been quenched.

When verifying counterfeit money it is best to study the authentic to recognize the false. The same is true of verifying the Word. Search the scriptures to see if what is being taught is right. We're all responsible/ accountable and we will all have to give an account.

The New Testament verifies the Old Testament while bringing the shadow to the spiritual in most cases if not all. The Israelites had to learn the basics of what God's law represented, learning in the physical what the spiritual application meant to God Himself. Learning what the shadow represents in both the old and new testaments has great advantage. It teaches what God will hold us accountable for. I'm not talking about studying Levitical law. I mean we need to find cross-references as to what the new testament is actually referring to so as to have correct and reliable interpretation. A reference point from A to B

Preachers today seem to lack the ability to edify with the old and the new to produce sound teaching. It seems like they think that what has proceeded before does not apply to what is or is to come. But that's wrong. Jesus taught differently.

Luke 12:42
And the Lord said, Who then is that faithful and wise steward, whom his lord shall make ruler over his household, to give them their portion of food at the proper time?
Matthew 13:52
Then said he unto them, Therefore every scribe which is instructed unto the kingdom of heaven is like unto a man that is an householder, which brings forth out of his treasure things new and old.​

We are all responsible so we might as well learn that now or learn it later.

I like to compare Matthew 18:21-35 the Lord taking account of His servants, compared to Luke 16:1-13 the unjust steward and see it as a good indication that some will get prayed into heaven, but probably as a part of the nations. re: Matthew 25. I think there will be a lot of weeping and gnashing of teeth in that area of the prelude to eternity. Specially when they have to take Law 101 all over again before given the decision to choose grace.

So much better to have simple faith in the Lord, but having confronted doubt the only thing there is to do is press on.

Are you being accountable?

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

God's Household

Who are the princess (the children of the King and bride) in Psalm 45?

There are 4 men in the bible. The first man, the second man, the new man and the man-child. Adam was the first man, Christ is the second man, we have become the new man by regeneration and we have the prospect of becoming the man-child.


I believe it's the new man that hasn't matured enough to acquire a position as priest of God in the city of the New jerusalem, where there is only one King. Instead they will occupy the place of the Princes portion (Ezekial) around the city and will reign as kings of the nations during the millenium.


Psalm 45

A Song for the King's Wedding

To the Chief Musician; [set to the tune of] "Lilies" (none arrayed as beautiful) An Ode to Love and Union between male and female

v 1-8 praise to the man, the King

1MY HEART overflows with a goodly theme; I address my psalm to a King. My tongue is like the pen of a ready writer.
2You are fairer than the children of men; graciousness is poured upon Your lips; therefore God has blessed You forever.
3Gird Your sword upon Your thigh, O mighty One, in Your glory and Your majesty!
4And in Your majesty ride on triumphantly for the cause of truth, humility, and righteousness (uprightness and right standing with God); and let Your right hand guide You to tremendous things.
5Your arrows are sharp; the peoples fall under You; Your darts pierce the hearts of the King's enemies.
6Your throne, O God, is forever and ever; the scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.
7You love righteousness, uprightness, and right standing with God and hate wickedness; therefore God, Your God, has anointed You with the oil of gladness above Your fellows.
8Your garments are all fragrant with myrrh, aloes, and cassia; stringed instruments make You glad.

v 9-15 praise concerning the Queen, the King's wife

9Kings' daughters are among Your honorable women; at Your right hand stands the queen in gold of Ophir.
10Hear, O daughter, consider, submit, and consent to my instruction: forget also your own people and your father's house;
11So will the King desire your beauty; because He is your Lord, be submissive and reverence and honor Him.
12And, O daughter of Tyre, the richest of the people shall entreat your favor with a gift.
13The King's daughter in the inner part [of the palace] is all glorious; her clothing is inwrought with gold.
14She shall be brought to the King in raiment of needlework; with the virgins, her companions that follow her, she shall be brought to You.
15With gladness and rejoicing will they be brought; they will enter into the King's palace.

v 16-17 praise concerning the royal children

16Instead of Your fathers shall be Your sons, whom You will make princes in all the land.
17I will make Your name to be remembered in all generations; therefore shall the people praise and give You thanks forever and ever.


God's Household Part 2

Malachi 3:17-18 And they shall be Mine, saith the LORD of hosts, in that day when I make up My jewels; and I will spare them, as a man spareth his own son that serveth him. Then shall ye return, and discern between the righteous and the wicked, between him that serveth God and him that serveth Him not.

Revelation 2:26-27 And he that overcometh, and keepeth My works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations: And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of My Father.

Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.

Matt 25
31-46 Sheeps and Goats
14-30 Talents
1-13 Ten Virgins

Matthew 25 outlines the millenium.
The priests as the bride, the virgins, while those with talents are the kings, then the sheep as those of the nations, and those that wouldn't even give a glass of water to anyone are those who are reserved for the lake of fire.

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

A great e-mail today about 'The Forever King~ Seeing Jesus in Samuel 2'

The Forever King: Seeing Jesus in 2 Samuel

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

Worth Repeating

The children of the promise are not of the bondwoman but of the free

Galatians 4:26-27 But the heavenly Jerusalem, which is above, is like the free woman.
She is our mother.
27 It is written in the Scriptures:
"Be happy, Jerusalem.
You are like a woman who never gave birth to children.
Start singing and shout for joy.
You never felt the pain of giving birth,
but you will have more children
than the woman who has a husband." Isaiah 54:1
28 My brothers and sisters, you are God's children because of his promise,
as Isaac was then.
29 The son who was born in the normal way treated the other son badly.
It is the same today.

We have the words of Hannah, Samuel's mother,
another barren woman used by God in effecting the
change of priesthood thru her anointing vow.

1 Samuel 2:5 Those who once had plenty of food now must work for food,
but people who were hungry are hungry no more.
The woman who could not have children now has seven,
but the woman who had many children now is sad.
:8 The Lord raises the poor up from the dust,
and he lifts the needy from the ashes.
He lets the poor sit with princes
and receive a throne of honor.
"The foundations of the earth belong to the Lord,
and the Lord set the world upon them.
Repeated in Psalms 113:7-8

Psalms 113:
7 The Lord lifts the poor from the dirt
and takes the helpless from the ashes.
8 He seats them with princes,
the princes of his people.