Halal Explained

[light upon light]

Muhammad did not say that geckos are more harmful than spiders, although he ordered geckos to be killed, and frogs and spiders to be spared. Considering how much good geckos do for people, to a person who doesn't believe he is a prophet, it makes little sense.

How do you know what Muhammad said about Geckos?

 

[LoveBeingAMuslimah]

So I did some more research, and found a way of slaughter that, if done properly, is guaranteed to cause no suffering after the blow is given.

Apparently Marie Antoinette blinked her eyes after being decapitated.

Anyway, Allaah, in His complete wisdom, told us to leave the spinal cord intact. So I know that there is a greater benefit to slaughtering the animal that way. We are to be balanced; we are to kill the animal in the way we are told while making sure it feels as little pain as possible.

FYI, omitting the HTTPS portion of your links will prevent the pages from getting all screwy.

Muhammad did not say that geckos are more harmful than spiders,

I didn't say he did.

although he ordered geckos to be killed, and frogs and spiders to be spared. Considering how much good geckos do for people, to a person who doesn't believe he is a prophet, it makes little sense.

That's ok. Doubters probably thought that the hadeeth about there being a cure under a fly's wing didn't make sense because of their limited knowledge. But now we know that one insect's wing destroys bacteria even though that would've defied most people's logic before. Now the claim about there being a cure under a fly's wing does not seem so far-fetched. I will not be surprised one bit if/when scientific evidence comes out proving that one of the fly's wings has a cure.

That is what your religion teaches, correct. Unfortunately, this causes harm especially to people who live in zones where there are diseases spread by insects.

Do you have a link to a scientific paper that shows evidence of this harm due to those in Muslim areas killing salamanders off? Also, does this mean that the niche left by the supposed mass killing of this creature (which I don't think has happened) is not filled by other predators taking the salamanders' place and eating insects? Because surely other populations that feed on insects would boom if one of their competitors is no longer a competitor.

I agree. He also knows that Muhammad was not His prophet.

No, He does not lie to Himself. He, however, knows that Jesus was not His son like some erroneously ascribe to Him, Exalted is He from such a grave claim.

To accept that, we need to accept the idea that God tells people to kill an animal that can help protect them from deadly disease, and says it is "harmful" while He protects other animals that are "harmful" in exactly the same way. It would be like telling a person that it's not OK to kill a tiger but it is OK to kill a lion, because the lion is dangerous.

But the general principle is already in place that whatever can directly harm us can be killed. Some animals were specified but that doesn't mean any other harmful animals cannot be killed no matter the circumstance. Forbidding the killing of another animal does not negate this fact.

But you cannot defend some of his teachings, and are unable to come up with counter-arguments for those who question the validity of some of them.

I am not unable to come up with counter-arguments, I just grow tired of endless debates that have us going around in circles. I don't always feel like coming on this forum obliged to reply every single time to your threads or questions because I know how much time they take away from me; this doesn't equate to being unable to come up with counterarguments. And even if I am not able to explain something, that doesn't mean that there isn't a proper explanation for it. I have said several times that I am a layperson.

No, but some of the animals that Muhammad mentioned are not harmful at all, like kites.

According to limited knowledge based on some information we have today. Again, Allaah knows what we know not.

God does know more than us. I believe that whatever He told His messengers is true and worthy of being followed. I do not believe Muhammad is His messenger.

I hope you accept him as His Messenger and reject Jesus (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon them both) as God or His son and, instead, consider him His Messenger before you die. If you do this, then you will have gained the supreme success in the Hereafter.

God definitely knows more than wikipedia. Wikipedia knows more than Muhammad on some issues, however. Including kites.

Wikipedia does not know more than the Messenger of Allaah, Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), regarding what Allaah told him, including about kites.

 

[TG123]

Salaam Alaikum.

Apparently Marie Antoinette blinked her eyes after being decapitated.

Not only her, but so did many others executed by the guillotine.

However, this was caused by muscle twitching, not conscious movement.

According to the article, a decapitation victim will probably feel pain at the moment the head is detached, but unconsciousness sets in 2-3 seconds if not immediately.

HowStuffWorks "Brain Stays Alive After Decapitation"

Anyway, Allaah, in His complete wisdom, told us to leave the spinal cord intact. So I know that there is a greater benefit to slaughtering the animal that way. We are to be balanced; we are to kill the animal in the way we are told while making sure it feels as little pain as possible.

I can see why Jews and Muslims kill in a specific way because you believe God told you to. Does Islam actually teach that halal slaughter is the most humane way to kill an animal, or does it just say that God wants you to do it that way? If it just teaches that God wants it done in a certain way, that would make more sense than the claim that it is the most humane of all methods.

FYI, omitting the HTTPS portion of your links will prevent the pages from getting all screwy.

That's interesting, I was wondering what was happening. It seems that the pages only get messed up when I link YouTube videos. Are you suggesting just typing in www... ? I'll have to give that a shot, thanks.

I didn't say he did.

I know you didn't. It wouldn't have made sense for him to say that. I'm just wondering why he would order people to kill one beneficial animal and spare another.

That's ok. Doubters probably thought that the hadeeth about there being a cure under a fly's wing didn't make sense because of their limited knowledge. But now we know that one insect's wing destroys bacteria even though that would've defied most people's logic before. Now the claim about there being a cure under a fly's wing does not seem so far-fetched. I will not be surprised one bit if/when scientific evidence comes out proving that one of the fly's wings has a cure.

Did Muhammad say that the wing of one of the flies destroys bacteria, or that there is poison under one wing and healing in the other?

The article below shows how flies spread disease. Basically, they slurp up junk and "leak" them into the food and water we eat and drink.

Diseases Spread By Flies

Given that flies dislodge junk from their bodies into our food and drink, what do you think would happen if you were to submerge it into your cup of water?

Do you have a link to a scientific paper that shows evidence of this harm due to those in Muslim areas killing salamanders off? Also, does this mean that the niche left by the supposed mass killing of this creature (which I don't think has happened) is not filled by other predators taking the salamanders' place and eating insects? Because surely other populations that feed on insects would boom if one of their competitors is no longer a competitor.

Do you have evidence of Muslim countries killing salamanders off? I made a mistake in my original sentence, I should have written:

Unfortunately, this would cause harm especially to people who live in zones where there are diseases spread by insects.

Both you and I know that diseases like typhoid and malaria exist in Muslim countries as well as non-Muslim countries. Killing off a predator that feeds on harmful insects would help reduce opposition to the spreaders of the disease.

If salamanders were all killed off, there is no way of knowing what would happen, ie whether they would be 'replaced'. Fortunately, I am unaware of any country doing something that stupid.

No, He does not lie to Himself.

Correct.

He, however, knows that Jesus was not His son like some erroneously ascribe to Him, Exalted is He from such a grave claim.

He knows He is Jesus.

But the general principle is already in place that whatever can directly harm us can be killed. Some animals were specified but that doesn't mean any other harmful animals cannot be killed no matter the circumstance. Forbidding the killing of another animal does not negate this fact.

Fair enough. If whatever can directly harm us should be killed, then frogs and spiders in houses should be exterminated.

I am not unable to come up with counter-arguments, I just grow tired of endless debates that have us going around in circles. I don't always feel like coming on this forum obliged to reply every single time to your threads or questions because I know how much time they take away from me; this doesn't equate to being unable to come up with counterarguments. And even if I am not able to explain something, that doesn't mean that there isn't a proper explanation for it. I have said several times that I am a layperson.

OK, I owe you an apology. What I said was extremely arrogant. You definitely are not obliged to respond to my points, and I am sorry for putting you into that position. You are free to respond or not to whatever I write.

According to limited knowledge based on some information we have today. Again, Allaah knows what we know not.

I agree that God knows what we do not. I also believe that if something can be proven to be false, it is not from Him.

I hope you accept him as His Messenger and reject Jesus (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon them both) as God or His son and, instead, consider him His Messenger before you die. If you do this, then you will have gained the supreme success in the Hereafter.

I hope and pray that you accept Jesus Christ for who He is and accept what He has done for you on the cross. If you do this, you will find eternal life in heaven with God.

Wikipedia does not know more than the Messenger of Allaah, Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), regarding what Allaah told him, including about kites.

The fact is that there is nothing harmful about kites. They are actually beneficial for people, because they kill off pests like rats and mice and snakes.

 

[TG123]

How do you know what Muhammad said about Geckos?

I read the Sahih Muslim hadiths on

Search the word gecko in the Hadith (Hadis) Books (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Sahih Muslim, Sunan Abu-Dawud, and Malik's Muwatta)

 

[light upon light]

I read the Sahih Muslim hadiths on

Search the word gecko in the Hadith (Hadis) Books (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Sahih Muslim, Sunan Abu-Dawud, and Malik's Muwatta)

You are assuming that Hadiths are accurate accounts of what Muhammad actually did and said. Since they contradict one another, that is problematic.

 

[smaneck]

Unlike with halal or kosher or stunning, there is no chance of the animal feeling any pain or consciousness after the slice or blow. It is over. There isn't even one second of suffering or any feeling whatsoever. There isn't even the remote possibility that the animal will feel any pain.

Maybe or maybe not. The French stopped using the guillotine after the head of a criminal appeared to be responding to people.

Interestingly, Saudi Arabia uses this form of punishment on its criminals. Murderers and drug dealers meet a quicker death than most slaughtered animals do.

I suspect it may be more merciful than our current use of drug cocktails, especially now that we are experimenting with different mixtures since the drug companies won't sell the drugs used for this purpose anymore.

To accept that, we need to accept the idea that God tells people to kill an animal that can help protect them from deadly disease,

If it were God telling us this it would be in the Qur'an not ahadith.

 

[wn123455]

“The Australian people should be able to vote in a referendum on whether we want to pay a Halal tax or not,” according to the website. Mr Holt told 7News that he stood by his website and that Muslims were ‘forcing a Halal tax on us’ through certification and the funds raised money for terrorism overseas.

OUTSTANDING! Stickers that say, ‘Beware! Halal Food Funds Terrorists’ appearing on food products in Australian grocery stores | BARE NAKED ISLAM

 

[smaneck]

OUTSTANDING! Stickers that say, ‘Beware! Halal Food Funds Terrorists’ appearing on food products in Australian grocery stores | BARE NAKED ISLAM

Typical for a One Nation nativist (i.e. racist) political party. Not only do the oppose immigration but also any government policies favoring the indigenous people of Australia. One Nation really means one white nation.

If that's what you want to support go ahead. Good to know what you stand for.

 

[wn123455]

Typical for a One Nation nativist (i.e. racist) political part. Not only do the oppose immigration but also any government policies favoring the indigenous people of Australia. One Nation really means one white nation.

If that's what you want to support go ahead. Good to know what you stand for.

I do not know much about One Nation but their views on halal products is correct.

Can Buying Food Contribute to Terrorism? | The Counter Jihad Report

 

[smaneck]

I do not know much about One Nation but their views on halal products is correct.

"I don't know anything about the racist websites I quote from but if they hate Muslims as much as I do, I know their views are correct."

That's what you are really saying, isn't it?

 

[light upon light]

Let's hope after reviving and repurposing the blood libel (a symbol of the kind of spiritual disease of the soul that led inexorably to the Holocaust) we've heard the last of this hatred here.

 

[simplegifts]

Sorry if this video has already been shown. Everyone who eats animals who have not been stunned first needs to watch it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W0gFoP6gY0A#t=43

 

[WoodrowX2]

Not like any halal slaughter I have ever seen. I doubt it would even be permissible to eat anything slaughtered like that.

I will not claim those are not Muslims but I will say they do not how to properly slaughter

 

[simplegifts]

So do I.

I would guess that makes our food harem.

 

[simplegifts]

because racism!

Because Islam is a race?