"Goddidit"

[AV1611VET]

[deleted]

 

[Upisoft]

Interesting.

I have 3x the number of posts as the #2 poster, and 4x the number of posts as the OP.

A fellow Christian may think that you put your forum addiction before God...

 

[AV1611VET]

A fellow Christian may think that you put your forum addiction before God...

A fellow Christian would know better.

 

[Upisoft]

A fellow Christian would know better.

They can read your mind?

 

[sandwiches]

Interesting.

I have 3x the number of posts as the #2 poster, and 4x the number of posts as the OP.

Interesting.

I have 3x more substance in my posts than and only 1/1000000th the counting posts of the #181 poster.

 

[Cabal]

Interesting.

I have 3x the number of posts as the #2 poster, and 4x the number of posts as the OP.

Ok. And?

 

[Chris81]

If creationists are so hung up on saying "Goddidit" as an answer to any creation related question, why bother trying to give a coherent explanation in the first place? Instead of trying to give a pseudoscientific answer about floodwaters going to Neptune, a "different state" past or the like, just say "Goddidit" and be done with it.

Furthermore, if "Goddidit" is such a great answer, why bother going to the doctor for your ills? Obviously God meant for you to contract the disease, and it is God's job to heal you. By going to the doctor you are taking the power out of God's hands and showing you don't really trust him to heal you. Plus, many of the medicines you take were made with the help of our understanding of evolution (Oh noes!).

The whole reason we moved beyond the stone age is because people started thinking for themselves. What if all of our medical knowledge centered around "Goddidit"? That is a scary thought.

I am certainly no YEC but I still fail to grasp the logic of your post. As a Christian I believe that god gave man the gifts of reason, creativity, and intuitive problem solving skills such that he/she may be able to understand the working of the world and solve and invent solutions from their own ability.

God as Lord seeks that we should serve him by faithfully following his teachings, keeping his commandments, and serving to the needs of others. As his servants he gave use these intellectual gifts necessary to meet the needs of others. The research and application of medicine is therefore the the application of ones God given gifts in serving the needs of other people. As a Civil Engineer I believe that I am providing a service to others by designing bridges that are safe and economical for the benefit of society.

If we were to reduce our relationship to God to such an extent that we seek to solve no problems on our own we would still be living in caves.

 

[LifeToTheFullest!]

I am certainly no YEC but I still fail to grasp the logic of your post. As a Christian I believe that god gave man the gifts of reason, creativity, and intuitive problem solving skills such that he/she may be able to understand the working of the world and solve and invent solutions from their own ability.

God as Lord seeks that we should serve him by faithfully following his teachings, keeping his commandments, and serving to the needs of others. As his servants he gave use these intellectual gifts necessary to meet the needs of others. The research and application of medicine is therefore the the application of ones God given gifts in serving the needs of other people. As a Civil Engineer I believe that I am providing a service to others by designing bridges that are safe and economical for the benefit of society.

If we were to reduce our relationship to God to such an extent that we seek to solve no problems on our own we would still be living in caves.

Can a person behave in the way you have described, and not be a 'Christian?'

 

[Chris81]

Can a person behave in the way you have described, and not be a 'Christian?'

If you mean using your intellectual or spiritual gifts in service to others, then absolutely! God did not create a special group of people called 'Christians', he created all of us.

 

[LifeToTheFullest!]

If you mean using your intellectual or spiritual gifts in service to others, then absolutely! God did not create a special group of people called 'Christians', he created all of us.

So, is this kind of behaviour the baby, or the bathwater?

 

[Chris81]

So, is this kind of behaviour the baby, or the bathwater?

Sorry, you will have to be a bit more direct with me. I am not certain what you are asking?

 

[LifeToTheFullest!]

Sorry, you will have to be a bit more direct with me. I am not certain what you are asking?

Sorry for being obtuse.

I was simply pointing out that you don't need religion to be moral.

 

[sk8Joyful]

If creationists are so hung up
on saying "Goddidit" as an answer to any creation related question,
why bother trying to give a coherent explanation in the first place?

If evolutionists are so hung up
on saying "random chance" as an answer to any Choice related question,
why bother trying to give a coherent explanation in the first place?

Furthermore,
if "Goddidit" is such a great answer, why bother going to the doctor for your ills?

Context-dependent,
because many christians don't know any better,
just like many non-christians also don't know any better.

Obviously
God meant for you to contract the disease, and it is God's job to heal you.

Careful: what may seem obvious, most often is not.

The 1st. part of that sentence, except in isolated instances,
is patently false.
The last part of that sentence, except in isolated instances,
God already accomplished re healing.
it's commonly a matter if we ALLOW it, or not.
God gives us these choices... same as He does re our soul's salvation, or not.

By going to the doctor, you are taking the power out of God's hands,
and showing you don't really trust him to heal you.

God, as universal-Creator, Father, Savior, Teacher & Resurrector,
having already demonstrated such, is perfectly capable of exercising whatever "power" He wants.

But He gives us choice(s): so we can wonder, question,
experiment, learn (including healing), develop, & grow in
further abundant living... - why? because GOD LOVES us. PRAISE God!

Plus, many of the medicines you take,
were made with the help of our understanding of evolution
(Oh noes!).

Guesswork is fun, isn't it? - and some substances/'meds'
do a terrific job of First-aiding victims, in their hope & quest to heal.

Fortunately, God did not limit us to either -
1. isolated-Divine interventions, or
2. common-medical interception.

Exquisitely created, God graciously blessed us with a mind which God empowered, &
we can enable its including healing... works.

The whole reason we moved beyond the stone age
is because people started thinking for themselves.

Would that this were true! - Unfortunately

most people, either
falsely make GOD the cause of their illness, & blame Him for their miseries, &
expect Him, to heal... what GOD made our own responsability/opportunities to do.
or
ignorantly trust docs - to find the cause of their illness, &
expect them, to heal... what GOD made our own responsability/opportunities to do.

When in all actuality, once a person has been rightly educated, often healings are a given. PRAISE God!
.

 

[futzman]

It's been my observation that those who pray for healing do so PLUS seeking the best health care available to them.

It goes something like this:

Prayer request: "Mama just got pancreatic cancer. We're taking her to Standford. They have one of the best cancer treating hospitals around. Would you pray that god gives insight to the doctors so mama gets the best care?"

Congregation: "We'll keep her in our prayers."

... two weeks later.

Prayer request: "Mama started chemotherapy last week. She's real sick. Please pray that she feels better in between her chemo treatments."


...two weeks later.

Prayer request: "The doctors say mama isn't going to make it. They've done everything they can do. They told us to take mama home and call hospice. Please pray that her familiy has the strength to deal with this."

...one week later.

"Mama passed away last night. Please pray for dad, as he's taking this real hard. This must have been god's will. I guess he needed her more than we did."

Question: Was there any difference in outcome between an athieist and the christian in this same hypothetical scenario? Does prayer "work?"

No. It does not work, at least where it 1) counts and 2) can be proven. Has anyone grown back a limb from prayer? No. Has anyone been healed from Alzheimers (or LBD -- my Christian father died from). No. I could go on. Pick your own irreversible physical ailment. The only time it "works" is in case where it could have WORKED ANYWAY. I have a good friend who is a fundamentalist minister. When I pointed out to him that in one case where he was telling me about a healing I remarked "Well, it could have happened anyway, couldn't it?" His response was "Yes, but then you could say that about anything." Exactly. I'm still waiting to see that case where someone is healed from Alzheimer's...

 

[sk8Joyful]

Has anyone grown back a limb from prayer? No.
Has anyone been healed from Alzheimers
(or LBD -- my Christian father died from). No.
I could go on.

Has anyone grown back a limb, after amputation? No.
Has anyone been healed from whole-organ surgery amputation?; or
from (chemo & radiation: NO! - as both are known cancer-causers, plus proliferate it more.
The same with CAT-scans, 100's of times more ionizing than an X-ray.)
I could go on.

Pick your own irreversible physical ailment.

what sort of lousy suggestion was that! - Who would ever!
suggest that anyone else "pick an irreversible ailment"

The only time it "works" is in case where it could have WORKED ANYWAY.

And as I previously said
(beyond the misunderstood Goddidit, & current medical-model) Healing has, is now, & will continue to work.

 

[Nathan Poe]

Has anyone grown back a limb, after amputation? No.
Has anyone been healed from whole-organ surgery amputation?; or
from (chemo & radiation: NO! - as both are known cancer-causers, plus proliferate it more.
The same with CAT-scans, 100's of times more ionizing than an X-ray.)
I could go on.

Yes, you could -- and all you'd do is show that prayer can't accomplish anything that can't be done without prayer.

Kind of pointless, isn't it?

 

[sk8Joyful]

Prayer can't accomplish anything,
that can't be done without prayer.

Kind of pointless, isn't it?

Healing is never! pointless. Healing is the successful outcome.
Whether by -
1. rare Divine-intervention, or
2. being skillfully guided into healing, & prayer can play some part, or
3. being medically 1st.Aided, including foremost! victims being Constructively encouraged to heal...

Healing (soul +mind +body ) is the successful outcome.

 

[futzman]

And as I previously said
(beyond the misunderstood Goddidit, & current medical-model) Healing has, is now, & will continue to work.

Yes, and it apparently works better now than it has in the past. We must be getting better and better at praying. What? Where's my proof? Just look at the life expectancy statistics. That's right. People are living longer and longer statistically. I can't think of another explanation besides prayer. Can you?

 

[Greg1234]

Just look at the life expectancy statistics. That's right. People are living longer and longer statistically. I can't think of another explanation besides prayer. Can you?

Only when you factor in an ignorant homind beginning. Man once lived past 500 years. How this was done is through the acknowledgment of the man in completion, the entire man, and utilizing the different aspects in which he dwells. Renewal of the physical coming through the recognition, amplification and application of the non physical, that which creates, within him.

Analogically, there is a race of man who is blind. Men are able to travel longer, further, faster and safer in normal conditions because science is providing newer and better acoustic echolocation devices. The only thing is all this is irrelevant and comically bypassed when sight, another sense, is employed.

To the blind men though, science in this state, is elevated. Captivity and constraint to that provided through science granting the illusion of freedom and betterment, whilst increasing dependence. Man has seen a steady decline in a critical sense, mapped across with "sight". And you cannot compare the norm today with the norm in the beginning (or the norm in general).

In essence, we are those blind men.

 

[futzman]

Only when you factor in an ignorant homind beginning. Man once lived past 500 years. How this was done is through the acknowledgment of the man in completion, the entire man, and utilizing the different aspects in which he dwells. Renewal of the physical coming through the recognition, amplification and application of the non physical, that which creates, within him.

I'm sorry. Could you repeat that? All I heard was "500 years blah blah blah..." Oh, and what possible proof do you have that man lived 500 years, or even 200 years for that matter?

Analogically, there is a race of man who is blind. Men are able to travel longer, further, faster and safer in normal conditions because science is providing newer and better acoustic echolocation devices. The only thing is all this is irrelevant and comically bypassed when sight, another sense, is employed.

To the blind men though, science in this state, is elevated. Captivity and constraint to that provided through science granting the illusion of freedom and betterment, whilst increasing dependence. Man has seen a steady decline in a critical sense, mapped across with "sight". And you cannot compare the norm today with the norm in the beginning (or the norm in general).

In essence, we are those blind men.

Holy cow. I'm still hearing "blah, blah, blah" but nothing I can make any sense of. You must be really, really smart. Could someone interpret? Anyone?