God Doesn't Want Me To Know Him

[ToddNotTodd]

So is that what you are here to do? Get us to worry about climate change? I'm not a fan of those who do fake miracles and kill people either, fyi. In case you were wondering, I'm here because I believe the good news of Jesus Christ and I like to talk about it with others. I also enjoy theology and hope my presence on this forum can be used for God's glory.


Yes, well I realize that now. Apparently atheists can believe that we are more than mutated organisms in a universe with no designer. They may not know who that designer is, but they can certainly acknowledge the existence of it.

Wait, you're not suggesting that atheists believe in a "designer" that's a deity, right?

 

[ClothedInGrace]

Wait, you're not suggesting that atheists believe in a "designer" that's a deity, right?

No. However, an atheist may simply be a weak/negative/agnostic atheist who just lacks the information required to believe in a certain deity. However, with this new definition of atheism I've learned, I assume that atheists--while lacking belief in a certain deity--can certainly believe that a deity of some kind may exist. Perhaps agnostic atheists are simply holding out on belief in deity until they are proof-positive of which one is true, while an agnostic theist believes in deity, but doesn't know which one.

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

Okay man. I just sometimes wonder why some people who don't believe in God spend so much time debating with those who do. I understand that it is intellectually stimulating, but aren't we just delusional from the atheistic perspective? I wouldn't find myself very enlightened talking with delusional people, maybe irritated, but not enlightened. But then again, from an atheistic perspective nothing really matters since we are all just random organisms that are here for no reason and will one day die out, so do whatever you will.

Delusional is a word with a lot of spurious emotional baggage; a delusion is a false belief based on an incorrect interpretation of reality. We all have some of those; and some are more interesting than others - particularly ones that strongly influence every aspect of someone's life.

I'm interested because although I was raised and went to school in a deeply religious environment, for me it didn't 'take', I never became a believer. I'm curious to know why some are hooked and others aren't, and what differences in thinking are involved.

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

No. However, an atheist may simply be a weak/negative/agnostic atheist who just lacks the information required to believe in a certain deity. However, with this new definition of atheism I've learned, I assume that atheists--while lacking belief in a certain deity--can certainly believe that a deity of some kind may exist. Perhaps agnostic atheists are simply holding out on belief in deity until they are proof-positive of which one is true, while an agnostic theist believes in deity, but doesn't know which one.

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Yes, some atheists accept the possibility of a deity or deities, but don't know if any exist, or don't think it's possible to know.

 

[ClothedInGrace]

I'm interested because although I was raised and went to school in a deeply religious environment, for me it didn't 'take', I never became a believer. I'm curious to know why some are hooked and others aren't, and what differences in thinking are involved.

Well, I was raised in a very nonreligious environment; religion of any kind wasn't even thought about. One day I read some of the words of Jesus and the truth was revealed to me. Nobody preached to me and no logical or philosophical processes were needed. I simply was called to believe and the Holy Spirit made it happen.

If you are trying to understand this stuff from a purely physical or psychological perspective, then good luck, because my belief is spiritual--a work of God.

 

[Judahs_Lion]

I have not been presented with convincing evidence that a god exists.

Any omniscient, omnipotent god would know exactly what would be necessary to convince me, and would be easily able to make that happen.

Ergo, assuming that God exists, God necessarily has no interest in whether or not I am convinced of his existence.

Now, if we assume a literal hell, wouldn't this be a horrific moral oversight on God's end?

The Apostle Paul said that proof of God exists in all of nature. There is then no excuse not to know God.

If you can't believe in God because you exist, nature exists, the stars and wonders of the galaxy are there to see, and there is no thing that proves why it is there save for God making it so, how is God to get through? All the excuses you're making as to why God doesn't prove to you he's there is you're telling God you don't want to be convinced.

 

[ScottA]

Delusional is a word with a lot of spurious emotional baggage; a delusion is a false belief based on an incorrect interpretation of reality. We all have some of those; and some are more interesting than others - particularly ones that strongly influence every aspect of someone's life.

I'm interested because although I was raised and went to school in a deeply religious environment, for me it didn't 'take', I never became a believer. I'm curious to know why some are hooked and others aren't, and what differences in thinking are involved.

That is quite an accurate assessment. Reminds me of a Joni Mitchell song: http://jonimitchell.com/music/song.cfm?id=83

 

[Mountain_Girl406]

Before you can even come to know God you must accept that you are a sinner. Mankind is full of sin and pride and God is holy and doesn't owe anything to anyone. If you want to know God then you must embrace this truth and seek Him with a repentant heart. Search the words of Jesus and find them to be true. Knowing God is a gift of grace; it has always been this way.

Seems a bit circular, you have to embrace God's truth in order to know he exists, but how can you accept it as truth without that knowledge to begin with?

 

[ClothedInGrace]

Seems a bit circular, you have to embrace God's truth in order to know he exists, but how can you accept it as truth without that knowledge to begin with?

If you want to know God then you must embrace the truth.

 

[Tinker Grey]

The Apostle Paul said that proof of God exists in all of nature.

Paul was wrong.

 

[ScottA]

Paul was wrong.

Sounds like the wrong test equipment was used. The new model is improved. Paul talked about that. 2 Corinthians 5:17

 

[Landon Caeli]

Thou whomst refusith to believith, shall perish in eternal hellfire-ith... Forever and ever and ever to infinity.

 

[Mountain_Girl406]

If you want to know God then you must embrace the truth.

Without knowing God exists , how do you embrace the truth of God's existence?

 

[ClothedInGrace]

Thou whomst refusith to believith, shall perish in eternal hellfire-ith... Forever and ever and ever to infinity.

I'm assuming this is some sort of satire, because nobody seriously speaks like that anymore. Assuming it is satire, I must say the lake of fire is nothing to joke about. While I don't believe the Bible teaches that people are kept alive in it to suffer for eternity, I still believe it will be a real place where unbelievers will go to perish. You shouldn't make light of divine truth.

 

[ClothedInGrace]

Without knowing God exists , how do you embrace the truth of God's existence?

You either do or you don't I'm afraid. It is a work of the Holy Spirit in the born-again believer's case, and in others it is simply recognizing the need for a creator.

 

[Mountain_Girl406]

You either do or you don't I'm afraid. It is a work of the Holy Spirit in the born-again believer's case, and in others it is simply recognizing the need for a creator.

So I'd like to believe but don't. Since God could send the Holy Spirit but hasn't yet, what should I conclude?

 

[Landon Caeli]

I'm assuming this is some sort of satire, because nobody seriously speaks like that anymore. Assuming it is satire, I must say the lake of fire is nothing to joke about. While I don't believe the Bible teaches that people are kept alive in it to suffer for eternity, I still believe it will be a real place where unbelievers will go to perish. You shouldn't make light of divine truth.

I'm just antagonizing and flaming non-believers purposely as a troll.

 

[ClothedInGrace]

So I'd like to believe but don't. Since God could send the Holy Spirit but hasn't yet, what should I conclude?

I would conclude that you are stubborn in unbelief. If you want the Holy Spirit then all you have to do ask for Him; put aside your unbelief and have faith in the Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[ClothedInGrace]

I'm just antagonizing and flaming non-believers purposely as a troll.

Well that's not something the Holy Spirit would lead you to do.

 

[ScottA]

So I'd like to believe but don't. Since God could send the Holy Spirit but hasn't yet, what should I conclude?

The time allotted for you (for us all), is as much as your entire lifetime. Don't cut Him off, and don't sell yourself short. Hang in there.