God does not love everyone and the Bible says so (Change My Mind)

[Grip Docility]

I do not ascribe to that at all. God is beyond time.

"God can not possibly know all and find a way to allow genuine opportunity and relationship to unfold within Creation."

So you deny God's Omniscience? If so, then that can fully support an understanding of human choice, free will, and man's responsibility to answer the call. Unfortunately for this argument, Proverb 16:9, 20:24 and Ezekiel 36 sort of kills that idea.

I suggest God’s Omnicience is far beyond a linear fashion. God didn’t write a script and press play, nor choose the best play and “cast” it.

I suggest God’s Omnicience is more like Quantum thinking with the allowance of Chaotic outcome.

I would even suggest that God didn’t rig the game, but is involved genuinely and risking loss.

Linear Omnicience is what I disagree with.

Complex and Limitless Omnicience that reacts to every tiny variance in everything that connects in real time to all events is what I lean towards.

 

[razzelflabben]

So God is not sovereign over this law?

The natural law is because of God's sovereignty...

 

[Hammster]

And yet Judas was Given. I don’t think the Father Gave Him to be lost. I’m fairly certain that Judas was given in sincere gesture of Love.

The scripture was fulfilled by the handing over and when Satan entered Judas.

No worries the real question is, why did Jesus explain that Judas was lost at all?

Maybe this will help:

27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me.
28 I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand.
29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand. - John 10:27-29

Was Judas a sheep? If yes, then we have a poor Shepherd. If no, then it would shine some light on what was meant by Judas being given.

 

[Grip Docility]

Maybe this will help:

27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me.
28 I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand.
29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand. - John 10:27-29

Was Judas a sheep? If yes, then we have a poor Shepherd. If no, then it would shine some light on what was meant by Judas being given.

Is a sheeps failure the Shepherd’s fault?

I would say not.

 

[Hammster]

I suggest God’s Omnicience is far beyond a linear fashion. God didn’t write a script and press play, nor choose the best play and “cast” it.

I suggest God’s Omnicience is more like Quantum thinking with the allowance of Chaotic outcome.

I would even suggest that God didn’t rig the game, but is involved genuinely and risking loss.

Linear Omnicience is what I disagree with. Complex and Limitless Omnicience that reacts to every tiny variance in everything that connects in real time to all events.

That’s basically Open Theism. It’s heretical.

 

[Hammster]

Is a sheeps failure the Shepherd’s fault?

I would say not.

It is the Shepherds fault. The shepherd has one job.

Read Psalm 23.

 

[Grip Docility]

It is the Shepherds fault. The shepherd has one job.

Read Psalm 23.

And yet, the Sheep left the fold by choice.

Is choice plausible?

 

[Grip Docility]

That’s basically Open Theism. It’s heretical.

Never. To say God is Linear in thinking is limiting God.

Does the Almighty have to think on a timeline like we do to fit our ideas?

Open theism says God doesn’t know all. That’s not what I said.

I am a heretic to even Open Theism.

 

[Hammster]

And yet, the Sheep left the fold by choice.

Is choice plausible?

If Christ’s sheep leaves, He goes after it. It’s what shepherds do.

 

[Grip Docility]

If Christ’s sheep leaves, He goes after it. It’s what shepherds do.

Then what of 1 John 1:8?

Why did He go after not just “the folds” sins, but all sins.

The contrast present makes this irrefutable.

 

[Hammster]

Never. To say God is Linear in thinking is limiting God.

Does the Almighty have to think on a timeline like we do to fit our ideas?

Open theism says God doesn’t know all. That’s not what I said.

I am a heretic to even Open Theism.

“reacts to every tiny variance in everything that connects in real time to all events”

That does not describe an omniscient God.

But I fear we are digressing.

 

[Hammster]

Then what of 1 John 1:8?

Why did He go after not just “the folds” sins, but all sins.

The contrast present makes this irrefutable.

What does that verse have to do with the discussion?

 

[Grip Docility]

“reacts to every tiny variance in everything that connects in real time to all events”

That does not describe an omniscient God.

But I fear we are digressing.

Are we? I would say not. Predestination aside from God Pre-Destining Messiah from the foundations of creation to offer Salvation to All is the main point of this thread. Is it not?

God doesn’t Love all. That’s the statement.

I’m looking for the root of a God who IS Love not Loving, in doctrine. I would say we are right on point.

 

[sdowney717]

Then what of 1 John 1:8?

Why did He go after not just “the folds” sins, but all sins.

The contrast present makes this irrefutable.

Christian believers may still sin, it's just that they are eternally forgiven their sins. While those of the world die in their sins, but those born of God have eternal life, as God is the Father and they are His sons and daughters, so then they are of God and also partake of His nature, they will bear the image of the heavenly MAN Christ someday.

 

[sdowney717]

Are we? I would say not. Predestination aside from God Pre-Destining Messiah from the foundations of creation to offer Salvation to All is the main point of this thread. Is it not?

God doesn’t Love all. That’s the statement.

I’m looking for the root of a God who IS Love not Loving, in doctrine. I would say we are right on point.

Christ was preordained, all believers were predestined.

 

[Grip Docility]

What does that verse have to do with the discussion?

Greater Love hath no man, than He lay down His life for His friends.

And it shows He propitiated for capitol A, capitol L, capitol L.

 

[Grip Docility]

Christ was preordained, all believers were predestined.

Oh, and the reprobate? Were they created for hell, too?

 

[Hammster]

Greater Love hath no man, than He lay down His life for His friends.

And it shows He propitiated for capitol A, capitol L, capitol L.

Yes, all of His friends. All of the sheep.

 

[sdowney717]

Oh, and the reprobate? We’re they created for hell, too?

Now your getting to it!
Reprobation must exist as the opposite of chosen for glorification.

 

[Grip Docility]

Yes, all of His friends. All of the sheep.

Then we agree 1 John 1:8 states ALL?

It says not just for our sins, but the sins of the whole world.

Whole World. That’s all.

So Daddy is after All.

After all, how many does He desire to be saved and not lost?

Peter wrote the answer.