God does not love everyone and the Bible says so (Change My Mind)

[razzelflabben]

I am feeling the opposite of Biblical agape Love in your response, and it makes no sense. Biblical agape Love makes distinctions and if flows from the attributes of God, God is love, the source of all true love, and without Him there is no selfless love. Nowhere did I "equate Love with hate or indifference" at no point did I do any such thing. I did just the opposite in saying; "I do not love every individual from all races of people" in this I made a distinction from a general to a specific. Sorry you could not appreciate it, guess I should have expected as much.

huh...first I said it sounded like you were...that in no way is a prideful comment but rather one that accepts I might have misunderstood....secondly if you did not intend to compare Love and hate or indifference, what was your intent? I mean that invitation to clarify was built into my response but apparently you missed it.

 

[razzelflabben]

Justice refers to an ought and a duty to that ought. It entails a record, that is, the identification that a duty has not fulfilled.

look at it this way...a judge hands out justice or injustice right? Does the judge after handing out the sentence hold the record, or does the law hold the record? What judge do you know that sentences someone then holds that crime still in their own being?

 

[bekkilyn]

God's nature is such that he cannot abide sin. He may love people very much even if they reject him, but if they do not seek atonement through Jesus Christ to be cleansed of their sin, they cannot be in the presence of God. Thus, they remain separated from God, much to his great sorrow. He's provided a way for us to be reconciled to him, but we have free will to choose or reject.

 

[98cwitr]

How does justice hold a record? Justice is a carrying out of the law, as I said in the first of my posts, it is the law that keeps the record not God.

And what is that law in your understanding?

 

[Sanoy]

look at it this way...a judge hands out justice or injustice right? Does the judge after handing out the sentence hold the record, or does the law hold the record? What judge do you know that sentences someone then holds that crime still in their own being?

The judge. The record is something that is observed, or apprehended only in one's mind. It exists as a body of objective facts that are merely transmitted by words on paper.

As far as "The Law" in the religious sense I would need to think about that some more. My worry is that the Law is being reified. Is it simply a record of God's commands or is it an active force of it's own that can add a record to itself. I would need further study on that but my impression is that we should not treat it as an actual power in itself. I realize Paul might speak like that but I'm not sure he is being literal about that, though he could be.

 

[98cwitr]

God's nature is such that he cannot abide sin. He may love people very much even if they reject him, but if they do not seek atonement through Jesus Christ to be cleansed of their sin, they cannot be in the presence of God. Thus, they remain separated from God, much to his great sorrow. He's provided a way for us to be reconciled to him, but we have free will to choose or reject.

Then how was the devil in the presence of God in Job 1?

 

[razzelflabben]

And what is that law in your understanding?

There are several different laws recorded in scripture, usually referred to as the Mosaic law, the 10 commandments, and the NT law of Love but what I am referring to is the natural law of a holy God wanting to have a relationship with an unholy people. This law requires blood/death for sin...that is separation from God because unholy men cannot fellowship with a holy God thus death is what the law demands....

 

[CodyFaith]

God tells us to love our enemies, but doesn't love them himself? Here is scripture.

Matthew 5:43-45
Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.
But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.

He explains why we are to love our enemies, and that by doing so we are his children, because he himself loves the unjust and causes the sun to rise on them. If read in context it all flows and the answer is that God does love the unjust.

 

[razzelflabben]

God's nature is such that he cannot abide sin. He may love people very much even if they reject him, but if they do not seek atonement through Jesus Christ to be cleansed of their sin, they cannot be in the presence of God. Thus, they remain separated from God, much to his great sorrow. He's provided a way for us to be reconciled to him, but we have free will to choose or reject.

which is the natural law that holds us accountable to our sins

 

[razzelflabben]

The judge. The record is something that is observed, or apprehended only in one's mind. It exists as a body of objective facts that are merely transmitted by words on paper.

yep

As far as "The Law" in the religious sense I would need to think about that some more. My worry is that the Law is being reified. Is it simply a record of God's commands or is it an active force of it's own that can add a record to itself. I would need further study on that but my impression is that we should not treat it as an actual power in itself. I realize Paul might speak like that but I'm not sure he is being literal about that, though he could be.

I'll pray God shows you truth whatever that truth is.

 

[Apologetic_Warrior]

huh...first I said it sounded like you were...that in no way is a prideful comment but rather one that accepts I might have misunderstood....secondly if you did not intend to compare Love and hate or indifference, what was your intent? I mean that invitation to clarify was built into my response but apparently you missed it.

My intent was to illustrate distinctions in love, distinctions we make even as human beings. The contempt for the comment is telling. I left an invitation for someone to give a Divine perspective, to which you passed, and accused. Please do not mistake honesty and truth for pride, especially from one small passing comment, thanks.

 

[razzelflabben]

My intent was to illustrate distinctions in love, distinctions we make even as human beings. The contempt for the comment is telling. I left an invitation for someone to give a Divine perspective, to which you passed, and accused. Please do not mistake honesty and truth for pride, especially from one small passing comment, thanks.

How is an understanding that the opposite of biblical Love is pride not a "divine perspective" since it is straight out of scripture and at the same time rarely understood by the general believer? By straight out of scripture I mean that scripture equates Love and humility all the time, I have a whole study on it I can share if you like along with the best definition I can find.

 

[98cwitr]

Isn't it the law that is keeping the record of wrongs? The law is how we even know if we are wrong and the law only came because of Adam's sin...so isn't Adam's sin the only sin God is recording, all other is recorded by the law.

And who mandates the law?

 

[98cwitr]

Paul spoke to brothers means alredy forgiven people , he holds no records against them , but with the wicked ( not forgiven ) he is angry every day .
Psalms 7:11
God judgeth the righteous, and God is angry with the wicked every day.

God loved world that he gave his Son for it you know John 3:16 but that does not mean he stops being The Judge , after grace period is over he will make sure people reap what they sow .

Please, if you are going to quote John 3:16, include 17-20 in your context.

 

[98cwitr]

There are several different laws recorded in scripture, usually referred to as the Mosaic law, the 10 commandments, and the NT law of Love but what I am referring to is the natural law of a holy God wanting to have a relationship with an unholy people. This law requires blood/death for sin...that is separation from God because unholy men cannot fellowship with a holy God thus death is what the law demands....

What is the current and applicable law to us today?

 

[Grip Docility]

My intent was to illustrate distinctions in love, distinctions we make even as human beings. The contempt for the comment is telling. I left an invitation for someone to give a Divine perspective, to which you passed, and accused. Please do not mistake honesty and truth for pride, especially from one small passing comment, thanks.

James 2 identifies discriminate Love as a sin. Do you disagree?

 

[razzelflabben]

And who mandates the law?

I just said that, the nature between a holy God and an unholy people

 

[razzelflabben]

What is the current and applicable law to us today?

the natural law is always in affect, the Mosaic Law gave way to the NT law of Love so it really depends on what you are talking about.

 

[Grip Docility]

What is the current and applicable law to us today?

Didn’t some Rich Guy have to answer that question?

 

[Hammster]

Expanding from this very popular thread, I'd like to provide contrary evidence to the majority vote with the following scripture that we all seem to hold as a universal truth that is contextual accurate when talking about what love is and isn't:

1 Cor. 13:

4 Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5 It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6 Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

So if this is our understood standard where God is Love, then how can we reject Universalism in that people go to hell, but are still loved by God.

I think we all can agree on the following:

>People go to hell because of their sin
>People are not forgiven of their sin due to disbelief and lack of real saving faith

If the above is universally true, then it stands to reason that God is keeping a record of their wrongdoing, but we see from the above accepted definition of love, that real love keeps no record of wrongs, therefore if Love = no record of wrongs, then all sin is forgiven if God loves you. If your sin is not forgiven, then it is still apparent, damning, and recorded. Therefore God, in keeping a record of your sin and withholding forgiveness, cannot love you as love is defined above.

I welcome you to change my mind on this. I've prayed over it and have yet to have a change in my own understanding.

I think forgiveness happened at the cross. It’s what allowed God to freely regenerate and justify and sanctify and glorify those with whom He chose to show His love to.