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God CREATES EVIL!!!!

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nephilimiyr

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I'm a little surprised that no one has brought this passage up yet but I believe it pertains to what is being discussed here.

Matthew 10:34-35, Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.

As it has been pointed out here by daveleau, the word "evil" can mean several different things.

Linguistically, the word for evil does not mean moral evil all the time but has several meanings. It is often used to mean strife, adversity, displeasure, calamity, grief and harm. It also means war.


AMEN?
 
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JaimeMan

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Ol Moth said:
I beleive our God isn't a God of slavery, so he gave his creatures a free will, so they had the choice to follow him, instead of being puppets. so his angels have free choice imho.
and when Lucifer was proud enough to put himself above God he was threw out of heaven with a third of the angels. so that could be called evil. the choice against God. because God wants voluntary Love and Worship. and no worshipping slaves.
my 5 cents..
I totally agree with you. That is why he put the tree of knowledge of good and evil into the garden. He could've made man a machine...but He didn't. He gave him a choice. God wanted His creation that was made in His image to serve Him out of a free will of choice, not as slaves. He knew that man would sin, but He still wanted man for His glory. That is why he sent Jesus, so that we may be with Him in eternity.

Jaime:):thumbsup:
 
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Debi1967

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jaimeman,
Who do you think the Author of Evil is and who do you believe is the promoter of Evil is? And most importantly do you believe that the Lord is Evil or do we choose the Evil that is the counterbalance to good? Does man as they are now stillhave the propensity for both good and evil? Thus because of this, they still have the Free Will to choose to accept the Lord or reject the Lord? then if they have accepted him, later then reject him because of this propensity that will not be removed until we are washed completely clean of it? And when do you believe that is done...
 
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FreeinChrist

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daveleau said:
Linguistically, the word for evil does not mean moral evil all the time but has several meanings. It is often used to mean strife, adversity, displeasure, calamity, grief and harm. It also means war. These are created in the response to sin. In looking at theology, you can not look at one translated verse to get the full idea of God. James 1:3 is a conflicting piece of Scripture if you take the wrong word for this verse (evil). Seeing this, it is highly likely that the author did not intend evil as the meaning, but another meaning. In this instance, the KJV is wrong and the NIV, NKJV, HCSB, and even the NLT are better translations.

Some of the other English words used for this word in the OT are: sore, wretched, calamity, bad, adversity, ill, temples (anatomically speaking), trouble.

This is one reason that I also highly advocate study from more than one version of the Bible. This sort of issue could be avoided by studying the entire Bible and by looking at several different translations to find the best one (not the one best suited for your issue, but the most likely intended meaning).

Other verses this interpretation directly contradicts:
Ezra 9:15, Psalms 7:9, 116:5, Pro 21:12, Dan 9:14 (among many others)
Good post!! :thumbsup:
 
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JaimeMan

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jaimeman,
Who do you think the Author of Evil is and who do you believe is the promoter of Evil is? And most importantly do you believe that the Lord is Evil or do we choose the Evil that is the counterbalance to good? Does man as they are now stillhave the propensity for both good and evil? Thus because of this, they still have the Free Will to choose to accept the Lord or reject the Lord? then if they have accepted him, later then reject him because of this propensity that will not be removed until we are washed completely clean of it? And when do you believe that is done...
Of course God isn't evil! :) Evil...more specifically sin.... came about through the fall of man (But Satan sinned first as recorded in the Bible) God has control over it though. He always has and always will have ultimate control. And even still, what man intends, (Maybe even sees as) evil, God will work out for the good of those who love Him. :) I am not saying that God is or does Evil, just that he has ultimate authority over it. :thumbsup:
 
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Debi1967

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JaimeMan said:
Of course God isn't evil! :) Evil...more specifically sin.... came about through the fall of man (But Satan sinned first as recorded in the Bible) God has control over it though. He always has and always will have ultimate control. And even still, what man intends, (Maybe even sees as) evil, God will work out for the good of those who love Him. :) I am not saying that God is or does Evil, just that he has ultimate authority over it. :thumbsup:
then please reconcile these Scriptures for me...

2Co 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of unbelievers, that the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should not shine unto them.

Rev 12:9 And that great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, who is called the devil and Satan, who seduceth the whole world. And he was cast unto the earth: and his angels were thrown down with him.


Did God Author Evil, in the fact that it was created, it was always a choice within us,
even the Angels, and therefore, because of this we now suffer because of it's effects?

But does He control it now? Does He control it or does the one who is the originator of it's usage control it? Thus the reason why we have to choose inbetween the two to begin with... not that this was not seen by the Lord but it was not when He authored it His intent for it... Though knowing that it would be used as such, and because in his Wisdom and because He does not want robots to worship Him, then it stands to reason the need that it had to be Authored.... And also because He knew of those that would choose it then set into the original plan the way of redeeming us from the sin to begin with so that we could have a chance at what was originally intended...
 
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JaimeMan

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2Co 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of unbelievers, that the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should not shine unto them.
Yup, unsaved people are blinded by their sin. They can only find God by having a revelation of Him, which can come from witnessing, reading the Bible, hearing a message, a Christian song...whatever.

Rev 12:9 And that great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, who is called the devil and Satan, who seduceth the whole world. And he was cast unto the earth: and his angels were thrown down with him.


Yup, satan is out there being the prince of the air and all, seeking whom he may devour and all that Jazz. He can do stuff, but only what God allows...(See how that is in HIS control) Great Example :JOB///Had a hedge of protection around Him and Satan couldn't touch em' unleess God removed it....God is pretty awesome!:thumbsup:
 
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Debi1967

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JaimeMan said:

Yup, unsaved people are blinded by their sin. They can only find God by having a revelation of Him, which can come from witnessing, reading the Bible, hearing a message, a Christian song...whatever.



Yup, satan is out there being the prince of the air and all, seeking whom he may devour and all that Jazz. He can do stuff, but only what God allows...(See how that is in HIS control) Great Example :JOB///Had a hedge of protection around Him and Satan couldn't touch em' unleess God removed it....God is pretty awesome!:thumbsup:
You are still failing to see the point... sorry maybe it is me that is not making it clear enough... WE are offered this protection because of our belief and Faith... But I will ask this of you then is it then possible to submit to the Devil after we have recieved this protection? Can we by choice still choose Evil?
 
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JaimeMan

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You are still failing to see the point... sorry maybe it is me that is not making it clear enough... WE are offered this protection because of our belief and Faith... But I will ask this of you then is it then possible to submit to the Devil after we have recieved this protection? Can we by choice still choose Evil?
Submit to the Devil if we are truly saved? No wayyy...(Plus the Devil is only one person...so figuratively)
Can we still sin? Of course, we still have our flesh until Christ gives us our new glorified bodies. We are not perfect.
But I think you are still referring to something else:

Simply: (As Grudem says)

God uses all things to fulfill his purposes and even uses evil for his glory and for our good. (Gen 50:20, Rom. 8:28; Prov. 16:4; Ps. 76:10; Rom. 9:14-24)

Neverthelesss, God never does evil and is never to be blamed for evil. (James 1:13-14; Acts 2:23, 4:27-28;)

God rightfully blames and judges moral creatures for the evil they do.
(Isaiah 66:3-4)

Evil is real, not an illusion, and we should never do evil , for it will always harm us and others. (Matt. 6:13, James 5:19-20; 1 Pete 2:11)

AND; In spite of the foregoing statements, we have to come to the point where we confess that we do not understand how it is that God can ordain that we carry out evil deeds and yet hold us accountable for them and not be blamed for them.

God knows everything real and possible in a single and eternal act and he knows the evil that comes by man's nature, yet he works with us for our end good, that we may be with Him in eternity.
:)




 
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JaimeMan

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debiwebi said:
jaime is it possible to get you to lessen your font just touch.... I do not think it is necessary for it to be that big for you to get your point across ....
Sorry....I have macular degeneration and it makes it easier for me to see.:holy:
 
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Debi1967

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JaimeMan said:
Sorry....I have macular degeneration and it makes it easier for me to see.:holy:
Oh sorry then no problem my roommate has the same problem... make it as big as you want....:blush: :sorry:
 
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RhetorTheo

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jbarcher said:
God's judgments cause grief, yes? Some of His judgments were rather calamatous, yes? That's how it's better; it's far better. It's the difference between a kind of pantheistic outlook; God being responsible for good and whatever goes against good, and creation that has rebelled.

God's words are very clear. God creates light and peace, as well as darkness and evil. God creates all of it. He's talking about opposites, the furthest extremes, and says he creates it all. You are attempting to twist God's words to fit the desires of your flesh, and to deny God his nature.

God brings rain upon the heads of the righteous as well as the wicked.
 
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