God Created Evil, period!

[cksilas]

Consider the 4 attributes of GOD, Omnipotent (all powerful) Omnipresent, (is every where at every time) Omniscient, (all knowing) and eternal which means was there from beginning and will be there forever.
With these great attributes of God, its hard to imagine how evil ever came to be, that is as we know it to be. Most people believe that evil (devil) is an arch RIVAL of good (God). Such a believe is illogical when you consider an all powerful God, all knowing and perfect God. Which means everything he does is PERFECT with not even a slight error. We (esp. Christian) believe that devil was God creature. Then again we say that this creature rebelled against his maker! Check this out,what was made with PERFECTION turned to be IMPERFECT and rebelled against his designer. (rebellion is no doubt an imperfection) Such a believe is not only illogical but means that God made an error in his creation-which is not possible! Even men never quarrel with their tools! We forget that nothing surprises God cause he knows the future. U cant impress God by being too righteous, he made u that way! According to an Omniscient God FREE WILL doesn't exist.
So how did this creature 'turned against' God? The ONLY logical explanation is that everything was God's plan. God designed both good and evil, he is above all, rules over everything. The devil is not a rival of GOD but a creature working according to how it was designd to work.
My argument is evident in the bible, we can see this when God sent an evil spirit 2 deceive Saul (1 Sam 16:23), also when demons asks permission God 2 test Jobs faith. Then their is this part in 2 Samuel chapter 24, where God 'incites' David to take census, but the repetition of the same event in 1 Chronicles 21:1 says, 'Satan caused David...' Which means that God can use Satan to fulfill his wishes.
This evidence clearly shows that presence of evil in the world is part of Gods design to balance things in nature...just the way he created light n darkness, pain n pleasure, flowers n thorns, birds n snakes, butterflies n scorpions,....

And if God absolutely had nothing to do with evil, then why call him God?

 

[BrendanMark]

God reveals himself in the contradiction and the protest of Christ’s passion to be against all that is exalted and beautiful and good, all that the dehumanized man seeks for himself and therefore perverts. So God here is not known through his works in reality, but through his sufferings in the passiveness of faith, which allows God to work on it: killing in order to make alive, judging in order to set free. So his knowledge is achieved not by the guiding thread of analogies from earth to heaven, but on the contrary, through contradiction, sorrow and suffering. To know God means to endure God. To know God in the cross of Christ is a crucifying form of knowledge, because it shatters everything to which a man can build, both his works and his knowledge of reality, and precisely in so doing sets him free.
Moltmann, Jürgen – The Crucified God [Fortress 1974 p. 212]

The one who knows God in the lowliness, weakness and dying of Christ does not know him in the dreamed-of exaltation and divinity of the man who seeks God, but in the humanity which he has abandoned, rejected and despised. And that brings to nothing his dreamed-of equality with God, which has dehumanized him, and restores to him his humanity, which the true God made his own.
Moltmann, Jürgen – The Crucified God [Fortress 1974 p. 213]

Finally, a God who is only omnipotent is in himself an incomplete being, for he cannot experience helplessness and powerlessness. Omnipotence can indeed be longed for and worshipped by helpless men, but omnipotence is never loved; it is only feared. What sort of being, then , would be a God who was only ‘almighty’? He would be a being without experience, a being without destiny and a being loved by no one.
Moltmann, Jürgen – The Crucified God [Fortress 1974 p. 223]

 

[Simonline]

God reveals himself in the contradiction and the protest of Christ’s passion to be against all that is exalted and beautiful and good, all that the dehumanized man seeks for himself and therefore perverts. So God here is not known through his works in reality, but through his sufferings in the passiveness of faith, which allows God to work on it: killing in order to make alive, judging in order to set free. So his knowledge is achieved not by the guiding thread of analogies from earth to heaven, but on the contrary, through contradiction, sorrow and suffering. To know God means to endure God. To know God in the cross of Christ is a crucifying form of knowledge, because it shatters everything to which a man can build, both his works and his knowledge of reality, and precisely in so doing sets him free.
Moltmann, Jürgen – The Crucified God [Fortress 1974 p. 212]

The one who knows God in the lowliness, weakness and dying of Christ does not know him in the dreamed-of exaltation and divinity of the man who seeks God, but in the humanity which he has abandoned, rejected and despised. And that brings to nothing his dreamed-of equality with God, which has dehumanized him, and restores to him his humanity, which the true God made his own.
Moltmann, Jürgen – The Crucified God [Fortress 1974 p. 213]

Finally, a God who is only omnipotent is in himself an incomplete being, for he cannot experience helplessness and powerlessness. Omnipotence can indeed be longed for and worshipped by helpless men, but omnipotence is never loved; it is only feared. What sort of being, then , would be a God who was only ‘almighty’? He would be a being without experience, a being without destiny and a being loved by no one.
Moltmann, Jürgen – The Crucified God [Fortress 1974 p. 223]

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You have been warned.

Simonline.

 

[2 King]

first of all....Evil is a relationship...so it can't be created.

 

[holyrokker]

first of all....Evil is a relationship...so it can't be created.

Evil, good, sin, righteousness: All of these are states of the heart. They are not "things" that are created, born, inherited, etc.

 

[AmericanCatholic]

If God is perfectly all good, how did He manage to create something he is perfectly not? Or is God either not all good or perfectly good?

 

[Nachtjager]

Unless I'm missing something here, when God is speaking to Cyrus in Isaiah 45, the text flat out says He created good and evil, light and darkness, triumph and tragedy (depends on your translation) and "there is none other than Me" and "I alone do all these things." Seems pretty cut and dried that God did CREATE evil and sin for some reason. I don't know why, but it would appear He saw a need for it. Perhaps so we could choose for ourselves which course to choose? That would be a Calvinism debate I suppose...

Take care and God bless!

 

[sungaunga]

Unless I'm missing something here, when God is speaking to Cyrus in Isaiah 45, the text flat out says He created good and evil, light and darkness, triumph and tragedy (depends on your translation) and "there is none other than Me" and "I alone do all these things." Seems pretty cut and dried that God did CREATE evil and sin for some reason. I don't know why, but it would appear He saw a need for it. Perhaps so we could choose for ourselves which course to choose? That would be a Calvinism debate I suppose...

Take care and God bless!

Scripture clearly tells us when God created everything, it was "very good" Scripture is replete with the fact that he is not the author of evil. "God cannot be tempted by evil, and He Himself does not tempt anyone." God is light, in Him there is NO darkness. "God is not the author of confusion"

yes, that's a verse a lot of people seem to trip over. But the new american tarnslation gives us a better sense of that verse. "I am the Lord, and there is no other, the One forming light and creating darkness, causing well-being and creating calamity" In other words, he creates the judgement for those that are wicked. That we can't deny, it's all over the Bible.

Evil is not from God, it's from the fallen creature. As someone mentioned, Sin is not some "Thing." It is simply a lack of moral perfection. From the perfect standard of God.

After all this though, I just want to say, God did ordain evil. Yes, he allowed it, and it was part of his eternal decree. In other words, it did not catch him by surprise. Everything God ordains is in the end, for his Glory. And every evil in the world will ultimately in the end, work together for God's Glorious purpose.

hope that helps ^^

 

[lawtonfogle]

I program a robot to murder. I am the killer, not the robot.


I am a prison guard. I let a rapist go free, who goes and rapes and kills many women and children. Am I innocent of this? Especially if I knew this was going to happen?

Also...

English (KJV) (Help) Strong's Root Form (Hebrew) Tense I form h3335 יצר yatsar

the light, h216 אור 'owr and create h1254 ברא bara'

darkness: h2822 חשך choshek I make h6213 עשה `asah

peace, h7965 שלום shalowm and create h1254 ברא bara'

evil: h7451 רע ra` I the LORD h3068 יהוה Yĕhovah do h6213 עשה `asah

all these [things].


What does 'ra' mean?

Strong's H7451 - ra`
רע
Transliteration

ra`

Pronunciation

rah (Key)

Part of Speech

adjective


Root Word (Etymology)

from H7489
​

TWOT Reference

2191a,2191c​

Outline of Biblical Usage
adj
1) bad, evil
a) bad, disagreeable, malignant
b) bad, unpleasant, evil (giving pain, unhappiness, misery)
c) evil, displeasing
d) bad (of its kind - land, water, etc)
e) bad (of value)
f) worse than, worst (comparison)
g) sad, unhappy
h) evil (hurtful)
i) bad, unkind (vicious in disposition)
j) bad, evil, wicked (ethically)
1) in general, of persons, of thoughts
2) deeds, actions
n m
2) evil, distress, misery, injury, calamity
a) evil, distress, adversity
b) evil, injury, wrong
c) evil (ethical)
n f
3) evil, misery, distress, injury
a) evil, misery, distress
b) evil, injury, wrong
c) evil (ethical)



Authorized Version (KJV) Translation Count — Total: 663
AV — evil 442, wickedness 59, wicked 25, mischief 21, hurt 20, bad 13, trouble 10, sore 9, affliction 6, ill 5, adversity 4, favoured 3, harm 3, naught 3, noisome 2, grievous 2, sad 2, misc 34




Many people say this is just natural disasters. They are changing the Bible into what they want it to be, and even if what they said was true... then God still is directly responsible for all the evil which is not the result of man.

 

[lawtonfogle]

I program a robot to murder. I am the killer, not the robot.


I am a prison guard. I let a rapist go free, who goes and rapes and kills many women and children. Am I innocent of this? Especially if I knew this was going to happen?

Also...

English (KJV) (Help) Strong's Root Form (Hebrew) Tense I form h3335 יצר yatsar

the light, h216 אור 'owr and create h1254 ברא bara'

darkness: h2822 חשך choshek I make h6213 עשה `asah

peace, h7965 שלום shalowm and create h1254 ברא bara'

evil: h7451 רע ra` I the LORD h3068 יהוה Yĕhovah do h6213 עשה `asah

all these [things].


What does 'ra' mean?

Strong's H7451 - ra`
רע
Transliteration

ra`

Pronunciation

rah (Key)

Part of Speech

adjective


Root Word (Etymology)

from H7489
​

TWOT Reference

2191a,2191c​

Outline of Biblical Usage
adj
1) bad, evil
a) bad, disagreeable, malignant
b) bad, unpleasant, evil (giving pain, unhappiness, misery)
c) evil, displeasing
d) bad (of its kind - land, water, etc)
e) bad (of value)
f) worse than, worst (comparison)
g) sad, unhappy
h) evil (hurtful)
i) bad, unkind (vicious in disposition)
j) bad, evil, wicked (ethically)
1) in general, of persons, of thoughts
2) deeds, actions
n m
2) evil, distress, misery, injury, calamity
a) evil, distress, adversity
b) evil, injury, wrong
c) evil (ethical)
n f
3) evil, misery, distress, injury
a) evil, misery, distress
b) evil, injury, wrong
c) evil (ethical)



Authorized Version (KJV) Translation Count — Total: 663
AV — evil 442, wickedness 59, wicked 25, mischief 21, hurt 20, bad 13, trouble 10, sore 9, affliction 6, ill 5, adversity 4, favoured 3, harm 3, naught 3, noisome 2, grievous 2, sad 2, misc 34




Many people say this is just natural disasters. They are changing the Bible into what they want it to be, and even if what they said was true... then God still is directly responsible for all the evil which is not the result of man.

 

[sungaunga]

I program a robot to murder. I am the killer, not the robot.


I am a prison guard. I let a rapist go free, who goes and rapes and kills many women and children. Am I innocent of this? Especially if I knew this was going to happen?

hey lawtonfogle

well, first of all, God doesn't make you do evil. "Let no one say when he is tempted, "I am being tempted by God"; for God cannot be tempted by evil, and He Himself does not tempt anyone." Brother, that analogy is wrong from the start. If God made me kill, then yes of-course God is responsible for who can resist God? Everyone owns a kitchen knife. That manufacturer is not a killer because some chose to kill with it. God never forces the sinner to sin.

By the way, your second analogy assumes again that God is the force behind the evil committed. He's not and never will be. That rapist is responsible. So you ask why God made people knowing the evil they'd commit? I'm going to make this real short. To Glorify himself by saving some and displaying his infinite Love and infinite Mercy and to Glorify himself by passing over some [by the way we deserve this] and displaying his perfect Holy Justice and perfect Holy Wrath.

Brother, lets Praise God for all his attributes.

 

[DonnyT]

God is an all powerful all knowing God. What else in the universe would such a being want? Nothing else but true love and worship as explained in John 4:23. I believe true love cannot exist unless it is of one's own free will. Free will cannot exist unless there is something else to choose besides God. Imagine a universe without Satan or evil. We would all be as pure as God. We would be like perhaps the beings described in Revelation 4: 7-11, who worship Him continuously, night and day. In order for there to be free will, there must be an option. That option is Satan; God's complete opposite. If God is everything that is good and pure and holy, Satan is everything that God is not. Jesus said, “He who is not with me, is against me.” So did God create an angel for this purpose? Perhaps. Did that angel become Satan? Perhaps.


In Genesis it says there were two trees in the Garden of Eden. The Tree of Life and the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil. This second tree had the serpent in it. How did it get there? Where did the it come from? If we believe that God sees the infinite future and infinite past in one instance, why would God knowingly create anything that he knew would betray him? Surely God must have known that this serpent would cause the downfall of mankind? Unless the serpent and the downfall together were to serve a purpose. Perhaps that purpose was because God wanted us to understand good and evil and have eternal life with Him. Perhaps God understood that we could never understand evil without being separated from Him; and thus could never gain eternal life by accepting Jesus. After all, how can we understand eternity without understanding death? How can we understand the awe and Glory of God without ever understanding His absence? To understand good and evil and still choose good is perhaps God's greatest gift.


Does this mean God created evil?
In my opinion, yes. God is all powerful and uncreated. Therefore all things must have started with Him and are under his control.


So how can God be a loving god if He allows evil?
If we understand the broader scope of evil we understand that ultimately God brings about greater good through evil; the kind of “good” that God desires.


If Satan fulfills God's purpose, doesn't that in fact make Satan good?
In my opinion, Satan is by no means good. I believe Satan is exactly as God planned him or it to be. Satan's ultimate purpose may be to bring about greater good but he is still evil.
.
Why then is Satan regarded in such a negative way in the Bible?
I believe God influences mankind to a certain degree. It makes sense that if God wants us to seek Him yet still wants it to be of our own freewill; of course God would tell us Satan is a “thief and a murderer” or the “father of lies”.

 

[AmericanCatholic]

If the goodness of God requires the context of evil, how is a perfectly good God all-powerful?