Global warming and the end

[Shocker]

Ok, so Im trying to make a checklist of things I can do to cut down on GW.

My lawnmower is gas powered, does anyone have an idea how good those electric mowers are?

Also, my dog farts ALOT, and Im wondering if I should change his food so the methane isn't converted to co2, thus contributing further to this global nightmare we know as GW, some have even called it the "Great tribulation".

Help?

 

[Shocker]

is Tim Ball a climatologist or not?

How would I know? I didn't even read the article.

 

[eclipsenow]

The geologist on Limbaugh made it very clear why you did not have to be a climate scientist to realize the subjectivity of "climate science."

Peer-reviewed sources and you are not friends are they? Just keep wishing it and click your ruby slippers together 3 times, and you'll be right. Because you already know you are, and don't need any evidence from the real world to confirm it.

 

[eclipsenow]

How would I know? I didn't even read the article.

OK, your last umpteen posts have just been trolling so you're on my ignore list. Goodbye.

 

[Shocker]

OK, your last umpteen posts have just been trolling so you're on my ignore list. Goodbye.

This thread is nothing more than a trolling apparatus touting a known conspiracy about something that has nothing to do with Biblical eschatology.


Can you show me Global warming in scripture?

Surely something this significant is mentioned..

 

[Biblewriter]

Peer-reviewed sources and you are not friends are they? Just keep wishing it and click your ruby slippers together 3 times, and you'll be right. Because you already know you are, and don't need any evidence from the real world to confirm it.

The truth is, the evidence from the real world disproves it.

 

[eclipsenow]

The truth is, the evidence from the real world disproves it.

Assertions are not evidence. People here are forgetting that.

 

[eclipsenow]

This thread is nothing more than a trolling apparatus touting a known conspiracy about something that has nothing to do with Biblical eschatology.


Can you show me Global warming in scripture?

Surely something this significant is mentioned..

Wow, something on topic before you go back into 5 straight trolls in a row?

Please show me guns, germ-warfare, national inflation policy, nuclear power, nuclear warfare, transport policy, car accident policy, nuclear waste policy and modern family planning technology policy in the bible?

 

[Shocker]

Wow, something on topic before you go back into 5 straight trolls in a row?

Please show me guns, germ-warfare, national inflation policy, nuclear power, nuclear warfare, transport policy and modern family planning technology policy in the bible?

Absolutely.

But its give and take, if you wanna play nice..

Show me global warming in scripture, and Ill gladly show you all of the scriptural evidence I have for your request.

Fair?

 

[eclipsenow]

Absolutely.

But its give and take, if you wanna play nice..

Show me global warming in scripture, and Ill gladly show you all of the scriptural evidence I have for your request.

Fair?

It's in the same place that covers all the other issues I raised: Christian ethics derived from the bible that are then applied to other issues in the modern world. If you're going to insist that everything you think about has to actually, specifically be spelt out for you in the bible, so that you can follow it like a pedantic robot, then you won't have anything to say about gambling, chemical warfare, cloning, genetic engineering, nuclear bombs, modern nations (the old world only had city states), modern contraceptic techniques, TV, pornography, telephone calls and other modern inventions.

 

[Shocker]

It's in the same place that covers all the other issues I raised: Christian ethics derived from the bible that are then applied to other issues in the modern world. If you're going to insist that everything you think about has to actually, specifically be spelt out for you in the bible, so that you can follow it like a pedantic robot, then you won't have anything to say about gambling, chemical warfare, cloning, genetic engineering, nuclear bombs, modern nations (the old world only had city states), modern contraceptic techniques, TV, pornography, telephone calls and other modern inventions.

So there is a world scale global warming crisis, and scripture doesn't mention this at all.

Is this what you telling me?

Because I promised already to give you proper reply, one you've requested, but all I ask is that you show me in the Bible how I can assimilate an understanding of where to find global warming.

If its in fact as critical as you are making it sound.

Because nothing in scripture seems to affirm your contention.

 

[eclipsenow]

So there is a world scale global warming crisis, and scripture doesn't mention this at all.

Is this what you telling me?

Because I promised already to give you proper reply, one you've requested, but all I ask is that you show me in the Bible how I can assimilate an understanding of where to find global warming.

If its in fact as critical as you are making it sound.

Because nothing in scripture seems to affirm your contention.

It won't be world-wide, will it? Every nation and economy will be touched, but some might even prosper out of it. EG: Canada's agriculture could improve while America's implodes. It sounds like you're turning global warming into an eschatological event like the end of the human race, where as it is more like the Roman Civilisation collapsing. Tell me where the bible predits Rome collapsing, and we might have something to talk about. In other words, God doesn't guarantee our civilisations' success. He hands us over to the consequences of our actions: see Romans 1.

But in effect you are avoiding what I have asked you about Christians having a policy or ethic for gambling and pornography and nuclear missiles. If they ain't in the bible, we don't discuss them hey? So it's okay if you're in business to dump lead all over your neighbour's property, because the bible doesn't say much about lead poisoning.

 

[eclipsenow]

Dumb things Tim Ball pretends to know: 1

CO2, despite being a minor element of the Earth’s atmosphere, is essential for all life on Earth because it is the food that nourishes all vegetation. The Earth has passed through many periods of high levels of CO2 and many cycles of warming and cooling that are part of the life of the planet.

Sorry Tim Ball, but climatologists already know about a variety of climate periods on earth's history: if you had bothered to read some climate science instead of pretending you were a climatologist, you might know this. Climate scientists have to account for cold ice ages through to the hotter, higher volcanism periods, and have accounted for all the normal climate forcings over the big 100,000 year swings. They know the mechanisms, with everything from higher volcanic activity causing more CO2 than in the atmosphere today (causing hellish storms and temperatures in the dinosaur era) through to even the continents moving! They map it all. The major natural events are all inactive! We're causing this warming phase.

Also: water is natural, and essential for life. But if I dumped you in the Pacific Ocean, you would drown. You can even die from water poisoning if you drink too much water at once. Just saying something is natural and essential for life ignores the essential question of DOSES or what the hippies might call 'Balance'.
Water intoxication - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Biblewriter]

Dumb things Tim Ball pretends to know: 1

Sorry Tim Ball, but climatologists already know about a variety of climate periods on earth's history: if you had bothered to read some climate science instead of pretending you were a climatologist, you might know this. Climate scientists have to account for cold ice ages through to the hotter, higher volcanism periods, and have accounted for all the normal climate forcings over the big 100,000 year swings. They know the mechanisms, with everything from higher volcanic activity causing more CO2 than in the atmosphere today (causing hellish storms and temperatures in the dinosaur era) through to even the continents moving! They map it all. The major natural events are all inactive! We're causing this warming phase.

Also: water is natural, and essential for life. But if I dumped you in the Pacific Ocean, you would drown. You can even die from water poisoning if you drink too much water at once. Just saying something is natural and essential for life ignores the essential question of DOSES or what the hippies might call 'Balance'.
Water intoxication - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The truth is that studying the geological and similar histories of the earth reveals much about its ancient climate. Such as the fact that CO2 levels change as a response to temperature variations.

No, I did not get that backwards. "climatologists" have made much of the fact that ice cores have revealed the fact that indicators of temperature and indicators and CO2 vary together throughout the history written in these cores. But they conveniently missed the one critical fact that the changes in the CO2 indicators lagged behind the changes in the temperature indicators by an average of about 200 years.

This is the kind of thing that real scientists know and pseudo scientists either fail to notice or pretend is not there.

 

[eclipsenow]

I'm just editing this writing.....

 

[Biblewriter]

Dude, can you please get all dogmatic and PROVE to me (in capital letters, as you always do) that climatologist have IGNORED this fact! Then you'll win me over to being a climate sceptic. If there was something that BIG, that whoppingly ENORMOUSLY WRONG with their science, then I would drop it all and join you in sneering at them like the idiots they obviously are.

The truth is you're lying or ignorant. You either KNOW the truth on this one, or you're ignorantly parroting some ABSOLUTE RUBBISH you heard somewhere. And you're the great scientist, all hail the great scientist! Observe and weep denialists, as Biblewriter embarrasses ALL YOUR KIN!

Because the climatologists ALWAYS knew that temperature led carbon changes in the glacial to interglacial sequence, and yes, that includes James Hansen.
During the last million years of ice ages:
Temperatures changed FIRST which THEN caused the change in Carbon Dioxide volumes. This is counter-intuitive to the message we get today? YEP! But true. And when you know more about this cycle, it doesn't disprove today's climate science at all, and even informs our understanding of just how dangerous a warming gas CO2 really is!

But that's another topic that I'll address in future. Right now the topic is how you, the great Biblewriter, the greatest scientist of all time, became so utterly caught up in a denialist myth that you would reassert it as a FACT on a Christian forum that CLIMATOLOGISTS DID NOT KNOW THAT TEMPERATURES CHANGED FIRST, WHICH THEN CAUSED CO2 LEVELS TO CHANGE! (Some 700 to 800 years later. Again, the explanation of this conundrum is coming soon).

But right now the question for Biblewriter is whether he's lying, or merely ignorant, of the fact that CLIMATOLOGISTS KNEW THIS ALL ALONG!

I'm not even a scientist and I know climatologist are PERFECTLY aware of this issue and know how to answer it.
How do I know this, when I'm not even educated in the formulas that calculate how fast a cup of tea would cool? When I'm not the great Biblewriter? Simple. I'm not just rushing off to my denialista propaganda sites every 5 minutes to be misinformed, am I? I'm not swallowing a steady diet of misinformation at some whacko creationist / denialist website and letting myself be totally lied to. That's how I know climatologists know all about this one.

I'm going to assume Biblewriter is not intentionally lying, but merely dreadfully, embarrassingly, smugly, nauseatingly IGNORANT!

PROVE TO ME that climate scientists don't know about this. Go on. I dare you. You've really trodden in the foul stuff this time! Prove to me that James Hansen (and other climatologists) are completely ignorant of the FACT that during the last million years of ice-ages on earth, temperature preceded changes in CO2: even caused the changes in CO2, not the other way around. Go ahead. Make my day!

If they did indeed know this, then they knew all along that it was outright fraud to claim that global warming is caused by a rise in CO2 levels.

The actual historical data says the very opposite, that increases in global temperature cause increases in CO2 levels.

 

[eclipsenow]

The truth is that studying the geological and similar histories of the earth reveals much about its ancient climate. Such as the fact that CO2 levels change as a response to temperature variations.

No, I did not get that backwards. "climatologists" have made much of the fact that ice cores have revealed the fact that indicators of temperature and indicators and CO2 vary together throughout the history written in these cores. But they conveniently missed the one critical fact that the changes in the CO2 indicators lagged behind the changes in the temperature indicators by an average of about 200 years.

This is the kind of thing that real scientists know and pseudo scientists either fail to notice or pretend is not there.

Dear readers,
for the last few years Bibewriter has patronisingly, smugly scolded me for not being a great scientist like he is. It’s true that I cannot calculate how fast a cup of tea will cool in a certain environment: it’s true that some of the subtleties of the definitions of energy equations are lost on me. That’s fine. I admit that.

But when I read the outright lie that Biblewriter submitted above, I not only cringe for his ignorance, but for the state of the church in America, and the state of the science-media in America.

There is nothing wrong in the science Biblewriter submitted. It is absolutely true that during the last million years of ‘ice-age’ history (which is really glacial and interglacial history) we see something bizarre that appears to contradict climate science: that temperatures changed FIRST which then CAUSED changes in the CO2, and not the other way around as we are taught today. This is absolutely true.

But the Denialist lie Biblewriter has swallowed is that today’s climatologists know nothing about this! The reality is they KNOW ALL ABOUT IT and even use important calculations from this period to demonstrate what a DANGEROUS climate change gas CO2 really is!!! Yep, I love science. It is so counter-intuitive so much of the time.

So while some denialists here might be in a little bit of awe of Biblewriter’s scientific credentials, they should actually bite their bottom lips and weep. Because he’s shown himself to be completely ignorant of some of the basic facts of climate science that 5 minutes of googling would correct.

Yes: temperatures changed first and caused reactions in the CO2 levels on earth. But why did the temperatures change in the first place? And what kind of reactions did we see in the CO2? All this and more will be answered: but right now I want to know how it is that the great Biblewriter, surely the greatest scientist who ever lived (proving climate change to be a hoax because of imaginary maps of the Great Southern land! ;-), has become so misinformed and silly, and little old me knows the truth on this one?

Could it be that I know what the climatologist actually know on this subject because… I actually try to read what they say? I’m not hanging out on whacko creationist / denialist websites all the time, and filling myself with their lies?

For now I'm going to assume Biblewriter is not intentionally *lying* but is merely dreadfully, embarrassingly, catastrophically, smugly, nauseatingly IGNORANT about the fact that climatologist are quite HAPPY to explain why temperatures changed first, and then CO2!

OK Biblewriter, over to you! PROVE TO ME that climate scientists don't know about this. Go on. I dare you. You've really trodden in the foul stuff this time! Prove to me that James Hansen (and other climatologists) are completely ignorant of the FACT that during the last million years of ice-ages on earth, temperature preceded changes in CO2: even caused the changes in CO2, not the other way around. Go ahead. Make my day! (Goes to grab some popcorn, because this is going to be fun. I think I know where you'll start, and it doesn't involve actual climate science, but the popularisation of that science in Al Gore's movie. Go ahead. Do your best!)

 

[eclipsenow]

If they did indeed know this, then they knew all along that it was outright fraud to claim that global warming is caused by a rise in CO2 levels.

The actual historical data says the very opposite, that increases in global temperature cause increases in CO2 levels.

Dude, you replied too soon. I wanted to clean up the writing. Oh well. Now they have 2 versions of my post.

Can you at least apologise for lying to this group about what YOU said climatologists didn't know? Then run along and read what they actually say about it, there's a good boy.

 

[eclipsenow]

And you, who have, in this very thread, conclusively proved that you do not understand even the most elementary principles of science, continue to swollow, hook, line, and sinker, the lies being continually published by these pseudo-scientists.

I, as a certified, proven, and highly experienced scientist, have repeatedly warned you that this is pseudo-science. And you have chosen to ignore the warning. You know, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that I am far from alone in my warning. But you have chosen to believe the lies, because you love them.

You and the liars continue to pretend that the "deniers" are based on monied interests. But you ignore the obvious fact that the liars get their entire incomes from tax money that they know will dry up if people do not buy into their false predictions. So they continue to churn out their lies, expecting the public to continue to believe such nonsense as that the last winter was the warmest in history, even though the unusual cold was not only throughout North America, but in places as far away from there as Japan, India, and Egypt, that is, all around the world.

You speak to me like this, and then demonstrate that you haven't got a clue what climate scientists even teach! Wow. You're out there pal. As a 'scientist' I thought you would have been all across climate science. You don't even know what they say about the temperature leading carbon in the ice ages? You're not only arrogant, but ignorant. I at least admit I'm not a scientist: you pretend that you're the greatest climate scientist that has ever lived, and all these others are only pretenders.

Then you reveal you haven't even read their papers!

Instead you've just been hanging out in mad anti-science denialist creationist sites, and just don't have a clue. Climate science is one of those 'old earth' sciences, and so much be wrong. But you haven't got a clue what they even say on the important topic of the ice ages?

Go on, show us how informed you are about climate science.
1. What was the snowball earth, and what brought us out of it?
2. What causes an Ice Age?
3. What ends an Ice Age?
4. List 10 major forcings that impact on climate?
(CO2 is only one of them. Yeah, that's from climate scientists themselves. Oh, you didn't know they admit other things impact on the climate? That might be because you don't read any climate papers! Try it. You might like it. Oh, except you're old and it's really hard to change your mind when you're old.)

If I can demonstrate not only that climate scientists KNOW about the temperature leading CO2 during the ice ages, but have a reasonable argument that uses this fact to show how DANGEROUS CO2 still remains, what will you do?

* Will you at least admit you don't have a clue what climatologists even teach?

* Will you admit that despite being the world's greatest scientist, that you haven't bothered to read the peer-reviewed literature on the subject you claim to know more about than me?

* Will you admit this for me? After all, you have been down my throat for the last few years about it, and now it comes out you don't even know what they say on this most BASIC topic!

 

[Biblewriter]

You speak to me like this, and then demonstrate that you haven't got a clue what climate scientists even teach! Wow. You're out there pal. As a 'scientist' I thought you would have been all across climate science. You don't even know what they say about the temperature leading carbon in the ice ages? You're not only arrogant, but ignorant. I at least admit I'm not a scientist: you pretend that you're the greatest climate scientist that has ever lived, and all these others are only pretenders.

Then you reveal you haven't even read their papers!

Instead you've just been hanging out in mad anti-science denialist creationist sites, and just don't have a clue. Climate science is one of those 'old earth' sciences, and so much be wrong. But you haven't got a clue what they even say on the important topic of the ice ages?

Go on, show us how informed you are about climate science.
1. What was the snowball earth, and what brought us out of it?
2. What causes an Ice Age?
3. What ends an Ice Age?
4. List 10 major forcings that impact on climate?
(CO2 is only one of them. Yeah, that's from climate scientists themselves. Oh, you didn't know they admit other things impact on the climate? That might be because you don't read any climate papers! Try it. You might like it. Oh, except you're old and it's really hard to change your mind when you're old.)

If I can demonstrate not only that climate scientists KNOW about the temperature leading CO2 during the ice ages, but have a reasonable argument that uses this fact to show how DANGEROUS CO2 still remains, what will you do?

* Will you at least admit you don't have a clue what climatologists even teach?

* Will you admit that despite being the world's greatest scientist, that you haven't bothered to read the peer-reviewed literature on the subject you claim to know more about than me?

* Will you admit this for me? After all, you have been down my throat for the last few years about it, and now it comes out you don't even know what they say on this most BASIC topic!

I am not going to play your silly games.

I have already demonstrated that the historical data, written in the ice cores, plainly shows that CO2 concentration is an effect of global warming, not a cause. And you have already stated that climatologists know this.

Yet they (and you) keep harping on the lie that increased CO2 in the atmosphere will cause global warming.

QED

Of course, as one totally ignorant of science, you probably do not know that this is a Greek abbreviation for, "which was to be demonstrated."

Enjoy your cool-aid, since you love it.