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Global warming and the end

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eclipsenow

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I have had zero disappointment, as no true dispensationalist makes any "prediction" whatsoever. As to understanding prophecy, it is unfolding exactly as the scriptures say, and exactly as dispensationalists have always said it would.
So there's no 'predictions' but all your prophecies/predictions (the way you read them) are unfolding exactly the way you think they should after the event? :doh:;):thumbsup::doh:Tell me, are prophecies so that we can be warned in advance, or are they so obscure that we can only understand them in hindsight? If only understood in hindsight, what good are they anyway?

Come on mate. If they are prophecies, surely we are meant to be warned about them in advance. And that involves predictions.

In the meantime, here's a fact that should have Christians reaching for their keyboards to type up a letter to their local member:
Global greenhouse gases in the atmosphere have reached an ominous milestone that is unprecedented in human history.
The world's longest measure of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere has reached 400 parts per million (PPM) for the first time in three million years.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-05-...ches-highest-point-in-3-million-years/4680276
 
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eclipsenow

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So anyway, as the science shows, global warming is real. The question is, what are we to do about it? Now, as an Amil I'm not caught up in silly, unbiblical date-setting schemes for the Lord's return. He could return tonight, or in 50,000 years. We just don't know. Our ethical responsibility as Christians is to participate in the society discussion about what to DO about global warming, out of the ethic of 'love your neighbour'. We must love both our poorer neighbours in countries already affected by first world overuse of carbon energy, and also love our 'neighbours' in generations not yet born, and leave a planet inhabitable for them as well.

But there are problems with the hyped up 'solutions' of renewable energy. I think renewables are great, and can be PART of the solution. But I really don't think they can be 100% of the solution. They are unreliable, and as a result are far, far too expensive to backup or 'store' energy for night time or winter.

There are other renewable limits as well. A big one is GEOPOLITICAL. (I love renewables and this is painful to admit). Many smaller countries with large populations simply *cannot* power themselves. When one considers how diffuse wind and solar are, there is simply NOT ENOUGH LAND for smaller countries! Australia is fine with all our deserts and our (comparatively) low population. But the UK could not power itself without nuclear. This is simply the laws of physics of scattered, diffuse renewable energy supplied in a small area with a larger population like the UK. In today's economic and geopolitical environment when many nations are starting to reconsider globalisation and are trying to invent more home-grown solutions to energy security, renewables simply cannot cut it for large populations in small lands. Such countries simply demand too much power for each scrap of land! Let me hand you over to David MacKay.

"David John Cameron MacKay, FRS (born April 22, 1967), is the professor of natural philosophy in the department of Physics at the University of Cambridge[4] and chief scientific adviser to the UK Department of Energy and Climate Change (DECC).[5] Before being appointed to the DECC, MacKay was most well known as author of the book Sustainable Energy — Without the Hot Air.[2][6][7]"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_J._C._MacKay

David gives the following example in his famous TED talk.

You have a road with a 60 mile an hour (100kmph) speed limit. The cars on the road burn fuel at around 30 miles per gallon (which is the European average car efficiency, and why we are using imperial measurements). Along the side of the road is a ribbon of biofuel fields to fuel this particular road. The cars are about 80 meters apart. Now, the question is, how WIDE would the biofuel strip be to fuel this road of 60mh, 30 mpg, 80 meter apart cars, 24/7? (Length doesn't matter really because we're talking about average WIDTH to fuel these cars and if the length of the road extends, so does the biofuel strip along side it.)

It's a strange example, but physicist David MacKay wants us to think about renewable energy in a new way. If the biofuels grow 1200 litres of biofuel per hectare per year, then the strip along side this one, busy road would need to be 8km wide to fuel this one road!

Please watch David Mackay's TED talk here.
TEDxWarwick - David MacKay - How the Laws of Physics Constrain Our Sustainable Energy Options - YouTube

Bottom line? When today's Gen3.5 nukes would have easily withstood Fukushima's tidal wave, and when they supply abundant baseload reliable power at an affordable price, and when they can work so well *with* renewables (at maybe a 60% nuclear, 40% renewable grid), and when their waste provides the PERFECT FUEL for tomorrow's Gen4 reactors which will gobble all that FUEL up, maybe we all need to have an adult conversation about energy systems, but without all the hype and emotion that is often attached to these quite complex systems?
 
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Zanting

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So anyway, as the science shows, global warming is real. The question is, what are we to do about it? Now, as an Amil I'm not caught up in silly, unbiblical date-setting schemes for the Lord's return. He could return tonight, or in 50,000 years. We just don't know. Our ethical responsibility as Christians is to participate in the society discussion about what to DO about global warming, out of the ethic of 'love your neighbour'. We must love both our poorer neighbours in countries already affected by first world overuse of carbon energy, and also love our 'neighbours' in generations not yet born, and leave a planet inhabitable for them as well.

But there are problems with the hyped up 'solutions' of renewable energy. I think renewables are great, and can be PART of the solution. But I really don't think they can be 100% of the solution. They are unreliable, and as a result are far, far too expensive to backup or 'store' energy for night time or winter.

There are other renewable limits as well. A big one is GEOPOLITICAL. (I love renewables and this is painful to admit). Many smaller countries with large populations simply *cannot* power themselves. When one considers how diffuse wind and solar are, there is simply NOT ENOUGH LAND for smaller countries! Australia is fine with all our deserts and our (comparatively) low population. But the UK could not power itself without nuclear. This is simply the laws of physics of scattered, diffuse renewable energy supplied in a small area with a larger population like the UK. In today's economic and geopolitical environment when many nations are starting to reconsider globalisation and are trying to invent more home-grown solutions to energy security, renewables simply cannot cut it for large populations in small lands. Such countries simply demand too much power for each scrap of land! Let me hand you over to David MacKay.

"David John Cameron MacKay, FRS (born April 22, 1967), is the professor of natural philosophy in the department of Physics at the University of Cambridge[4] and chief scientific adviser to the UK Department of Energy and Climate Change (DECC).[5] Before being appointed to the DECC, MacKay was most well known as author of the book Sustainable Energy — Without the Hot Air.[2][6][7]"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_J._C._MacKay

David gives the following example in his famous TED talk.

You have a road with a 60 mile an hour (100kmph) speed limit. The cars on the road burn fuel at around 30 miles per gallon (which is the European average car efficiency, and why we are using imperial measurements). Along the side of the road is a ribbon of biofuel fields to fuel this particular road. The cars are about 80 meters apart. Now, the question is, how WIDE would the biofuel strip be to fuel this road of 60mh, 30 mpg, 80 meter apart cars, 24/7? (Length doesn't matter really because we're talking about average WIDTH to fuel these cars and if the length of the road extends, so does the biofuel strip along side it.)

It's a strange example, but physicist David MacKay wants us to think about renewable energy in a new way. If the biofuels grow 1200 litres of biofuel per hectare per year, then the strip along side this one, busy road would need to be 8km wide to fuel this one road!

Please watch David Mackay's TED talk here.
TEDxWarwick - David MacKay - How the Laws of Physics Constrain Our Sustainable Energy Options - YouTube

Bottom line? When today's Gen3.5 nukes would have easily withstood Fukushima's tidal wave, and when they supply abundant baseload reliable power at an affordable price, and when they can work so well *with* renewables (at maybe a 60% nuclear, 40% renewable grid), and when their waste provides the PERFECT FUEL for tomorrow's Gen4 reactors which will gobble all that FUEL up, maybe we all need to have an adult conversation about energy systems, but without all the hype and emotion that is often attached to these quite complex systems?

There is a much easier solution. Live with and on the land/earth as God intended :)

But of course that would be a too simple way of living for most folk...and since the greedy, power hungry, controlling money holders call all the shots...it won't happen...they make way too much money destroying everything and getting everybody buying stuff.

Big industry, big money, big environmental problems...it's not the everyday folks causing all the troubles on this planet. As long as greedy, power hungry, controlling money holders are allowed to do as they do...nothing will change.
 
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MrJDSmith

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There is a much easier solution. Live with and on the land/earth as God intended :)

But of course that would be a too simple way of living for most folk...and since the greedy, power hungry, controlling money holders call all the shots...it won't happen...they make way too much money destroying everything and getting everybody buying stuff.

Big industry, big money, big environmental problems...it's not the everyday folks causing all the troubles on this planet. As long as greedy, power hungry, controlling money holders are allowed to do as they do...nothing will change.

so you dont buy any of that evil stuff righr?

Sent from my tablet using CF
 
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eclipsenow

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There is a much easier solution. Live with and on the land/earth as God intended :)

But of course that would be a too simple way of living for most folk...and since the greedy, power hungry, controlling money holders call all the shots...it won't happen...they make way too much money destroying everything and getting everybody buying stuff.

Big industry, big money, big environmental problems...it's not the everyday folks causing all the troubles on this planet. As long as greedy, power hungry, controlling money holders are allowed to do as they do...nothing will change.
If you're saying we should all live pastoralist permaculture back-to-the-land lifestyles in some kind of legalistic "this is the way God intended it" mantra, with civilisation and technology as BAD things... it's just patronising gobbledegook until you can live it yourself. I note you're on that evil thing we call the internet? ;)

Sorry pal, but technology is a neutral tool until it has bad side effects. I'm not against ipads and computers and modern medicine and modern agricultural methods... I'm just against some of the bad side-effects of these things. There are appropriate and inappropriate aspects to modern technology and life. I, for one, celebrate the fact that we have flush toilets that save so many lives and modern medicine that can do the same. I also like learning more about the physics and astronomy and biology of this universe our God made, and it takes modern technology to really understand a lot of this stuff. Your pastoralist legalism is a little bit out of whack on the net... I think you need to go join the Amish? :thumbsup:
 
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Zanting

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so you dont buy any of that evil stuff righr?

Sent from my tablet using CF
Actually...I live a very simple life now...I don't have a lot of stuff...some land and a house by a river...I grow most of my own food and share with neighbors...I help others whenever I can and trade off labor and such...no TV, no stereo, no CD's, DVD's, or entertainment centre etc...A phone and a computer to communicate with are my luxury items...a small used economical car, my clothes are all bought used...I could go on, but you get the point. I recycle, reuse, use the barter system whenever possible. I have what I need and the love of family and support of other Christians. And I continue to be more and more self- sufficient and self-reliant. Pretty simple living and definitely not cluttered with stuff.

I got rid of a lot of stuff, gave most of it away, and am still getting rid of stuff, after becoming a born again Christian. It radically changed my life and how I was living on many levels. So no...I don't buy into all the stuff society tries to tell me I need to fit in or be like everyone else anymore. None of that stuff is important in my life anymore. I really took it to heart when Jesus said we are in the world, but not of the world. I do a lot of research and being alumni gives me access to an endless supply of Journals and other material I have an interest in.
 
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Gnarwhal

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If only we have Zero Point Modules, our problems would be solved. :D

ZPM.JPG
 
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Zanting

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If you're saying we should all live pastoralist permaculture back-to-the-land lifestyles in some kind of legalistic "this is the way God intended it" mantra, with civilisation and technology as BAD things... it's just patronising gobbledegook until you can live it yourself. I note you're on that evil thing we call the internet? ;)

Sorry pal, but technology is a neutral tool until it has bad side effects. I'm not against ipads and computers and modern medicine and modern agricultural methods... I'm just against some of the bad side-effects of these things. There are appropriate and inappropriate aspects to modern technology and life. I, for one, celebrate the fact that we have flush toilets that save so many lives and modern medicine that can do the same. I also like learning more about the physics and astronomy and biology of this universe our God made, and it takes modern technology to really understand a lot of this stuff. Your pastoralist legalism is a little bit out of whack on the net... I think you need to go join the Amish? :thumbsup:

Well, quite frankly, I am much happier without a lot of "stuff." But to each his own. And Amish...well no, but many of my Christians friends are Mennonite. I have a lot of respect for the group I am familiar with, albeit there are many different sects, from the super conservative to the very liberal minded.

You, sir, sure do have a tendency to read into things. Technology has it's place, and I never said anything about it...one way or another, and so does living as God intended. Selective reading and putting your own slant on what I've stated doesn't change it. You sure do get your knickers in a knot though when someone doesn't share your perspective. Your responses are very narcissistic.
 
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Biblewriter

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So there's no 'predictions' but all your prophecies/predictions (the way you read them) are unfolding exactly the way you think they should after the event? :doh:;):thumbsup::doh:Tell me, are prophecies so that we can be warned in advance, or are they so obscure that we can only understand them in hindsight? If only understood in hindsight, what good are they anyway?

Come on mate. If they are prophecies, surely we are meant to be warned about them in advance. And that involves predictions.

In the meantime, here's a fact that should have Christians reaching for their keyboards to type up a letter to their local member:


Carbon pollution hits highest point in 3 million years - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

What I said was, we don't make predictions. We read what God explicitly said was going to happen, and believe it. And the things God said were going to happen are indeed happening, just as He said they would.

Prophecies are not predictions. A prediction is a conclusion about the future arrived at through knowledge and experience. Something that is accurately predicted has a high probability of happening, but is not certain to happen. A prophecy is a revelation from God about what He is going to do. A prophecy is absolutely certain to happen, just as God said it would happen.
 
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eclipsenow

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Well, quite frankly, I am much happier without a lot of "stuff." But to each his own. And Amish...well no, but many of my Christians friends are Mennonite. I have a lot of respect for the group I am familiar with, albeit there are many different sects, from the super conservative to the very liberal minded.

You, sir, sure do have a tendency to read into things. Technology has it's place, and I never said anything about it...one way or another, and so does living as God intended. Selective reading and putting your own slant on what I've stated doesn't change it. You sure do get your knickers in a knot though when someone doesn't share your perspective. Your responses are very narcissistic.

As someone who cares about the environment, I actually have a LOT of empathy for your lifestyle. My blog is all about New Urbanism and making our cities more like cities, our rural areas more like rural areas, and getting rid of the abomination that is suburbia's no-where land. I also sometimes shout out a hello to the alternative counter culture movements like the Earthship movement (homes built out of old car tyres) and Permaculture guys and all that jazz. I also care about how the false god Mammon is eating away at many Christian souls. So I agree with your particular lifestyle choices more than I disagree.

But what I found really troubling is the legalistic condemning way you try to make your particular lifestyle choices COMPULSORY for all who follow our Lord. Not everyone wants to go back to the land the way you have. Not everyone has the physical health to do so, or the resources to buy the land they need, etc. And, as I read the gospel, we are saved by grace, and it is that grace that motivates us to be generous, rather than being a compulsory command to sell everything and head back to the land. I object to the legalism in the way you expressed yourself. If that is not what you are saying, then we're probably more on the same page. I just don't see any biblical mandate to run to the hills the way you have, even if it would probably be personally rewarding for more of us than would like to admit it.

Your calling me narcissistic over my trying to defend the gospel of grace is ... well... telling. It sounds like you may have invested a little bit too much of your faith in your lifestyle works and not in the all sufficient sacrifice of our Lord. You came across spiritually superior to the rest of us who have to work in cities, and do normal stuff like cut hair, bookkeeping, accountancy work, legal work, and all that caper. The jobs of civilisation. The jobs of being citizens of Babylon, and working for Babylon to prosper, even while we long to return to the true Israel, heaven, our home. I have nothing against Christians working in 'real' jobs in the 'real' economy, as long as they do not let their careers and homes and stuff they use climb up into the throne room of their souls. Only God belongs there.
 
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Zanting

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If that is not what you are saying, then we're probably more on the same page.

Exactly...that is not what I am saying...yet you have insinuated that I am saying things I have never stated or even contemplated for that matter.

From my experience with your responses, you are the one who displays the superior attitude in the way you mock and condemn the messenger instead of the message...then pass that off as though it is the attitude of the other. You accuse others of the very attitude you yourself display. That, by definition is narcissistic. It has nothing to do with defending your belief in God.

The only people I attacked in my response are the big money holders who run this world and no one else, yet somehow you have read into my responses completely different things. That I hold some sort of superior spirituality and others should do as I do and so on. None of which I have said. I live as I do because of how God has led me and that is all I have said.

Indeed, God has humbled me and brought me to a simpler way of living, but I cannot deny that I am well educated and well traveled. I have seen many cultures and ways of living. My choices are completely based on my own personal experiences. God never made living so complicated...people have. This God has shown me and certainly this has been verified by my experiences. All people can make their lives less complicated with faith in God no matter who or where they are.

I am a firm believer that God uses each of us based on our unique experiences. Gods people need to be everywhere in every facet of living to be His witnesses. We all serve God`s purpose to do as He commands with the knowledge and resources we have. That certainly does not indicate that everyone should do as I do, but that we are all needed to fulfill His plan, whether we live in a city, a town, a village or on the farm.

For some reason, you have negatively characterized me based on your false assumptions...that says a lot about you.
 
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eclipsenow

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Hi Zanting,
I apologise if I misunderstood you, and am prepared to go back and delete all my posts in our argument if that is the case. But can I just ask you to be careful how you post? You now accuse me of narcissim, but the problem is I'm not the CEO of some large evil corporate entity. I'm 'most folk', just an ordinary bloke. And who do you have a direct dig at in your opening salvo?

There is a much easier solution. Live with and on the land/earth as God intended :)

But of course that would be a too simple way of living for most folk...and since the greedy, power hungry, controlling money holders call all the shots...it won't happen...they make way too much money destroying everything and getting everybody buying stuff.

Big industry, big money, big environmental problems...it's not the everyday folks causing all the troubles on this planet. As long as greedy, power hungry, controlling money holders are allowed to do as they do...nothing will change.

So I can see that you were attacking big industry and big money etc. But you open up with a statement that we should live on and with the land as God intended, as if city life is NOT OK, and then you attacked that as being way too simple for most folk. I don't think I'm being narcissistic to think that your attack was levelled directly at me as it is written.

If you wish to correct the record and rephrase that opening attack, then I'm happy to delete this whole exchange from the thread. You now appear to be changing your tune and saying it's OK for some to be living in cities and God uses people in different walks of life, and it was mainly the big corporations etc you were attacking. That's quite a different stance to your original post.
 
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eclipsenow

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Matthew 24
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect’s sake those days shall be shortened.

It is foolish to think that you can stop what it coming. Even more foolish is thinking you should try.

Fallen angels are running the world and the whole world worships them.

God is going to remove His hand of protection and give the people of earth the cosmic Christ that they want.

1 Thessalonians 5:3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

Because they reject Jesus Christ they shall reveive antichrist. And then comes the wrath of God upon him and the whole earth.
I'm so bored of various 'futurist' schemes (Premil, Postmil, Pre-trib, Post-trib, etc). There IS no particular 'antichrist' as there are many antichrists. 1 John says so. The bible says it so I believe it. So there.

In the meantime, as an amil I'm completely fine accepting that global warming is a Christian responsibility we need to take seriously. Remember what Martin Luther said he would do if he found out the Lord was returning tomorrow? He'd plant a tree today. Something to consider.
 
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Biblewriter

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This spring is undoubtedly the coldest on record. I already gave a link, in post 144 of this thread, that an all time record was broken for the latest snow in Arkansas since records began in 1819. An all time year record was also broken in Alaska.

http://www.today.com/id/51929453/ns/local_news-anchorage_ak/t/anchorage-sets-record-longest-snow-season/


And this was not "local," for there was also snow in England in the middle of May!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-devon-22536139

I stand by my previous post (#119 in this thread) that NASA is fraudulently claiming that the planet is warming. The alleged historical data they are currently publishing is radically different from the same alleged historical data published by the same NASA office in the year 2000.


BBC News - Climate slowdown means extreme rates of warming 'not as likely'
 
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Zanting

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Hi Zanting,
I apologise if I misunderstood you, and am prepared to go back and delete all my posts in our argument if that is the case. But can I just ask you to be careful how you post? You now accuse me of narcissim, but the problem is I'm not the CEO of some large evil corporate entity. I'm 'most folk', just an ordinary bloke. And who do you have a direct dig at in your opening salvo?



So I can see that you were attacking big industry and big money etc. But you open up with a statement that we should live on and with the land as God intended, as if city life is NOT OK, and then you attacked that as being way too simple for most folk. I don't think I'm being narcissistic to think that your attack was levelled directly at me as it is written.

If you wish to correct the record and rephrase that opening attack, then I'm happy to delete this whole exchange from the thread. You now appear to be changing your tune and saying it's OK for some to be living in cities and God uses people in different walks of life, and it was mainly the big corporations etc you were attacking. That's quite a different stance to your original post.

You have misunderstood…and you do place negative assumptions and interpretations on what is said. Stating facts is not making direct digs at or toward anyone. I never changed my tune. You added as if city life is not ok. That was your perspective based on your own assumptions. My OP was a general statement about how people live based on worldly standards and not as God intended. Yes, my life radically changed when Jesus became my guide, and I gave my example of how much God has changed me and my view of the world. Your take on it led to further interpretation, but it hasn’t made any difference in how you have perceived it. You do have a talent for making something come across as completely different than intended or even contemplated. And you do frequently attack the messenger and not the message with belittling and derogatory comments. So if being called narcissistic is offensive to you, then perhaps you may consider how your responses may be equally as offensive and how that attitude is perceived.

And, seriously, do you really know many folk who are notcaught up in the consumer market? Check out the stats…most average folk buy because they think they need or simply want things to be like everyone else. That is what the advertising market is all about. Have you ever studied advertising? There is an entire field of psychology devoted to just that. How to get people to buy things that big business wants you to believe you need. They play on peoples desire, pride, ego, greed, whatever emotion they can manipulate to get people to buy more. Look around at the world and see what this kind on mentality has done to modern cultures and society as a whole over the past 100 years. Now ask yourself…how many people, Christian or other are aware, or have even thought about, or even care how manipulated they have become. For most folk, this manipulated lifestyle is normal. Is this how God intended His people to live?
Here are just a few examples of how complicated peoples lives and the world in general has become as a direct result of the big industry, big money holder consumer generated society…

The average household in modern cultures (varies among countries) are drowning in debt from over consumption which places untold amounts of stress on themselves and their children…and when the bills can no longer be paid…families break up, they lose their home, health issue rise and/or other negative life changes occur.
Both parents have to work to maintain all the stuff they buy leaving very little time and/or energy to be parents. TV, computers and video games become babysitters and entertainment for children.
Fast food and lack of family activity causing major health problems. Obesity, heart conditions, anxiety disorders, high blood pressure, high cholesterol, strokes, vitamin deficiencies, altered metabolisms, depression etc…
Suicide rates are highest at Christmas because parents can’t buy gifts for their family like everyone else on the block.
Pollution generated to create products.
Slave labor for cheaply produced products with big price tags.
Inflated pricing causing more homelessness, more hunger and less ability for average people to provide the basic needs for themselves and/or their families.
Tons of waste generated from over consumption to have the latest and best, in a throw away mentality the consumer market produces. They are always pushing people to buy the latest and newest gizmos and gadgets that promise to do more and more, faster and better. Etc., etc., etc.

Meanwhile, the big money holders are laughing at peoples gullibility as they get richer, gain more power and control over consumers and continue to pollute the air, water and soil.

Why would you think that living as God intended is restricted to people in rural areas? People in any setting can do a lot with where they are, and what they have, to live with, and in greater harmony with Gods creation. Many could indeed do as I have done, many have, many will, many could do lots right where they are…but most won’t change anything.
 
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eclipsenow

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This spring is undoubtedly the coldest on record. I already gave a link, in post 144 of this thread, that an all time record was broken for the latest snow in Arkansas since records began in 1819. An all time year record was also broken in Alaska.

Anchorage Sets New Record for Longest Snow Season - Local News - Anchorage, AK - TODAY.com

Which I've already addressed in this thread as local climate phenomenon induced by the increase in GLOBAL temperatures, which has moved the jet stream. Local temps do not equal global temps. Got it?


And this was not "local," for there was also snow in England in the middle of May!

BBC News - Snow and winds of 65mph hit Devon and Cornwall

No, it WAS local because the same jet stream that did this to the Northern USA also did it to the same latitude in England. Imagine that? ;):thumbsup:;)

I stand by my previous post (#119 in this thread) that NASA is fraudulently claiming that the planet is warming. The alleged historical data they are currently publishing is radically different from the same alleged historical data published by the same NASA office in the year 2000.

Hysterical nonsense when you have to similarly debunk the world's top 3 temperature databases. You constructed some numbers from who-knows where in an unverified spreadsheet you compiled... and I'm to believe you? ;) (Nudge nudge, wink wink).

This is good news, as the warming trend will still continue but a tiny bit slower. But if you read around, they've concluded it DOES not stop the ultimate destination though!
 
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Biblewriter

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Which I've already addressed in this thread as local climate phenomenon induced by the increase in GLOBAL temperatures, which has moved the jet stream. Local temps do not equal global temps. Got it?




No, it WAS local because the same jet stream that did this to the Northern USA also did it to the same latitude in England. Imagine that? ;):thumbsup:;)

So--- Alaska, Arkansas, and England are one locality and at the same latitude? You have now demonstrated that you not only have no concept of real science, but also no concept of geography.

Hysterical nonsense when you have to similarly debunk the world's top 3 temperature databases. You constructed some numbers from who-knows where in an unverified spreadsheet you compiled... and I'm to believe you? ;) (Nudge nudge, wink wink).
I remembered the data previously released by NASA, unlike the "useful idiots" the Communists rely upon so heavily. So I searched and found the data archived. You can dismiss it all you wish. I have personal knowledge that it is correct. The graph I produced from the data looks exactly like the graph I remembered having been published by NASA in the year 2000.

The critical fact that conclusively proves this is fraud, and not just error, is that the two sets of data allegedly show the same information for the same historical period, but are radically different, even though they come from the same NASA office.
 
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eclipsenow

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So--- Alaska, Arkansas, and England are one locality and at the same latitude? You have now demonstrated that you not only have no concept of real science, but also no concept of geography.

Dude, the local effects of the moving jet streams moves around. Got it? :thumbsup: You've just demonstrated that you don't understand jet streams.
I remembered the data previously released by NASA, unlike the "useful idiots" the Communists rely upon so heavily. So I searched and found the data archived. You can dismiss it all you wish. I have personal knowledge that it is correct. The graph I produced from the data looks exactly like the graph I remembered having been published by NASA in the year 2000.
I already did dismiss it all I wished, but you keep raising it as some kind of evidence? :doh: :doh: :doh:
I think it's PERFECTLY FAIR to ask for a peer-reviewed, respectable source to verify you didn't accidentally copy and paste numbers from some limited state study or some other source.



The critical fact that conclusively proves this is fraud, and not just error, is that the two sets of data allegedly show the same information for the same historical period, but are radically different, even though they come from the same NASA office.
ALLEGEDLY!? You're the only one alleging it. If you could show the original source was NOT some study of a Northern State's average temperatures you might have a case. Right now all you have is hearsay, conjecture, your own assertions. You've got NOTHING!

And here's the real kicker: you've avoided the other 2 main databases on the planet as well, haven't you?

Here's the thing: unless you can prove where you got those numbers, and that you didn't accidentally cut & paste them from the wrong source, then it's time to drop the whole thing. Going on and on about stuff that is completely unverifiable makes you appear to be an internet troll. It's out there with the 'Moon landing was faked' drama. How about going back to first principles and explaining why you disagree with the physics of the radiative forcing equation?
 
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Biblewriter

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Dude, the local effects of the moving jet streams moves around. Got it? :thumbsup: You've just demonstrated that you don't understand jet streams.
I already did dismiss it all I wished, but you keep raising it as some kind of evidence? :doh: :doh: :doh:
I think it's PERFECTLY FAIR to ask for a peer-reviewed, respectable source to verify you didn't accidentally copy and paste numbers from some limited state study or some other source.




ALLEGEDLY!? You're the only one alleging it. If you could show the original source was NOT some study of a Northern State's average temperatures you might have a case. Right now all you have is hearsay, conjecture, your own assertions. You've got NOTHING!

And here's the real kicker: you've avoided the other 2 main databases on the planet as well, haven't you?

Here's the thing: unless you can prove where you got those numbers, and that you didn't accidentally cut & paste them from the wrong source, then it's time to drop the whole thing. Going on and on about stuff that is completely unverifiable makes you appear to be an internet troll. It's out there with the 'Moon landing was faked' drama. How about going back to first principles and explaining why you disagree with the physics of the radiative forcing equation?
The May snowstorms also hit Russia, which means they went all the way around the Northern Hemisphere.

Whimsical Weather in Russian Cities | Image galleries | RIA Novosti

And as far as your ridiculous claim that I am the only one pointing out this fraud, check out the following:

Did Media Or NASA Withhold Climate History Data Changes From The Public?

WEBCommentary(tm) - Did Media Or NASA Withhold Climate History Data Changes From The Public?

NASA Rewriting US History | Real Science

How NASA is Manipulating Climate Data

Error in NASA climate data sparks debate

Rewriting History, Time and Time Again « Climate Audit

NASA Bureaucrats Caught Doctoring Data to Make Warming Seem More Rapid | Heartlander Magazine

FOIA Suit Seeks NASA’s Global Warming Data - The BLT: The Blog of Legal Times

Changes in NASA Temperature Data from 1999 to 2007 - YouTube

DailyTech - Blogger Finds Y2K Bug in NASA Climate Data

NASA's curious climate capers [printer-friendly] • The Register

NASA Data Worse Than Climate-Gate Data, Space Agency Admits | Fox News

You will notice that Australia accused them of falsifying data:

http://www.climategate.com/australiagate-now-nasa-caught-in-trick-over-aussie-climate-data

And Russia made the same accusation:

Climategate Goes SERIAL: Now the Russians Confirm That UK Climate Scientists Manipulated Data to Exaggerate Global Warming
 
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