Glenn Beck

[Auntie]

It sounds as though faith really has little or nothing to do with "conservative moral values"...that it really isn't an issue, not important, an insignificant role, of little value...and therein may be a clue to follow. When something as important as "conservative moral values" really has no truth in faith required, perhaps it isn't as important as we may think it is...perhaps it truly is a distraction from the real calling, the real work, the real battle...again, just thinking aloud here..

Well Jim I think faith is very important, and I assume most conservatives at least believe in God.
Our Founding Fathers, were they all Nicene Creed believers?
I don't know, but I don't think so.
However, most all of them claimed faith in God.

Obama is supposedly a Christian.
But there is no way, no way at all, I could ever go along with his politics.
I can't even begin to agree with the man on anything.
Yet he claims to be Christian.

Well, I admit to being confused about it.

But it's a good subject, good questions, make a thread about it.

 

[Secundulus]

It would seem though that we're going beyond mere association (which I would understand as general contact and interaction) when uniting with those propagating "conservative moral values" when they are not of same faith...it is as though as long as they meet an "issues litmus test" regardless of faith they are validated in some way as being acceptable.

If we ask them to take the Eucharist with us then there is something wrong. If we cooperate in stopping abortion, or some other moral evil, then I think there is nothing wrong.

Just sayin' (Glenn says that a lot), maybe if we don't have core beliefs in common there may be reason to suspect motive...and my earlier thought, that these "conservative moral values" arguments are a distraction, perhaps good stuff on the surface, but not key to what the faith is about..

I agree that the faith cannot be comprimised for politics or else one becomes a harlot.

On the other hand, I don't think that working with someone to stop a moral evil is necessarily comprimising the faith.

In Romans, Paul tells us that God has revealed himself and his laws to everyone. If someone, a Mormon in this instance, has responded to this, albiet incompletely, and recognizes God's moral laws and is working in their direction should we refuse to work with him because he has at this time only grasped 80% of the truth? Are we not working towards exactly the same thing?

 

[MrJim]

Well Jim I think faith is very important, and I assume most conservatives at least believe in God.
Our Founding Fathers, were they all Nicene Creed believers?
I don't know, but I don't think so.
However, most all of them claimed faith in God.

Obama is supposedly a Christian.
But there is no way, no way at all, I could ever go along with his politics.
I can't even begin to agree with the man on anything.
Yet he claims to be Christian.

Well, I admit to being confused about it.

But it's a good subject, good questions, make a thread about it.

Eh really it's not so complicated, we're salt for society and all that...still today in Sunday School there was something about "compromising with the world", and it just made me wonder aloud that, if "conservative moral values" don't have to be "Christian", which if ya think about it, they don't. They may line up with Christian teaching but can be held by atheists or cultists so is that cause to be yoked together with them in political form against the "other side" which do contain brothers and sisters that disagree with the politics but would be believers (albeit perhaps mistaken ) then how is it our brother is the enemy and nonbelievers are kissin' cousins? That "politics makes strange bedfellows" is the core of compromising with the world...of being conformed with the world...I'm not a theologian but I am a thinker ( quoting Beck again, maybe I listen to him more than most)

 

[MrJim]

If we ask them to take the Eucharist with us then there is something wrong. If we cooperate in stopping abortion, or some other moral evil, then I think there is nothing wrong.

I agree that the faith cannot be comprimised for politics or else one becomes a harlot.

On the other hand, I don't think that working with someone to stop a moral evil is necessarily comprimising the faith.

In Romans, Paul tells us that God has revealed himself and his laws to everyone. If someone, a Mormon in this instance, has responded to this, albiet incompletely, and recognizes God's moral laws and is working in their direction should we refuse to work with him because he has at this time only grasped 80% of the truth? Are we not working towards exactly the same thing?

Then perhaps all the time in theological jousting really is just hobby-level stuff and perhaps even detrimental to fighting the "moral evil", that a place like CF should swing open the doors to embrace all that grasp 80% or maybe 50% or 15% of the truth would be enough, to fully engage in the battle?

Oh wait, that site is called The Free Republic

 

[Secundulus]

They may line up with Christian teaching but can be held by atheists or cultists so is that cause to be yoked together with them in political form against the "other side" which do contain brothers and sisters that disagree with the politics but would be believers (albeit perhaps mistaken ) then how is it our brother is the enemy and nonbelievers are kissin' cousins?

This is a difficult question. That Christians cannot agree with each other on matters of morals is a scandal.

I guess that you can only recognize that even the Church contains tares and do the best you can to do the right thing, even if that means cooperating with those of other faiths.

 

[Secundulus]

Then perhaps all the time in theological jousting really is just hobby-level stuff and perhaps even detrimental to fighting the "moral evil", that a place like CF should swing open the doors to embrace all that grasp 80% or maybe 50% or 15% of the truth would be enough, to fully engage in the battle?

I don't think that we are talking about sharing or comprimising our theologies with them.

Oh wait, that site is called The Free Republic

Don't get me started on the Freepers. I am as conservative as anyone and I think that most of them are a bunch of idiots. I posted there once on an incident that I had been involved in overseas and had perfect first hand knowledge of and then spend over 200 posts answering charges that I was a liar to all the armchair warriors and other assorted living room experts. I have never posted there since.

 

[Auntie]

Eh really it's not so complicated, we're salt for society and all that...still today in Sunday School there was something about "compromising with the world", and it just made me wonder aloud that, if "conservative moral values" don't have to be "Christian", which if ya think about it, they don't. They may line up with Christian teaching but can be held by atheists or cultists so is that cause to be yoked together with them in political form against the "other side" which do contain brothers and sisters that disagree with the politics but would be believers (albeit perhaps mistaken ) then how is it our brother is the enemy and nonbelievers are kissin' cousins? That "politics makes strange bedfellows" is the core of compromising with the world...of being conformed with the world...I'm not a theologian but I am a thinker ( quoting Beck again, maybe I listen to him more than most)

I hear ya. Well, for one thing, faith can be a changing thing. Non-Christians become Christian every day. But usually, their basic moral beliefs don't change too much. Glenn Beck, a Mormon, could "see the Light" and become a Catholic or other Nicene Creed Christian tomorrow, or next week, or next year. But I imagine his basic moral views will remain the same, or nearly the same.

 

[MrJim]

I don't think that we are talking about sharing or comprimising our theologies with them.

Don't get me started on the Freepers. I am as conservative as anyone and I think that most of them are a bunch of idiots. I posted there once on an incident that I had been involved in overseas and had perfect first hand knowledge of and then spend over 200 posts answering charges that I was a liar to all the armchair warriors and other assorted living room experts. I have never posted there since.

 

[MrJim]

This is a difficult question. That Christians cannot agree with each other on matters of morals is a scandal.

I guess that you can only recognize that even the Church contains tares and do the best you can to do the right thing, even if that means cooperating with those of other faiths.

The wheat and tares would have more to do about within the church, right? I'd have to see that parable again..

 

[MrJim]

Mt 13:24 –Mt 13:30 KJV
Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field:
But while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way. But when the blade was sprung up, and brought forth fruit, then appeared the tares also. So the servants of the householder came and said unto him, Sir, didst not thou sow good seed in thy field? from whence then hath it tares? He said unto them, An enemy hath done this. The servants said unto him, Wilt thou then that we go and gather them up? But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them. Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

hmm....

 

[Secundulus]

. deleted

 

[Izdaari Eristikon]

What is Rush Limbaugh's faith? I don't have a clue, never heard him mention it before. But a lot of the time, he has some good things to say, so I listen to him.

Limbaugh's religion is listed as Methodist on several websites, and he was married in a United Methodist Church in his home town, Cape Girardeau, Missouri. But other than comments like "With talent on loan from Goddd...", he doesn't talk about his faith that I've heard.

 

[Izdaari Eristikon]

..and it sounds like "conservative moral values" trumps truth every time when it comes to defense of the American Way Is "conservative moral values" the Christian faith?

Funny thing is there are some "liberals" clinging more truth but considered the "enemy" because disagreements with "conservative moral values", and yet they would be brothers and sisters in Christ whereas a Mormon (or maybe we'll get a popular conservative Jehovah's Witness radio guys soon) is not.

..again just thinking out loud...

In fact I don't think "conservative moral values" and Christian faith are anything like the same thing. But when it comes to those kinds of issues, I'm not all that conservative myself, more of a libertarian.

 

[Rhamiel]

Limbaugh's religion is listed as Methodist on several websites, and he was married in a United Methodist Church in his home town, Cape Girardeau, Missouri. But other than comments like "With talent on loan from Goddd...", he doesn't talk about his faith that I've heard.

I hear him talk about God sometimes, just about how human life is worth something because it comes from God and little stuff though

 

[Auntie]

I hear him talk about God sometimes, just about how human life is worth something because it comes from God and little stuff though

Yeah I've heard him say things like that.
Recently, he was upset about the stem cell research, he didn't think it was right to use embryos for that.

Usually, on his radio program, he will lead with the story that has him MOST upset.
And very often, it has to do with things he feels are immoral.
So I've always "assumed" he was Christian, but didn't really know.

Ya know, I think a liberal can be Christian or non-Christian.
But, generally speaking, a conservative is almost always Christian.
I don't recall ever running into an atheist who was also a die-hard conservative.

 

[Izdaari Eristikon]

Ya know, I think a liberal can be Christian or non-Christian. But, generally speaking, a conservative is almost always Christian. I don't recall ever running into an atheist who was also a die-hard conservative.

There used to be a couple atheist die-hard conservatives on the staff of National Review: Max Eastman and James Burnham. Both were former Communists, and both died long ago. I'd count Burnham among my political influences, since his Suicide of the West was a formative book for me.

There are many, many atheist libertarians, since Ayn Rand's influence is huge on that side of things. I used to be a Rand follower myself. As a Christian libertarian, I'm considered a little unusual.

And there are some high profile Orthodox Jews who are conservatives, most notably Michael Medved and Rabbi Daniel Lapin.

 

[Auntie]

Interesting stuff Izdaari, thanks for the info.

 

[Nadiine]

my grampa & uncle were hardcore atheists (and racist to boot) -

but both were very conservatively moral.

I think back in the day there were alot more conservative atheists
than today (in my observation).

I don't like just throwing broad stereotypes around . . . you have to
be careful in doing that.

Romans 2:14-15 shows us that God's moral code is imprinted in us
(plus the Holy Spirit convicts the world inwardly of what is moral) -
so it doesn't surprise me that people can be conservatively moral
yet unsaved or even hostile to God.

 

[icamewithasword]

unless someone already posted this, glenn can be seen on fox news channel at 4pm CST. he moved from cnn a while back....
I listen to Rush, but prefer glenn. i feel rush is republican first, then conservative. glenn has conservative values, but will call out a republican when they're wrong.
if you go to his site at glennbeck.com you can visit the "We Surround Them" link. give it a try.....

 

[ancientsoul]

hello

Thought I'd throw my two cents in. I'm a Glenn Beck fan, as well. One of the things I like about him is he's not afraid to call it as he sees it. I give him credit for that because so many are afraid to speak out. One of the things I don't like about him is on occassion he appears a little puffed up. No judgement. My problem with it is it could drive off some who might have otherwise gotten something out of it. jmo