Getting a yes.....a guy's perspective.

[vibrant]

if i feel like i'm being flattered or manipulated, you get a no

 

[renaistre]

Personally, I get uncomforatble with stuff like this. Trying to figure out the best way to phrase a question in order to get a "yes" just feels weird to me. On the other hand, I've never actually asked anyone out, so I don't have much experience to back up anything I have to say on the issue.

 

[renaistre]

Wow, yeah, I guess this is why I'm not really resonating with your approach: I wouldn't dream of turning down a guy just to "test" him. My yes is yes and my no is no... and like others have said, my answer won't be determined by how I'm asked.

So I take it the "Mr. Collins approach" isn't something you would be too appreciative of?

 

[Macrina]

So I take it the "Mr. Collins approach" isn't something you would be too appreciative of?

I'm afraid I don't follow you.

 

[Macrina]

Personally, I get uncomforatble with stuff like this. Trying to figure out the best way to phrase a question in order to get a "yes" just feels weird to me. On the other hand, I've never actually asked anyone out, so I don't have much experience to back up anything I have to say on the issue.

From my perspective, it's good that you feel weird about it. Many of us are extremely turned off by guys who seem too slick and manipulative. Now, you can talk about how to present yourself the best way, what is the best way to phrase things, but when it comes down to trying to extract a "yes" from a woman who might not otherwise give one -- yeah, it's uncomfortable.

 

[vibrant]

it's not like every girl would love to date you if only you phrased the question properly. for some, you definitely aren't their type; leave them be.

 

[Deliberatetourist]

it's not like every girl would love to date you if only you phrased the question properly. for some, you definitely aren't their type; leave them be.

I wan't saying that it was a cure all for rejection. Only that it might increase your chances of getting past that initial "make or break" moment. You ladies are always lamenting the fact that us guys put too much emphasis on looks and pass up lots of gals who have this "inner beauty" that would make our lives wonderful and such. It works both ways because YOU ladies will smack down a guy who might not have the greatest introductory skills in the world but with lots of qualities that you are constantly complaining you can't find in anyone because you fail to look past the clumsy opening lines.

 

[vibrant]

I wan't saying that it was a cure all for rejection. Only that it might increase your chances of getting past that initial "make or break" moment. You ladies are always lamenting the fact that us guys put too much emphasis on looks and pass up lots of gals who have this "inner beauty" that would make our lives wonderful and such. It works both ways because YOU ladies will smack down a guy who might not have the greatest introductory skills in the world but with lots of qualities that you are constantly complaining you can't find in anyone because you fail to look past the clumsy opening lines.

the guys who made me feel like a lady, the guys who acted like gentlemen, are the ones i gave my number to. i wouldn't care if he stumbled over his words, just as long as the words he said didn't try to demean or manipulate me.

 

[Deliberatetourist]

the guys who made me feel like a lady, the guys who acted like gentlemen, are the ones i gave my number to. i wouldn't care if he stumbled over his words, just as long as the words he said didn't try to demean or manipulate me.

Guys who will and are good at it you will never see them coming. Most people who knew Ted Bundy said he came off as the most charming guy you could imagine.

 

[Achichem]

trying to extract a "yes" t

Which brings up an important distinction. One which comes up in marketing all the time…

Many often-young marketing people come in and consider it their job to force the consumers to be interested in the product. They design their campaign by this principle and end up with a very uncomfortable and uncooperative end consumer. In other words, they assume consumers are dumb and then wonder why people are dissatisfied and disinterested. The truth is you yourself are a consumer, so if you not selling to yourself, your not selling.

Great marketing teams are never trying to elicit a sale but are instead concerned solely with improving the perception or association of the product. Now at first this may sound the same, after all both are marketing campaigns, but in fact the two are worlds apart.

If your just improving perception, you don’t care if a person is disinterested, you accept that if they are not interested that is cool (its their choice); but, you think that a lot of people haven’t taken a good solid look, how can they, who has the time…the naive campaign on the other hand is just trying to force the outcome of decision, and stealing someone’s choice is always wrong.

The problem is the nieve approch is the common sense defult.

I have to jump in and somewhat disagree with the OP. Not all women get a "power trip" off of rejecting guys No one I know does.

When you get right down to what determines most decisions it not logic as common sense would have it, it a thing called associative response (our gut instinct).

Associative response has no relation to how an outcome will make you feel, and has everything to do with how it does make you feel in that moment. See every word, symbol, and image is connected in the human brain to a web of other ideas. These come out in our brain as feelings.

So when we hear a phrase, it will always trigger a feeling. The goal here is to logically try to get that associated feeling to be a positive one, instead of going in blind and just hoping it is.

Many of you talk about premeditation to this type of thing coming off as suspicious, why? Do you find our examples suspicious sounding? It is actually kind of ironic you say that, considering the feeling of associated suspicion is what we are in fact attempting to remove

Peace,

 

[vibrant]

nevermind

 

[LOVEthroughINTELLECT]

I don't want a "Yes" anyway.

"Yes" =

This would be better: "Sure!".

But the real prize would be: "I'd love to!".

You guys can have your "Yes". I will be working on hearing, "I'd love to!".

 

[Deliberatetourist]

I don't want a "Yes" anyway.

"Yes" =

This would be better: "Sure!".

But the real prize would be: "I'd love to!".

You guys can have your "Yes". I will be working on hearing, "I'd love to!".

A yes, gets my foot in the door. A "I would love to" is after a few dates when they realize I am really a cool person to be around.

 

[LOVEthroughINTELLECT]

I don't want a "Yes" anyway.

"Yes" =

This would be better: "Sure!".

But the real prize would be: "I'd love to!".

You guys can have your "Yes". I will be working on hearing, "I'd love to!".

Meanwhile, "Of course I will!" would make "Yes", "Sure!" and "I'd love to!" all look like only one step from a shy nod of the head. But most of us--99.9%, to be exact--don't have the time, energy or other resources to work on hearing, "Of course I will!".

Do you all realize what I have just done? I now have the perfect response if a woman ever makes an offer.

Great! Now I am going to have every woman and her sister making offers just so that they can hear, "Of course I will!"

I just hope that none of the offers includes a [thread=2558261]movie[/thread]. I would hate to have to dissapoint somebody. If the offer is to go to a movie, at best it warrants a, "Why not?".

 

[Deliberatetourist]

Meanwhile, "Of course I will!" would make "Yes", "Sure!" and "I'd love to!" all look like only one step from a shy nod of the head. But most of us--99.9%, to be exact--don't have the time, energy or other resources to work on hearing, "Of course I will!".

Do you all realize what I have just done? I now have the perfect response if a woman ever makes an offer.

Great! Now I am going to have every woman and her sister making offers just so that they can hear, "Of course I will!"

I just hope that none of the offers includes a [thread=2558261]movie[/thread]. I would hate to have to dissapoint somebody. If the offer is to go to a movie, at best it warrants a, "Why not?".

You're right "I'd love to" is just way too much work for a breadwinning guy. Sigh, I guess I'll just be happy with the yes.

 

[Blank123]

Lots of women are interested in guys but will still turn them down. As LTI alluded to in an ablove post there are some game players although I am not sure you could classify all women who do this as such. I think any woman who's been educated in the West can get off on power trips perhaps without even realizing it. And just because a woman takes that approach doesn't mean shes trouble or doesn't have anything to offer. Lots of women I have seen do this are actually interested in the guy and reject him to see if he's got the nerve to try again. Then they'll give him the right-of-way if he does. The approach that I suggested denies them that and throws the monkey on their back so to spreak if they refuse because they aren't really refusing you - the are saying no to fun (what a sourpuss). Now as LTI stated some men might not want to even bother with such a woman but that is the topic for another thread. I just suggested a way for a guy who's tired of the flat NO from women to perhaps increase his chances.

I really hope this isn't your opinion of all western women. Some may do this, yes, (and guys any woman that plays games like this really isn't worth your time ) but not all of us want to play with guys minds or test them to see if they're really interested. Like Mac said, my yes is yes and my no is no. If I turn a guy down its because I am not interested in pursuing a romantic relationship, and if I agree to go out with him its because I do have an interest in pursuing a relationship. My answer is dependant upon my interest in that specific person, not a game, and not how the guy asks me out.

Don't make the mistake of trying to generalize us all

 

[Deliberatetourist]

I really hope this isn't your opinion of all western women. Some may do this, yes, (and guys any woman that plays games like this really isn't worth your time ) but not all of us want to play with guys minds or test them to see if they're really interested. Like Mac said, my yes is yes and my no is no. If I turn a guy down its because I am not interested in pursuing a romantic relationship, and if I agree to go out with him its because I do have an interest in pursuing a relationship. My answer is dependant upon my interest in that specific person, not a game, and not how the guy asks me out.

Don't make the mistake of trying to generalize us all

If you simply do not want to go out with me for whatever reason I am fine with that, so long as you don't regress in to labling me as "shallow" should I return the favor to someone else. Someone else will go out with me and I don't need to waste any more time on someone who's not interested. Lets face it though, the social scenes are full of game players because thats their defense mechanism in a predatorial environment, and most of the time churches are lousy places to hook up anyhow so, where do you go next?

 

[Beauty4Ashes]

I wan't saying that it was a cure all for rejection. Only that it might increase your chances of getting past that initial "make or break" moment. You ladies are always lamenting the fact that us guys put too much emphasis on looks and pass up lots of gals who have this "inner beauty" that would make our lives wonderful and such. It works both ways because YOU ladies will smack down a guy who might not have the greatest introductory skills in the world but with lots of qualities that you are constantly complaining you can't find in anyone because you fail to look past the clumsy opening lines.

I disagree with this. seemingly-smooth, experienced guys are often cocky and not as trustworthy. Learned that from experience. If I like someone, I don't care how awkward they are in their approach or whatever. Just as if I don't like someone, no poetry they recite or clever lines are going to change my mind. (unless I was unsure if I liked them....that's different)

 

[renaistre]

I'm afraid I don't follow you.

It's from Pride and Prejudice. Mr. Collins thinks that a denial is really just an expression of modesty, and that it's an encouragement to continue his advances. It's pretty funny.

 

[OhhJim]

Like Mac said, my yes is yes and my no is no.


Don't make the mistake of trying to generalize us all

Heh, take notes, guys, if you ever ask out little tigress or Macrina. If, on the other hand, you ask out one of the other 3,000,000,000 women in the world...

Which is more fair, a generalization based on yourself as a woman, or a generalization based on personal experience with dozens of different women? Which is the larger database? You may know how YOU would react, but how does that help me with the next 5 women I ask out, none of which are you?

I think both the tourist and tsar have good suggestions. Personally, I'd take it one step further, if I really liked the woman, and she turned me down. I'd take another woman, and afterwards tell the first one what fun it was. This emphasizes a couple of things:

1. I'm not obsessing over you

2. I'm a fun guy, which other woman can see, even if you can't

You don't want her thinking that no other woman will go out with you, either. You do want her thinking that other women find you desirable.