get the point yet?

[jhitch244]

(forgive me as i begin with the wonderful words of)...... i heard... that Martin Luther went through a period where he gave the same message of the Gospel every week. so members addressed him with their concern, and his response was that he preaches the same message every week and until people start applying it to their life he will continue with the same message of the Gospel.


what do you think?

 

[Concetta]

Ooohh, now that's one way to make his point lol
I wonder how well his tactic worked? Any info on results?

 

[catwoman2]

My pastor (LCMS) says he will continue to preach Law and Gospel and nothing of living the Christian life. He's done it for 17 years at his present church. So, in a way, he is doing what Luther said in the OP.

It's good for keeping a person anchored in the truth but it really sucks when you want to grow in the faith.

 

[Confess]

(forgive me as i begin with the wonderful words of)...... i heard... that Martin Luther went through a period where he gave the same message of the Gospel every week. so members addressed him with their concern, and his response was that he preaches the same message every week and until people start applying it to their life he will continue with the same message of the Gospel.


what do you think?

You might be thinking of the same sermon rather then the same message.

Lutherans preach (as stated above) a law - gospel message.

The law shows us our sins and convicts us, makes us realize that we cannot save ourselves. The gospel lifts us up and shows us that we are forgiven through the shed blood of Jesus Christ.

This is the message that all Christian pastors are to preach every Sunday.

 

[sawdust]

You might be thinking of the same sermon rather then the same message.

Lutherans preach (as stated above) a law - gospel message.

The law shows us our sins and convicts us, makes us realize that we cannot save ourselves. The gospel lifts us up and shows us that we are forgiven through the shed blood of Jesus Christ.

This is the message that all Christian pastors are to preach every Sunday.

Then how do Lutherans ever learn to fly?

It is all well and good to be lifted up but once there....what then?????

peace

 

[Rowan]

(forgive me as i begin with the wonderful words of)...... i heard... that Martin Luther went through a period where he gave the same message of the Gospel every week. so members addressed him with their concern, and his response was that he preaches the same message every week and until people start applying it to their life he will continue with the same message of the Gospel.


what do you think?

Well there's nothing wrong with repetition...

 

[Confess]

Then how do Lutherans ever learn to fly?

It is all well and good to be lifted up but once there....what then?????

peace

When I say "lifted up" I am talking about getting out of feeling guilty for our sins, feeling sorry for our sins etc.

The Gospel is all about forgiveness for the repentant sinner.

When I leave church, I am not burdened by my sins, I am freed!

 

[jhitch244]

Ooohh, now that's one way to make his point lol
I wonder how well his tactic worked? Any info on results?

nooo i'm sorry! i wish i had some results... i'm going to do some research and look for it though!

 

[jhitch244]

You might be thinking of the same sermon rather then the same message.

Lutherans preach (as stated above) a law - gospel message.

The law shows us our sins and convicts us, makes us realize that we cannot save ourselves. The gospel lifts us up and shows us that we are forgiven through the shed blood of Jesus Christ.

This is the message that all Christian pastors are to preach every Sunday.

well said... i believe it was the same sermon... thank you for the good info

 

[New_Wineskin]

(forgive me as i begin with the wonderful words of)...... i heard... that Martin Luther went through a period where he gave the same message of the Gospel every week


what do you think?

What a con - getting paid weekly for doing nothing . This is the kind of thing present-day serminators follow - same old stuff week after week while expecting to be paid for their "work" .

 

[Tavita]

My pastor (LCMS) says he will continue to preach Law and Gospel and nothing of living the Christian life. He's done it for 17 years at his present church. So, in a way, he is doing what Luther said in the OP.

It's good for keeping a person anchored in the truth but it really sucks when you want to grow in the faith.

Amen.
Isn't this preaching salvation to the already converted? A recipe for boredom made mostly of milk. Paul tells us to go on from the milk of the word to eating solid food. This is also good for putting people to sleep.. which is what milk for babies does.

Heb 5:12 For indeed because of the time, you ought to be teachers, you have need that one teach you again what are the first principles of the oracles of God. And you have become in need of milk, and not of solid food.
Heb 5:13 For everyone partaking of milk is unskillful in the Word of Righteousness, for he is an infant.
Heb 5:14 But solid food belongs to those who are of full age, even those who because of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

 

[catwoman2]

I agree with you but he says that we always stray, so we need to be reminded of what sinners we are and that we need Christ's salvation daily. He states that he must preach this simple message just in case someone needs to hear it.

 

[jhitch244]

What a con - getting paid weekly for doing nothing . This is the kind of thing present-day serminators follow - same old stuff week after week while expecting to be paid for their "work" .

well i hope first of all that pastors/priests do not do it for the money.... and secondly, why move on when people are not grasping or implementing what they learn on the Sabbath. Martin Luther preached was said to have preached over 3,000 times between 1510 and 1546. i don't think he was taking the easy way out or trying to get paid.

we so often think that if we do not hear a mind blowing message on sunday, then we did not get our "moneys worth". i personally believe the best sermons are when complicated concepts are simplified.

 

[jhitch244]

Amen.
Isn't this preaching salvation to the already converted? A recipe for boredom made mostly of milk. Paul tells us to go on from the milk of the word to eating solid food. This is also good for putting people to sleep.. which is what milk for babies does.

Heb 5:12 For indeed because of the time, you ought to be teachers, you have need that one teach you again what are the first principles of the oracles of God. And you have become in need of milk, and not of solid food.
Heb 5:13 For everyone partaking of milk is unskillful in the Word of Righteousness, for he is an infant.
Heb 5:14 But solid food belongs to those who are of full age, even those who because of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

good choice of Scripture! but, is it the pastor or the congregation responsible for only consuming milk? if the leader is giving a sermon because the elders agree that they concerned with how people in the congregation are living. i think it is the pastors responsibility to preach the Gospel and the congregation to seek more in the Holy Scripture.

Acts 17:11
Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true.

 

[Strong in Him]

(forgive me as i begin with the wonderful words of)...... i heard... that Martin Luther went through a period where he gave the same message of the Gospel every week. so members addressed him with their concern, and his response was that he preaches the same message every week and until people start applying it to their life he will continue with the same message of the Gospel.

what do you think?

Funnily enough, I recently heard that Bill Hybels says the same thing. I don't know where he says it, as I've only read 1 of his books.

If he means that he preaches the same sermon word for word, it could be counter productive as folk may begin to switch off when they realise they've heard it before. If he means he repeats the same point - eg like using your gifts - over and over again with different illustrations and visual aids until it sinks it - fantastic, why not? A minister in our circuit told me about this and will probably, I suspect, be shortly doing the same thing himself.

It means a teaching or Bible passage gets really drummed in, and where it's been learned and understood, it may be applied. Most of the time we work hard to prepare a sermon which may be forgotten as soon as the congregation leave the building.

 

[jhitch244]

Strong In Him - thank you for the response. i never thought about the congregation "switching off"- that is interesting to think about

 

[Tavita]

good choice of Scripture! but, is it the pastor or the congregation responsible for only consuming milk? if the leader is giving a sermon because the elders agree that they concerned with how people in the congregation are living. i think it is the pastors responsibility to preach the Gospel and the congregation to seek more in the Holy Scripture.

Acts 17:11
Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true.

If the elders are concerned with how the people are living then maybe they should be taught how to live in the Spirit, and by the Spirit, in their daily lives instead of hearing a salvation message over and over...??

 

[jhitch244]

If the elders are concerned with how the people are living then maybe they should be taught how to live in the Spirit, and by the Spirit, in their daily lives instead of hearing a salvation message over and over...??

i agree living in the Spirit would cure all... i don't know if the repeated sermon was on salvation or not. i like to think (i apologize for not having facts) that it was on something like, loving your neighbor.

 

[New_Wineskin]

well i hope first of all that pastors/priests do not do it for the money....

A very low percentage don't have it as their career or a source of income . And , an awful lot of of them preach on the "tithe" quite a bit .

and secondly, why move on when people are not grasping or implementing what they learn on the Sabbath.

Sounds like a poor "teacher" for all or most of the group to not grasp something even when stated over and over . Why not tell them to stay home until they "get it" ? Or , tell them that there will be a repeat until leadership is satisfied that their brainwashing is complete ( that is what we are talking about when things are repeated over and over until people agree with something ) ? In that way , those that did get it can stay home until they are told that the leaders are ready for the next lesson .

Martin Luther preached was said to have preached over 3,000 times between 1510 and 1546. i don't think he was taking the easy way out or trying to get paid.

No - he was only the pope of his group and had the group name themselves and identify with him . Power is even more seductive than money . OOH less than 100 times a year . Many leaders do that - just on Sundays .

we so often think that if we do not hear a mind blowing message on sunday, then we did not get our "moneys worth". i personally believe the best sermons are when complicated concepts are simplified.

I really don't think that there are complicated concepts . Serminators seem to make them complicated so that they seem impressive . Somewhere down the line , they finally bring them back to simple ideas making them look again to be great teachers . They have the people coming and going .

 

[Tavita]

i agree living in the Spirit would cure all... i don't know if the repeated sermon was on salvation or not. i like to think (i apologize for not having facts) that it was on something like, loving your neighbor.

Wellll... I responded to this post by catwoman...

My pastor (LCMS) says he will continue to preach Law and Gospel and nothing of living the Christian life. He's done it for 17 years at his present church. So, in a way, he is doing what Luther said in the OP.

It's good for keeping a person anchored in the truth but it really sucks when you want to grow in the faith.

But yeah.. we need to learn HOW to obey God and to hear His voice teaching us HOW to live for Him daily.