Geologic Proof of an old earth creation.

[coffee4u]

I didn't mention anything about "we" so sorry if my post wasn't clear. I just said "agreed" and since that was my post I thought it was clear it was just meant from me. But I guess you're going with their "we" so I can see what you mean, sorry.

It was SavedByGrace3 who said it, you just agreed with him. I have his quote in the post only it doesn't show up only your does. If I click edit his quote shows as being there. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Guess its issues with Firefox or the site.

 

[SavedByGrace3]

It was SavedByGrace3 who said it, you just agreed with him. I have his quote in the post only it doesn't show up only your does. If I click edit his quote shows as being there. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Guess its issues with Firefox or the site.

I am happy to be a friend and brother to all who come here and confess the Lord Jesus. I refuse to divide from others who have been bought with the blood and life and resurrection of Jesus!
Blessings and love to all!

 

[coffee4u]

I am happy to be a friend and brother to all who come here and confess the Lord Jesus. I refuse to divide from others who have been bought with the blood and life and resurrection of Jesus!
Blessings and love to all!

I'm sorry, but I believe evolution is from the devil and that it is a sledge hammer to the very core of Christianity. That is how strongly I feel about it. As such while I appreciate your sentiment and I believe you mean it I believe your vision is being completely clouded on this threat before you.
Nothing against you personally you obviously feel it is correct but I just as strongly believe it is wrong.
As such I will not only speak against but it but have a responsibility to speak against it. If I saw evil and said nothing then I would be in sin.

Blessings back brother, but I will continue to upload Exodus 20.
And God spoke all these words:
1 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy.

 

[SuperCow]

I'm sorry, but I believe evolution is from the devil and that it is a sledge hammer to the very core of Christianity. That is how strongly I feel about it. As such while I appreciate your sentiment and I believe you mean it I believe your vision is being completely clouded on this threat before you.
Nothing against you personally you obviously feel it is correct but I just as strongly believe it is wrong.
As such I will not only speak against but it but have a responsibility to speak against it. If I saw evil and said nothing then I would be in sin.

Blessings back brother, but I will continue to upload Exodus 20.
And God spoke all these words:
1 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy.

Old earth creationists don't believe in evolution either. Genesis 1:12,21,24 refutes evolution (within Christianity) in my opinion. Genesis 1:12; however, is past tense and therefore difficult to reconcile with a single day.

 

[coffee4u]

Old earth creationists don't believe in evolution either. Genesis 1:12,21,24 refutes evolution (within Christianity) in my opinion. Genesis 1:12; however, is past tense and therefore difficult to reconcile with a single day.

There are a range of different old age views so I will take that on the individual view. Same way there are different YEC views.

 

[SuperCow]

There are a range of different old age views so I will take that on the individual view. Same way there are different YEC views.

If they believe in evolution they are theistic evolutionists, not old earth creationists.

 

[JulieB67]

Old earth creationists don't believe in evolution

Exactly. I'm an Old earth creationist but am totally against the theory of evolution.

 

[SavedByGrace3]

If they believe in evolution they are theistic evolutionists, not old earth creationists.

I would clarify that in my case. I am parts of both.
I believe in the Gap Concept that says there was a "gap" between Gen 1:1 and 1:2. It was during this period that the vast majority of the earths geologic formations took place.
I believe in Theistic evolution that God commanded into operation in Gen 1.

 

[The Barbarian]

Atheists act like evolution and earth formation is the end all be all for Christianity. Like I do not really care how God did it he could do anything he wants.

That's a realistic and practical viewpoint.

 

[Sheila Davis]

Looking at this cross section of a location in the Grand Canyon.

1. What we are looking at first, at the bottom we see limestone, which is rock that is formed by the bodies of early life falling to the bottom of deep oceans.
2. This rock is covered by other sedimentary layers.
3. The surface raises above sea level. It is then covered by lava formations that were laid down on dry land by volcanic activity.
4. Then, the volcanic rock was worn down and shows evidence of vegetation.
5. Then the volcanic rock was covered over by more sedimentary layers.
6. The next occurrence would be a crustal uplifting causing the layers to become diagonal.
7. The diagonal rock was in the form of mountains which were then eroded away leveling the formation.
8. Then more sedimentary rocks were laid down, some of which were limestone indicating the surface has again submerged below the ocean.

Many young earth creationists will state that all these formations occurred over a couple months during Noah's flood.

Here is the issue.
We see layers of sedimentary rock including limestone(life), followed by a dry-land layer of lava, followed by erosion and vegetation, followed by more sedimentary layers, followed by crustal upheaval forming diagonal layers, followed by the erosion of those layers down flat, followed by more sedimentary layers (including limestone, again life beneath an ocean), and finally back to the current dry earth of southwest USA. There is simply no way that this history could be formed during a 120-day flood. We can only conclude that all of these formations were made over a very long period of time, long before Adam and Eve were made in the Garden of Eden.

View attachment 310133

The knowledge of science is a God-given gift to man - and if one thinks deeply about God himself he is the ultimate scientist. He created - man can only study what God has already created - and from what scripture says what we see if it isn't made of what it appears to be _ Hebrews 11:3.
God is the ultimate scientist and he gave a teeny tiny bit of that knowledge to man.

I believe man is fairly accurate in his science in studying the age of the Earth or fossil. Fairly accurate in studying the Earth herself - her layers, mantels, and core.
And the strangest thing is science says that the water on the earth is older than the Earth or the sun.
Much of Earth's Water Is Older Than the Sun

Earth’s water is older than the Sun
Genesis 1:6-7 God dealt with the waters and the fragments in the creation.

 

[fred tacky]

The age of the earth: From a theological perspective:
1) The Bible is to be read literally unless there is a good reason to read it figuratively or symbolically. For example, Jesus said, "the kingdom of heaven is like..." "Is like" refers to symbolic.
2) The Israelites read the 4th Commandment (to respect the Sabbath - because God made the world in 6 days and rested on the 7th) as 6 literal days and worked 6 literal days.
3) Jesus took the Genesis Creation account as literal and said "In the beginning, He made them male and female..."

 

[fred tacky]

The age of the earth: From a geochronology perspective (physics):
1) There is NO ACCURATE METHOD to determine the vast ages of fossils, planets, etc. For over 20 years, physicists/scientists have repeatedly stated that isotope decay rates are constant only in ambient temperatures but NOT under high heat.
2) Radioactive isotopes initially formed at a temperature of 1 billion degrees (K) after the Big Bang (if you believe the Big Bang and I do not), causing increased kinetic energy & accelerated isotope decay rates from millions/billions of years down to hours or minutes.
3) These already-decayed isotopes were later deposited on the earth's surface as the earth formed, giving the erroneous impression of vast ages.
4) This principle has been repeatedly published in peer-reviewed science journals (Journal of Geophysical Research, Physics Magazine, etc.) with warnings against erroneous vast ages.
5) Proof of this principle is MODERN-DAY volcanic eruptions only decades old are ERRONEOUSLY dated as being millions of years old - even at moderately high magma temperatures much lower than the Big Bang.
6) Millions/billions of years is a MISCALCULATION which does not take into account accelerated isotope decay rates under high heat - and this according to scientists who specialize in isotope decay rates.
7) Do these findings rock the science establishment? Yes, so they choose not to deal with it. Too many high-profile reports/studies which would need to be rescinded. Too much internal politics, too many careers based on millions/billions of years, to make changes at this point. Sad since this info has been available for over 20 years!!!

 

[fred tacky]

The age of the earth: From a paleontology perspective:
1) Since 2011 there have been approximately 30 samples of PRESERVED Dino soft body tissues that have confirmed Carbon-14 atoms within the body tissues. Google "preserved T-rex soft tissue".
2) Because they contained Carbon-14 atoms, this made it possible to date their ages in various USA labs (Geochron Labs, Univ. of Arizona, Univ. of Georgia, Beta Analytic Inc.) using various lab techniques (AMS, Beta, etc.).
3) The ages of the Dino body tissues span from 22,380 years old to 39,230 years old. The fact that there are any Carbon-14 atoms in the Dino body tissues tells us they are younger than 55,000 years because there should be ZERO Carbon-14 atoms remaining if they are older than 55,000 years old.
4) And why are the soft tissues and bones still fresh and preserved with flexible blood vessels containing visible red blood cells rather than fossilized into rock? Maybe because they are not millions of years old like we were told in our public schools since we were children? Just maybe.

 

[fred tacky]

The age of the earth: From a geology perspective:
1) The presence of Carbon-14 atoms in organic matter from those geologic periods is a big problem from an ancient-earth perspective. As soon as a tree or portion of a tree dies, the amount of Carbon-14 atoms in wood decreases and is completely gone by 55,000 years after death. If there is any detectable Carbon-14 atoms, the wood is LESS THAN 55,000 years old.
2) Coal and unfossilized wood were obtained from various petroleum companies' storage facilities using core-drilling samples from the permafrost regions of the Alaskan Tundra and Alberta, BC. The tests showed Carbon-14 atoms to be present and dated at between 37,420 years old to 49,690 years old even though the core-drilling samples came from the Jurassic (145 - 200 million years ago), Cretaceous (65 - 145 million years ago), and Eocene period (48 - 55 million years ago).
3) Why are Carbon-14 atoms still present in the coal and wood if they are millions of years old? These tests were conducted by petroleum geologists as far back as 1987 up to the present. (Ref: ResearchOpenWorld.com)

 

[fred tacky]

The age of the earth: From an anthropological perspective:
1) Many written eyewitness testimonies of those who saw dinosaurs (Bible: Job 41/Leviathan, etc.)
2) Acambaro ceramic dinosaur figurines discovered in Latin America which were thermoluminescence-tested and found to be at least 1500 years old.
3) A Stegosaurus carving discovered at the Ta-Prohm Temple in Cambodia (1100 AD)
4) Anasazi dinosaur petroglyphs (500 AD)
5) Sepphoris/Israeli Ceratopsid dinosaur mosaic (300 AD) and many other anthropological artifacts show dinosaurs and humans lived together in times much more recent than millions of years ago.

 

[Job 33:6]

The age of the earth: From a geochronology perspective (physics):
1) There is NO ACCURATE METHOD to determine the vast ages of fossils, planets, etc. For over 20 years, physicists/scientists have repeatedly stated that isotope decay rates are constant only in ambient temperatures but NOT under high heat.
2) Radioactive isotopes initially formed at a temperature of 1 billion degrees (K) after the Big Bang (if you believe the Big Bang and I do not), causing increased kinetic energy & accelerated isotope decay rates from millions/billions of years down to hours or minutes.
3) These already-decayed isotopes were later deposited on the earth's surface as the earth formed, giving the erroneous impression of vast ages.
4) This principle has been repeatedly published in peer-reviewed science journals (Journal of Geophysical Research, Physics Magazine, etc.) with warnings against erroneous vast ages.
5) Proof of this principle is MODERN-DAY volcanic eruptions only decades old are ERRONEOUSLY dated as being millions of years old - even at moderately high magma temperatures much lower than the Big Bang.
6) Millions/billions of years is a MISCALCULATION which does not take into account accelerated isotope decay rates under high heat - and this according to scientists who specialize in isotope decay rates.
7) Do these findings rock the science establishment? Yes, so they choose not to deal with it. Too many high-profile reports/studies which would need to be rescinded. Too much internal politics, too many careers based on millions/billions of years, to make changes at this point. Sad since this info has been available for over 20 years!!!

The age of the earth: From a geology perspective:
1) The presence of Carbon-14 atoms in organic matter from those geologic periods is a big problem from an ancient-earth perspective. As soon as a tree or portion of a tree dies, the amount of Carbon-14 atoms in wood decreases and is completely gone by 55,000 years after death. If there is any detectable Carbon-14 atoms, the wood is LESS THAN 55,000 years old.
2) Coal and unfossilized wood were obtained from various petroleum companies' storage facilities using core-drilling samples from the permafrost regions of the Alaskan Tundra and Alberta, BC. The tests showed Carbon-14 atoms to be present and dated at between 37,420 years old to 49,690 years old even though the core-drilling samples came from the Jurassic (145 - 200 million years ago), Cretaceous (65 - 145 million years ago), and Eocene period (48 - 55 million years ago).
3) Why are Carbon-14 atoms still present in the coal and wood if they are millions of years old? These tests were conducted by petroleum geologists as far back as 1987 up to the present. (Ref: ResearchOpenWorld.com)

The age of the earth: From a paleontology perspective:
1) Since 2011 there have been approximately 30 samples of PRESERVED Dino soft body tissues that have confirmed Carbon-14 atoms within the body tissues. Google "preserved T-rex soft tissue".
2) Because they contained Carbon-14 atoms, this made it possible to date their ages in various USA labs (Geochron Labs, Univ. of Arizona, Univ. of Georgia, Beta Analytic Inc.) using various lab techniques (AMS, Beta, etc.).
3) The ages of the Dino body tissues span from 22,380 years old to 39,230 years old. The fact that there are any Carbon-14 atoms in the Dino body tissues tells us they are younger than 55,000 years because there should be ZERO Carbon-14 atoms remaining if they are older than 55,000 years old.
4) And why are the soft tissues and bones still fresh and preserved with flexible blood vessels containing visible red blood cells rather than fossilized into rock? Maybe because they are not millions of years old like we were told in our public schools since we were children? Just maybe.

Response to all radiometric dating claims can be found here:
Age of the earth isn’t 4.6 Billion years

 

[Job 33:6]

The age of the earth: From a theological perspective:
1) The Bible is to be read literally unless there is a good reason to read it figuratively or symbolically. For example, Jesus said, "the kingdom of heaven is like..." "Is like" refers to symbolic.
2) The Israelites read the 4th Commandment (to respect the Sabbath - because God made the world in 6 days and rested on the 7th) as 6 literal days and worked 6 literal days.
3) Jesus took the Genesis Creation account as literal and said "In the beginning, He made them male and female..."

The response can be found in Paul Seely's commentary on the firmament here:
Z-Library single sign on

Also reflected in the following book here:
https://www.amazon.com/Beyond-Firmament-Understanding-Theology-Creation/dp/0978718615

Or otherwise summarized at biologos here:
The Firmament of Genesis 1 is Solid but That’s Not the Point - Articles

And here:
The Waters Above the Firmament

 

[SavedByGrace3]

How could the formation depicted in the OP have formed in the matter of just a few weeks during Noah's Flood? You got multiple layers of limestone, sandstone, solidified lava, and even uplifted layers on top of other limestone, sandstone. Young Earthers insist this happened during the opening days of the flood.
I hold that all of these layers occurred in Gen 1:1 and 1:2.
The Genesis account pertaining to this age began in verse 3, most likely a few hundred million years ago. God commanded the land and the sea to bring forth life... which they did and are continuing to do.
The "earth man" of Gen 1 came into being, just as the record implies, over a period of hundreds of thousands of years.
If I were to date the Gen 2 account of the garden of Eden, Adam, and Eve; I would suggest at the end of the last ice age, about 20 thousand years ago. In the centuries following humanity began to develop by leaps and bounds, this due to the introduction of the God man, Adam.

 

[SavedByGrace3]

The knowledge of science is a God-given gift to man - and if one thinks deeply about God himself he is the ultimate scientist. He created - man can only study what God has already created - and from what scripture says what we see if it isn't made of what it appears to be _ Hebrews 11:3.
God is the ultimate scientist and he gave a teeny tiny bit of that knowledge to man.

I believe man is fairly accurate in his science in studying the age of the Earth or fossil. Fairly accurate in studying the Earth herself - her layers, mantels, and core.
And the strangest thing is science says that the water on the earth is older than the Earth or the sun.
Much of Earth's Water Is Older Than the Sun

Earth’s water is older than the Sun
Genesis 1:6-7 God dealt with the waters and the fragments in the creation.

"{...scientists have found an enormous cloud of water vapor floating in space. Located 30 billion miles away in a quasar – a massively powerful cosmic body – the water cloud is estimated to contain at least 140 trillion times the amount of water in all the seas and oceans here on Earth."

 

[Sheila Davis]

"{...scientists have found an enormous cloud of water vapor floating in space. Located 30 billion miles away in a quasar – a massively powerful cosmic body – the water cloud is estimated to contain at least 140 trillion times the amount of water in all the seas and oceans here on Earth."

Yes I've read that around 2 years ago and several other smaller bodies of water.