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Gender pronouns

Wryetui

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Christ is risen! Greetings to everyone. It has been a long time since I have posted here. I hope everyone is alright.

I come with a question that has been bothering me and that is current in our society. I am talking about the so called "gender pronouns" that are used by people who call themselves transexual, transgender or whatever else. We Christians do not accept these teachings and we do not accept these false realities, but what should we do when those people ask us to call them that? What should we do if they become angered by us not calling them that?

In short, how should we adress these people?
 

Aussie Pete

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Christ is risen! Greetings to everyone. It has been a long time since I have posted here. I hope everyone is alright.

I come with a question that has been bothering me and that is current in our society. I am talking about the so called "gender pronouns" that are used by people who call themselves transexual, transgender or whatever else. We Christians do not accept these teachings and we do not accept these false realities, but what should we do when those people ask us to call them that? What should we do if they become angered by us not calling them that?

In short, how should we adress these people?
There are only 3 applicable pronouns. He, she and it. Tell them to take their pick.
 
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AMM

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I have wondered this as well. I have not known many individuals who choose different pronouns, so I suppose it hasn't been directly relevant in my life, yet. But I've heard good, convincing arguments on both sides...

following to see what other people say
 
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Allen of the Cross

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I completely agree with gospels: it is probably best to address them by name. That way, you do not offend them (and thus they take offense with the gospel,) while at the same time, you do not go along with wickedness. Showing them the love of Jesus Christ can be one of the most powerful testimonies available to us. God bless you and have a wonderful day.
 
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ArmyMatt

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whatever is their biological sex, that's how they should be addressed. that being said, I would not go out of my way to insult or instigate them.
 
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Albion

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I have wondered this as well. I have not known many individuals who choose different pronouns, so I suppose it hasn't been directly relevant in my life, yet. But I've heard good, convincing arguments on both sides...
I'd love to hear the one that's supposed to be a "good, convincing" argument on the side of doing what the LGBTQAI2+ community insists upon.
 
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~Anastasia~

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This is a rather unique situation. I don’t mean to be insensitive, but at what other time have people tried to change standard language to fit their own desires? To the point of demanding that others adjust their use of common language to fit what they themselves deem appropriate I mean?

I’m not talking about something like racial slurs or other insults. He/she/him/her are very ingrained in our language.

If a person wants to present themselves as the opposite sex, well ... that’s not up to us to personally judge. (Of course we know people are born a sex but I don’t think you’re asking what the Church thinks of people rejecting it?) But if I meet you and you look like a female, present yourself as female, I’ll call you “she” or “her” when I’m talking about you. Your private parts or what you’ve done to them are not my business, and we can leave it at that. But if you want me to invent a word just for you, and others are the same, all wanting invented words, and each preferring a different invented word, and I’m supposed to remember which one you want? Sorry - that’s not how language works.

I’ll honestly try to be respectful. If you present female I’ll use she/her. Male I’ll use he/him. There have been a few cases in life where I couldn’t tell and I try to be judicious and structure my sentences so as not to make a mistake (they or them and y’all are useful, if it fits). Using the name is an easy fix, if known.

I can’t imagine myself in a social group with many people all preferring different pronouns. I wouldn’t be able to keep up with it all.
 
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Albion

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I completely agree with gospels: it is probably best to address them by name. That way, you do not offend them....

I was about to make the same recommendation myself, but it won't work.

For one thing, it is almost impossible to have any kind of conversation or even written commentary in which only a given name is used, but never any personal pronoun.

If it's a conversation, you'd have to talk so slowly and deliberately, choosing your words so carefully in order to keep with this format, that it would be quite a trick to pull off.

But then, even if you did accomplish it, it would sound absurdly contrived to any listener. And also, it WOULD be taken as an insult by any of them who are supportive of the demand that trans people be addressed and described only by the personal pronoun they recently selected.
 
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Frugality

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I address them only by name and her or she, nothing else. I take the person's word for it when they tell me their name and whether they're male or female because I'm not checking what's in their pants or looking into their birth records. As far as the other dozens of pronouns, I do not and will not play that game.
 
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Albion

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I address them only by name and her or she, nothing else. I take the person's word for it when they tell me their name and whether they're male or female because I'm not checking what's in their pants or looking into their birth records.

Yes. IF you are just addressing them.

It won't work if you are speaking about them, which, however does come up for most people.
 
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WanderedHome

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Christ is risen! Greetings to everyone. It has been a long time since I have posted here. I hope everyone is alright.

I come with a question that has been bothering me and that is current in our society. I am talking about the so called "gender pronouns" that are used by people who call themselves transexual, transgender or whatever else. We Christians do not accept these teachings and we do not accept these false realities, but what should we do when those people ask us to call them that? What should we do if they become angered by us not calling them that?

In short, how should we adress these people?


I honestly don't think there are that many people who want to change genders. I think what happens is the political left likes to take extreme minority cases (like .01%) and exaggerate it like it is a normal daily encounter. Although, I suspect it will become more of a normal ocurrence as they continue to confuse our children, in the public schools and universities, causing them anxiety and to question their natural identities.

However, on a less pessimistic side- I understand they differentiate between "gender" and "sex". Gender is often defined as the social roles you fit into, however warped those roles are presented by our culture. For example, a male may not be into sports, hunting, fishing, and other stereotypical male interests, but more interested in stereotypical female interests like relationships, caring for children, and baking- for example (lol, IDK :) ) That male then feels like he does not fit the "man" label so he must have been meant to be a woman.

The problem is, why do stereotypical roles have to define your gender? You can be a true man and also like baking or children or whatever. You can be a true woman and like fishing, sports, etc.
 
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Albion

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The problem is, why do stereotypical roles have to define your gender? You can be a true man and also like baking or children or whatever. You can be a true woman and like fishing, sports, etc.
It's part of an overall campaign to erase all such distinctions between people, thereby also eliminating everything that's part of the inheritance of our culture's customs, religious concepts, natural rights, family, marriage, etc.
 
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archer75

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Christ is risen! Greetings to everyone. It has been a long time since I have posted here. I hope everyone is alright.

I come with a question that has been bothering me and that is current in our society. I am talking about the so called "gender pronouns" that are used by people who call themselves transexual, transgender or whatever else. We Christians do not accept these teachings and we do not accept these false realities, but what should we do when those people ask us to call them that? What should we do if they become angered by us not calling them that?

In short, how should we adress these people?
luckily, in English, there's no choice of pronoun when addressing someone.
 
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WanderedHome

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It's part of an overall campaign to erase all such distinctions between people, thereby also eliminating everything that's part of the inheritance of our culture's customs, religious concepts, natural rights, family, marriage, etc.

Ah, yes. So they would agree with my question, but their error is not to correct and restore a cultural understanding of identity, but to destroy or invert it.
 
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Mantishand

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This kind of thing is ridiculous. The gay lifestyle is being crammed down our throats. Can you imagine trying to raise a Christian child in this day and age? Just about every television show has a gay couple, and some show them making out. There are commercials playing non stop that promote pills that allow to to have sex with any living thing and not die from aids. Good is bad and bad is good. Come soon Jesus.
 
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rusmeister

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Wow. First time in a long time that anyone has actually thrown a question straight up my alley!

I am a grammar teacher. I have at least as much authority to speak on grammar as you would grant an auto mechanic to tell you what's wrong with your car. And as an EFL teacher, in terms of language I really AM the auto mechanic, and you guys are just the automobile owners. I can kick unwarranted claims of expertise, but I claim it in grammar.

English grammar is NOT your private property. It is a public thing, determined by convention, with rules that must be prescribed to people that don't know them (so talking of "descriptive grammar" is REALLY stupid, it's like talking about "subjective internal combustion"). Convention is super important - it is how we preserve the ability to understand what anyone said a couple of centuries down the road. Terms CANNOT be legitimately ripped from their etymological roots (as has been done with terms like "gay"); when they are evil euphemisms we aid and abet their evil purpose when we use them whether we know it or not.

Personal pronouns are a vital part of that convention. All of English-speaking society has long determined that subject pronouns have a definite purpose, one of which is identifying the sex of people in the third person singular, just as Russian does so in its past tense verbs, for example. No individual has any right to impose on others a demand counter to that social convention, especially one that seeks to subvert it. Therefore there is no legitimate basis on which people may claim or expect that we assent to their desire to deny truth, other than our own soft-headedness and ignorance of these matters, which is still not legitimate.

This is a rather unique situation. I don’t mean to be insensitive, but at what other time have people tried to change standard language to fit their own desires? To the point of demanding that others adjust their use of common language to fit what they themselves deem appropriate I mean?

I’m not talking about something like racial slurs or other insults. He/she/him/her are very ingrained in our language.

If a person wants to present themselves as the opposite sex, well ... that’s not up to us to personally judge. (Of course we know people are born a sex but I don’t think you’re asking what the Church thinks of people rejecting it?) But if I meet you and you look like a female, present yourself as female, I’ll call you “she” or “her” when I’m talking about you. Your private parts or what you’ve done to them are not my business, and we can leave it at that. But if you want me to invent a word just for you, and others are the same, all wanting invented words, and each preferring a different invented word, and I’m supposed to remember which one you want? Sorry - that’s not how language works.

I’ll honestly try to be respectful. If you present female I’ll use she/her. Male I’ll use he/him. There have been a few cases in life where I couldn’t tell and I try to be judicious and structure my sentences so as not to make a mistake (they or them and y’all are useful, if it fits). Using the name is an easy fix, if known.

I can’t imagine myself in a social group with many people all preferring different pronouns. I wouldn’t be able to keep up with it all.

Hi, Anastasia! I think you're the bee's knees, and almost always agree with you, but here I do have to pick a bone with you (which I hope is not too big a bone for you!) When you say "IT is not up to us to personally judge", I get a sense that you are buying, at least a little, into a purely modern interpretation of the command to not judge that is far from its original intent, that amounts to asking us not to think or decide whether a thing is true or not. We MUST judge, as best we can - and as people who live according to convention, have every right and even duty to judge whether a person is a man or a woman in fact, and not merely in wishful thinking. A person may deceive us, but if we KNOW that they are for example) males casting themselves as females or even some other imaginary being altogether, then we buy into the lie they have already deceived themselves with, and now seek to deceive others as well.

And the whole point is that this modern movement seeks to put you into a place where many people do in fact prefer different imaginary pronouns, and you would indeed be expected to keep up with it or be punished for failing to do so. The Christian martyrs were far better than us, but they did show us that we ought to prefer the Truth and the truth over the phantoms and phantasies of the world. We CAN be respectful, and being respectful does NOT mean that we must agree with them when they tell us to lie according to the convention that has been passed down to us. There is a reason, after all, that they are asking us to do that: because THEY know that it does in fact matter what we say.
 
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Albion

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Does it not boil down to this--

People, taken as a whole, speak in all sorts of different ways, some ungrammatical, some with colloquialisms, and some others who are just plain vulgar. BUT now we are confronted with activists who may well retaliate if you do not use exactly the wording they demand.

That kind of threat, along with the not-so-simple challenge of being able to get it right if you should try to cooperate, is what worries many people.
 
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Wryetui

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Thank you all for your answers. I did not expect these many. I did not face this myself yet, but I have always disagreed with people and yet did not fight with them at all. I have come into contact with many active sodomites or fornicators, for example, many of whom are friends of mine, and not once I supported their lifestyle and I have always given the truth: the life you are living is sinful and you have to repent and change it according to the Gospel in order to partake into God's kingdom. Nothing that is said respectfully and in a loving way will case disruption.
 
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