Gambleing sin or not?

[SUNSTONE]

I say in and of itself, no gambling is not a sin. But if you create all kinds of scenarios sure it can become sin.

I used to be a professional poker player. I don't do it anymore for many different reasons, the biggest is my location.(On a side note the song Gambling Man is on, by Bob Seager, no kidding )

Well let me know what you think, and if at all possible, would you please get mean and nasty with this topic. Hahaha j/k ;P

 

[A Sheep]

When a person gambles, they are contributing to the lottery, casino, horse-track, or whatever, and many families are destroyed and some people kill themselves due to the effect gambling had on her/him and/or their families.

It is similar to purchasing drugs, which in turn supplies the drug dealer and his/her supplier & producer with funds to purchase weapons, more drugs, and murder/torture people.

There is also the aspect of not trusting God to provide for you and your family (this is said in a general sense). Playing card games for fun at home with friends and/or family (without money, alcohol or drugs involved) is OK though.

I have to go out now, but I find this topic interesting and will try to return later.

 

[Joseph16]

Sunstone,

I can only offer my opinion with no substantial backing but it seems to me that gambling can be a sin in some cases but not all.  I would say that in your case as a proffesional gambler, that is how you make your living and I would hope that if it is your living you would be responsible with it.  What would make it a sin would be the compulsive gambling in which many people destroy their lives gambling everything away to the point that it would become an indulgence.  Being that you were able to stop your gambling when it was no longer reasonable, I would say that it is not an indulgence or a compulsion for you an in turn not a sin.  As long as your reasonable about it I can't see how it would be a sin, whether it's your proffesion or your hobby.

Like I said that's simply my opinion and I may be missing something that the Bible clearly says in contradiction to that.  Good luck and peace be with you!

Your's in Christ,

Fred 

 

[Reformationist]

Originally posted by SUNSTONE
I say in and of itself, no gambling is not a sin. But if you create all kinds of scenarios sure it can become sin.

I used to be a professional poker player. I don't do it anymore for many different reasons, the biggest is my location.(On a side note the song Gambling Man is on, by Bob Seager, no kidding )

Well let me know what you think, and if at all possible, would you please get mean and nasty with this topic. Hahaha j/k ;P

No.  Not a sin.  It's a sin if it becomes your master.  If it is your job and you strive to be good at it, by all means, go for it.  If it causes issues wherein you're causing your family to stumble because of it, then to continue doing so is sinful.  But no, gambling in moderation is not sinful.

God bless

 

[Joseph16]

Originally posted by Reformationist
No.  Not a sin.  It's a sin if it becomes your master.  If it is your job and you strive to be good at it, by all means, go for it.  If it causes issues wherein you're causing your family to stumble because of it, then to continue doing so is sinful.  But no, gambling in moderation is not sinful.

God bless

Well said Ref!!!!  Although, I think A Sheep makes a very valid point as well.  I think the key is the part about moderation...as long as it does not become an indulgence and a problem.

 

[Andrew]

It is similar to purchasing drugs, which in turn supplies the drug dealer and his/her supplier & producer with funds to purchase weapons, more drugs, and murder/torture people.

just an interesting side thot: how do you know that the money you 'legitimately' spend in the world is not supporting some immoral or illegal organisation or persons.

eg my colleague use to buy this particular brand of clothes (very famous and well known) but got a little disgusted when she found out that the owner of the label gives money to the Church of Satan.

Or what abt the money that you pay to a restaurant owner -- and he contributes some of it to some temple building fund of his religion.

Or if I buy a bottle of wine or a few cans of beer, am I not contributing to the alchoholism industry? If I buy a Dunhill belt or go on one of their holiday packages, am i not contributing to the tobacco industry? What if i open a supermarket and sell liquor and cigarettes?

but back to the topic of gambling. I think its best we post our definition of what gambling is first:

well according to my Longman dict:

1. to risk (money, property, etc) on the result of something uncertain, such as a card game, a horse race, a business arrangement etc.
2. to do something risky that depends for its success on certain things happening as one wishes.

so strictly speaking, who here has not taken risks with his money?
eg u buy a property or used car, there's a risk.
u buy stocks and shares, unit trusts, insurance policies, there are risks, small or large.
u buy a new brand of an electronic product there are risks that it may not last or do what it says it can do.

So gambling per se is not necessarily wrong. so when does it become a sin?...

 

[Outspoken]

parible of the talents?

 

[kern]

Originally posted by Andrew

eg my colleague use to buy this particular brand of clothes (very famous and well known) but got a little disgusted when she found out that the owner of the label gives money to the Church of Satan.

This rumor is attributed to a lot of companies but is never true (the biggest victims of it are Proctor & Gamble -- who have sued over this rumor -- and Elizabeth Taylor).

The usual rumor goes that the person appeared on a talk show (usually Oprah or Donahue) and claimed that they donated large parts of their profits to Church of Satan. Sometimes additional details are added (like the line "there aren't enough Christians to make a difference", or some comment about the company's logo, etc.)

-Chris

 

[kern]

Originally posted by Outspoken
parible of the talents?

I think that's more like investment rather than gambling, isn't it? Although I suppose investment can be considered a form of gambling depending on how you are doing it.

-Chris

 

[Andrew]

This rumor is attributed to a lot of companies but is never true (the biggest victims of it are Proctor & Gamble -- who have sued over this rumor -- and Elizabeth Taylor).

Rumour or no rumour, can a Christian guarantee that every cent he spends in the world goes directly to doing God's work, and none to the devil? Clearly its not realistic or possible.

eg in my country, Buddhism and Taoism is very strong among the heartlanders. EVERY eatery in the heartlands has a prominently displayed altar to some Toaist/Buddhist demon. Its like every McDonalds in the US has an altar to some god. So if you eat and spend your money there, rest assured the owner is not going to tithed his earnings to the church. *L

I think gambling becomes a sin when

1. It's illegal gambling -- ie you are breaking the law.
2. It's become an addiction and u have no control.
3. You are trusting in it to finance your needs rather than trusting in God as Supplier.
4. Your gambling stumbles others like your family members or friends.
5. You rather gamble than work hard or look for a job. ie see it as a short-cut to success.

professional gambler? why not Sunstone? take the money from the worldly casinos and bring it into God's Kingdom! that's the end-time transfer of wealth. The wealth of the wicked laid up for the righteous!!

 

[Reformationist]

Originally posted by kern
This rumor is attributed to a lot of companies but is never true

I don't know if I'd go so far as to say that it is "never true."  It may not have been true for that particular company/person you note.  There is, however, a large phone company who contributes a whole lot of money to the porn industry.  The sad part is that it's obviously not something that they advertise, at least not as part of an ad campaign.  So many people use their service and indirectly contribute to that immoral industry and don't even realize it.

God bless

 

[Outspoken]

"I think that's more like investment rather than gambling, isn't it? Although I suppose investment can be considered a form of gambling depending on how you are doing it.
"

Its actually about doing foolish things with your possentions, like gambling

 

[cenimo]

Having worked in casinos for 20 years, my outlook on this will probably be a little different...as they say in the business, it takes about five years to really learn the business....spotting cheaters, handling people, etc..all on top of the technical stuff that goes with each game.... for a while it's fun, then it's just another job, and then one day you start thinking it's no better than dope dealers...

Gamblers may start out "recreationally" but any casino has its regulars, and once they "get the habit", that's it...every spare waking momnet, and dime, goes to gambling...and then it's not just spare dimes but rent money, milk money, etc....

The casinos are in the ego business as much as whatever business they want to call themselves, "gaming", entertainment, recreation, etc...They cater to people's egos and let those people blow an awful lot of money, each thinking they'll be the one to overcome the odds....
- Early on in America, when a lot of people were illiterate, a banner with a tiger on it hung in casinos, it meant "come try to beat the tiger ( the odds) - that tell you anything?

In the 80's, the Vegas casino owners for the first time had to go to out -of-state bankers to finance their new construction projects and expansions. In the west, that meant Salt Lake City... that meant Mormons (Mormons own casinos, they don't encourage their own members gambling in casinos).... so, they had to come up with an acceptable term for gambling as gambling wouldn;t get a lot of finanacing approved, and that's when the industry fell in love with the term "gaming".
It's like this folks, walk in and bet your money, you are gambling, the casinos are the ones in the gaming business.

Gamblers biggest enemies are themselves. Casinos keep growing and growing because a person with $50 "to blow" will lose an additional $350 or much more trying to get the original $50 "back". People who want or will want their losses back have absolutely no business at all walking in to a casino. The only way anyone can gamble successfully is to consider the money already gone once it's converted to "chips" ( misnomer, actually cheques) and anything that comes back as gravy. Only one in a thousand play that way.

As far as the OP, Playing Poker a Sin or not? that one is very tough- there was a court case in Califronia years ago to decide if poker was gambling or skill. The court decided poker was a game of skill, because over the course of several hours, the players would all get an equal amount of good and bad hands, it's how they played those hands that determined who won.

As for gambling in general, coinsider Proverbs 26:11

As a dog returns to its vomit, a fool returns to his folly

 

[SUNSTONE]

Originally posted by Outspoken
"I think that's more like investment rather than gambling, isn't it? Although I suppose investment can be considered a form of gambling depending on how you are doing it.
"

Its actually about doing foolish things with your possentions, like gambling

What about the stock market, especialy now?

 

[SUNSTONE]

cenimo

I imagine you have seen alot of people throw there lives away on gambleing. But what percentage of people who came to the casinos ended up throwing there lives away?

I played in casinos for years, but right now I am in a location where the rake (what the house takes) is the highest in the country. It is just simple math over the long run. So I don't play unless its just for fun. Last year I only played about 6 or 7 times the entire year.

I really never understood people who played slot machines, or went to the tables where the odd's where stacked against them in a big way on some.
To me they were totally boring, and took very little if any skill to play. Poker has a depth that is unmatched in the casinos, and it takes a sharp disciplined person to play the game.

I would have to say a major majority of people that play in the casinos don't throw there lives away.

 

[kern]

Originally posted by Outspoken

Its actually about doing foolish things with your possentions, like gambling

Well, color me confused -- the two servants who the lord is pleased with are the ones who went and doubled their money, while the one who the lord is angry at is the one who hid his money in the earth. He even says "Should you not then have put my money in the bank so that I could have got it back with interest on my returns?"

I thought this was not about money at all, but rather about the gifts that God gives us -- you should not hide them in the earth but rather use them to God's glory. I don't really see what this has to do with gambling at all.

-Chris

 

[cenimo]

Sunstone

Re: the stock market

there is a tecnnique called "shorting", i.e., you are looking for a stock to decrease, not increase... the real pros make a lot of money with this technique

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

Originally posted by kern
Well, color me confused -- the two servants who the lord is pleased with are the ones who went and doubled their money, while the one who the lord is angry at is the one who hid his money in the earth. He even says "Should you not then have put my money in the bank so that I could have got it back with interest on my returns?"

I thought this was not about money at all, but rather about the gifts that God gives us -- you should not hide them in the earth but rather use them to God's glory. I don't really see what this has to do with gambling at all.

-Chris

It's about anything that God gives us.  Which of course can include money. 

We are to "invest" wisely".  Personally, I'm not into gambling per se' but I do occasionally, spend $1 on a lotto ticket.  I don't consider that gambling and I don't consider it a sin.

My opinion though   

 

[SUNSTONE]

Originally posted by cenimo
Sunstone

Re: the stock market

there is a tecnnique called "shorting", i.e., you are looking for a stock to decrease, not increase... the real pros make a lot of money with this technique

That is just one way of doing it, and it isn't rock solid at all. If it was so perfect everyone would be doing it.

I did this project in the state of Fl. in high school, where we were in a contest who could make the most money off the market. It was fake of course and we didn't include all the leagal fees and stock broker fees. I did this technique, where all I did was look for the biggest fluckuations. The ones that jumped the highest I short sold(meaning you want the numbers to fall). And the ones that lost the most, I bought long. The next day I did the same process all over again. After the first 2 weeks or so my group was leading, and I would have won but we didn't play everyday in that class so it would back fire on me after a day or two had passed.

Anyone have alot of money they won't miss???

 

[cenimo]

Sunstone

Ha! good for you...
I can't bring myself to short with live money either, but we have a teacher at a local commuity college who has won National Contests on this...he teaches a Financial Entrepeneurship Class ( it's a class on the market, he had to call it that to get it scheduled) and stresses that the banks and borkerage houses do most of the shorting.... and thus tell all the investors not to....
if you really want to see some freaky stuff, get on yahoo finanace or a similar site and look up how many people were shorting AA and UAL just prior to 9-11....

Re: shorting....
The Vegas bosses figure only two games can be beat consistently, poker and sports betting..... and most of the successful sports bettors find teams to bet against, not bet on ...