Fundamentalism and Intellectualism

[AV1611VET]

I ask YOU. I ask YOUR knowledge of the Bible.

Fair enough.

Do you deny that the Bible - your beloved KJV - tells us not to suffer a witch to live?

Yes --- It told those from the previous dispensation not to suffer a witch to live.

That is a rather absolute command, don´t you think?

Yes --- given at a time when Israel was probably under what we would call today 'martial law'.

So why does the infallible word of God fail to provide us with a method to FIND a witch?

Because 'we' are not on a witch-hunt like 'they' were.

Note how the witches were in hiding, and King Saul had to look hard to find the witch at Endor?

Do YOU think that the Salem Witch Trials were wrong?

Yes.

Not because your hindsight tells you so, but considering the knowledge of that time.

I wasn't there then, and I don't know how convincing these guys would have been.

I'm glad I wasn't.

And one thing's for sure --- you guys aren't going to rekindle 1692 by claiming that the Bible commands us to execute witches.

 

[Freodin]

And one thing's for sure --- you guys aren't going to rekindle 1692 by claiming that the Bible commands us to execute witches.

I would be thankful if you stopped repeating this slander.

WE are not going to hunt witches by divine command... WE - atheists, unbeliever - do not believe that the Bible is authoritative.

WE might believe that the Bible commands it - but we do not follow Biblical commands.

SO STOP THAT!

 

[MoonLancer]

That's the point --- it wasn't wrong at the time.

Which, by the way, was BC 1491 --- not [AD] '1600 - 1800'.

Consider that the 10 commandments say do not kill, and in the bible it says to kill, whats required is a specific line in the new testament to say witch killing is no longer right because it was still acceptable, nay required, to kill a witch in a day and age when killing was wrong.

 

[AV1611VET]

I would be thankful if you stopped repeating this slander.

WE are not going to hunt witches by divine command...

No --- but you think we should --- don't you?

WE - atheists, unbeliever - do not believe that the Bible is authoritative.

That is why I include the disclaimer:

If you ran the world like you interpret the Bible...

 

[atomweaver]

No --- but you think we should --- don't you?

Whatever gave you that foolish idea?

 

[AV1611VET]

Consider that the 10 commandments say do not kill, and in the bible it says to kill, whats required is a...

No --- what's 'required' is an understanding of Dispensation Theology.

You know what that is, don't you --- it's something you don't want taught in science class --- remember?

Here's a question for you (or anyone):

The Bible says to execute a witch --- the Bible also says not to kill.

Since we Christians are so 'uneducated and ignorant', how about someone here with an education show us how that prescription and that proscription can be legitimately reconciled.

(W/O ad homs, of course.)

 

[Hespera]

Fair enough.Yes --- It told those from the previous dispensation not to suffer a witch to live.Yes --- given at a time when Israel was probably under what we would call today 'martial law'.Because 'we' are not on a witch-hunt like 'they' were.

Note how the witches were in hiding, and King Saul had to look hard to find the witch at Endor?Yes.I wasn't there then, and I don't know how convincing these guys would have been.

I'm glad I wasn't.

And one thing's for sure --- you guys aren't going to rekindle 1692 by claiming that the Bible commands us to execute witches.

Here is another thing for sure. Its YOU guys with the history of burning witches, not us.

We wont let you rekindle (good choice of words there) 1692, because, luckily, the chruch has lost the power to pull that kind of thing any more.

Witch burning is a church thing, not an atheist thing, so quit trying to put it off on us.. Its offensive and wrong, and its not going to work.

 

[AV1611VET]

Here is another thing for sure. Its YOU guys with the history of burning witches, not us.

I agree --- and it was wrong --- and God will punish the wrong-doers for doing it too.

We wont let you rekindle (good choice of words there) 1692, because, luckily, the chruch has lost the power to pull that kind of thing any more.

I can't believe this was just solely a "church thing".

I'm sure --- just like Vioxx --- the government was in on it too.

Witch burning is a church thing, not an atheist thing, so quit trying to put it off on us.. Its offensive and wrong, and its not going to work.

Then don't try and incite us to do it by saying it's Biblically-correct to do so.

(Just wait --- this is gonna get worse --- I haven't even mentioned 'genocide' yet --- but I'm planning to as soon as this dies down.)

 

[Hespera]

I agree --- and it was wrong --- and God will punish the wrong-doers for doing it too.I can't believe this was just solely a "church thing".

I'm sure --- just like Vioxx --- the government was in on it too.Then don't try and incite us to do it by saying it's Biblically-correct to do so.

(Just wait --- this is gonna get worse --- I haven't even mentioned 'genocide' yet --- but I'm planning to as soon as this dies down.)

Here is a better plan. Quit trying to put this whole witch thing off on innocent atheists who had nothing to do with it, dont want anything do with it, and dont go by a book that recommends it, pre or post dispensationlzation wise.

Its nice for you that you have a trick way of changing what the bible says to suit.

I think it would be just keen to leave it at that, esp if you would also quit slandering the innocent by claiming that we'd be out burning people. Or that I am trying to "incite" you or anyone else to do anything.

 

[mpok1519]

heres a good idea; everyone should just ignore AV so he can't get his kicks from inciting a riot. =)

everyone knows he's just joking.

 

[Split Rock]

You guys are the ones having trouble with it --- not I.

Does the Bible say to kill witches or not? Yes, or no?

You're the ones who think the Salem Witch Trials were done with the Bible's permission/insistance, then balk when I say that if you ran the world like the Bible permits, we'd be in trouble.

I would never want to see the world run like The Bible says. Clear enough?

Are you admitting that these women were indeed witches?

I do not believe in witches as described by the Church. That is to say, people who fornicate with Satan and gain powers from him to do evil with.

Here are some questions for you. Are there witches today, as I just defined them? Were there witches as I defined them in the past? What does The Bible mean when it makes reference to "witches?" Are witches all gone today?

 

[PreachersWife2004]

MOD HAT ON

Let's get back to the topic at hand!

In case you need a reminder, here is the OP:

Why does it seem that so many fundamentalist Christians are against intellectualism? My father really looks down on universities and anyone who has a bachelor's degree or above. Of course my mom who is about to get her Doctorate in December is pretty upset (it's not that he's jealous, he truly looks down on higher education).
I've noticed this trend in many fundie conservativies both where I live and on this board. Is the fundie tactic to dumb down our generation with scientific illiteracy?

MOD HAT OFF

​

 

[Split Rock]

Mamma mia!

I underestimate you, Hespera --- and I do apologize for that.

QV my last post.

I like that word 'dispensated' ---

Is there a reason why the Ten Commandments were not "dispensated?" How about the stuff in Leviticus about homosexuals?

 

[MoonLancer]

No --- what's 'required' is an understanding of Dispensation Theology.

its not in the bible so its really not relevant. case and point, a contradiction exists in the bible, so your using outside theology to resolve it. People use outside ethics and morals to resolve that witch killing is in fact wrong.

 

[AV1611VET]

I think it would be just keen to leave it at that, esp if you would also quit slandering the innocent by claiming that we'd be out burning people. Or that I am trying to "incite" you or anyone else to do anything.

Then tell me point blank --- that if you (not ye) --- were in control of this planet, and you ran it in respect to the Bible --- you would not hang witches.

Better yet, please tell me that using the Salem Witch Trials as an example of obedience to the Word of God is making the mistake of interpreting It incorrectly, and thus has nothing to do with Christian principles.

 

[PreachersWife2004]

Hey, read the mod-hat. This thread isn't about witches. Got it?

 

[MoonLancer]

to the op. many Christians have to look down at education because fundamentalists are loosing their foot holds on reality. They see intellectual reason as the antithesis of what they believe, which is based on faith rather then fact.

 

[mpok1519]

yes; fundamentalists feel threatened by logic, truth, and rationality. This is why they are so against intellctualism.

 

[AV1611VET]

Hey, read the mod-hat. This thread isn't about witches. Got it?

Sorry.

 

[PreachersWife2004]

Sorry.

Forgiven.