Fun with the Flood math.

[Smilin]

2nd April 2003 at 12:47 PM look said this in Post #137



While I agree as to the why the sky is blue now, I believe your ignorance is betraying you on the 'energized hydrogen'. If you are right, then why does the 'horse head nebula' glow a pinkish color? To look at it, see link

How could life (as we know and define it) have existed with that much 'energized hydrogen' in the atmosphere????

 

[Frumious Bandersnatch]

 

Look:As the sun’s rays pass through them you see blue sky because of the oxygen, but during sunrise and sunset, for a short period, because of these lower level intense rays of the sun, the energized hydrogen overpowers the oxygen and you see a pink glow in the horizon.

Look:While I agree as to the why the sky is blue <B>now</B>, I believe your ignorance is betraying you on the 'energized hydrogen'. If you are right, then why does the 'horsehead nebula' glow a pinkish color? To look at it, see link &lt;http://www.noao.edu/outreach/aop/observers/horse.html&gt;

Your post clearly makes it sound like you think that the pink glow in sky at sunrise and sunset comes from energized hydrogen. Notto is right to say that this is bunk. As Notto explained the pink glow is due to differential light scattering. When the light path through the atmosphere is lengthened red light get through prefentially because light scattering is dependant on the inverse fourth power of wavelength. This is why the sunset is so beautiful when there is dust or smoke in the air. The red glow from emission of excited hydrogen atoms in nebulea is a completely different phenomonon . There are some other severve problems with your mettalic hydrogen firmament but I don't have time to address them right now. Maybe later. Meanwhile, I don't think it is wise to say that someone whose explanation is essentially correct is being betrayed by ignorance.

The Frumious Bandersnatch

 

[notto]

2nd April 2003 at 11:47 AM look said this in Post #137



While I agree as to the why the sky is blue now, I believe your ignorance is betraying you on the 'energized hydrogen'. If you are right, then why does the 'horse head nebula' glow a pinkish color? To look at it, see link

We are not talking about the horse head nebula. It is well understood why sunset has hues toward the orange and red end of the spectrum and has nothing to do with hydrogen "glowing".

Now, if you want to talk about excited atoms in the atmosphere, we can talk about the northern lights.

 

[look]

2nd April 2003 at 01:45 PM Smilin said this in Post #141 errr... wrong.. we didn't cook it..lol
First we froze it solid. Forgive me,,, but at what temperature does Hydrogen become 'crystaline' and at what temperature does it become superconductive?

Trust me, it's pretty honking cold when Hydrogen changes into it's liquid state. Plus it's even colder for it to crystallize, let alone for it to become a superconductor. Almost Absolute Zero.

First, we froze it solid, then when a spark generated,,, we didn't cook it... that much Hydrogen would have created a new asteroid belt.. (just a hunch).. I'm not gonna waste time calculating it...

How would it explode? There would not be enough Oxygen at a height of 10 to 11 miles high, to support combustion. Also, it only takes (theorectically) about a 3 to 4 inches thick canopy to come up with the conditions as described in Genesis. I wouldn't waste my time calculating it either.

But, grasping at straws still to prove the global flood (drizzle) myth?

Nope, just reporting the facts, ma'am!

How could life (as we know and define it) have existed with that much 'energized hydrogen' in the atmosphere????

As I have said above, the 'energized Hydrogen was contained in a 3" to 4" canopy, all of it 10-11 miles above the ground. In other words, it was not in the atmosphere at the time, or obviously, there would have occurred a complete cessation of life. God is not stupid. You know, in probably just a few years, science will understand all of this. If not, then they will, when Jesus returns. He is prophesied to restore the earth to it's original condition.

 

[Pete Harcoff]

2nd April 2003 at 02:37 PM look said this in Post #144

Trust me, it's pretty honking cold when Hydrogen changes into it's liquid state. Plus it's even colder for it to crystallize, let alone for it to become a superconductor. Almost Absolute Zero.

Here's a million dollar question: What is preventing the energy from the Sun and/or heat energy within the Earth's atmosphere from melting this shell of frozen hydrogen?

 

[Smilin]

2nd April 2003 at 02:37 PM look said this in Post #144


Trust me, it's pretty honking cold when Hydrogen changes into it's liquid state. Plus it's even colder for it to crystallize, let alone for it to become a superconductor. Almost Absolute Zero.

Exactly, and this facts proves your theory impossible. What would be the effects for all life on earth of a 'frozen blanket of 0 degrees Kelvin Hydrogen'

Just because such a thing is twelve miles up would offer no protection from it.

(hint: such a thing would absorp almost all energy from the sun)

How would it explode? There is oxygen present at that height. A small amount of oxygen would initiate a chain reaction producing heat. Such a chain reaction would quickly escalate into a VIOLENT (reaction). My hunch such a scenario would tear the Earth apart. But that remains to be proven.

So, first we start with a frozen Earth, and end up with chunks of asteroids. Game Over for Noah's boat.

 

[Smilin]

2nd April 2003 at 02:42 PM Pete Harcoff said this in Post #145



Here's a million dollar question: What is preventing the energy from the Sun and/or heat energy within the Earth's atmosphere from melting this shell of frozen hydrogen?

To add to this... (see previous post)

For such a thing to form in the first place, what kept the Earth from freezing solid as well?

 

[Smilin]

2nd April 2003 at 02:37 PM look said this in Post #144

If not, then they will, when Jesus returns. He is prophesied to restore the earth to it's original condition.

Return the Earth to a ball of molten lava?

 

[Arikay]

Oh no, not the "canopy of hydrogen" Theory, unfortunatly that paper is worse than some Dr Dino papers ive seen.

If its the same paper im thinking of, they energize oxygen and nitrogen till it flouresces and then say thats why the sky is blue during the day and pink at sunset.

One interesting thing, awhile ago I did an average calculation about how large a shell of canopy water would be if the water was a foot thick (that made it easier). The shell would extend over twice as far as the moon, over 500,000 miles away.

 

[PhantomLlama]

The options have now extended to:

3. Freeze the earth with a supercooled hydrogen canopy, then blast it into chunks in a massive fireball.

Frying something straight out of the freezer means it'll take a long time, so the Barbeque will have to be postponed a little. Which would have happened anyway, as the city council has denyed my application to smash Earth apart on the grounds of excessive noise pollution.

 

[Pete Harcoff]

Okay, scratch my previous million dollar question.

I did some more research into metallic hydrogen, and from everything I can gather, solid metallic hydrogen (like they created in the Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory) requires extremely high pressures to form. The issue is whether or not hydrogen can retain those properties once the pressure is released.

From everything I have researched so far, it's theorized that metallic hydrogen might retain its properties and become a superconductor in the absence of the intense pressure, but so far, I have seen no evidence that this has actually been achieved.

So, my new million dollar question is: Could a solid metallic hydrogen canopy even exist in the absence of intense pressure?

 

[Arikay]

My prediction is No, otherwise, we should be seeing signs of of this strange Solid hydrogen other places in the universe as hydrogen is one of those common things.

 

[Pete Harcoff]

2nd April 2003 at 03:37 PM Arikay said this in Post #152

My prediction is No, otherwise, we should be seeing signs of of this strange Solid hydrogen other places in the universe as hydrogen is one of those common things.

From what I read the only place metallic hydrogen occurs naturally is at the center of gas giants (like Jupiter) where there is pressure intense enough to create it.

 

[Smilin]

2nd April 2003 at 03:17 PM Pete Harcoff said this in Post #151

Okay, scratch my previous million dollar question.
So, my new million dollar question is: Could a solid metallic hydrogen canopy even exist in the absence of intense pressure?

Approaching the impossibility of such a phenomenon existing from the other end..

My new modified observation is:

If such a thing existed, not only was the Earth frozen.. but everything crushed into the crust...and with the first spark..

one big kaboom fireball!

 

[Smilin]

2nd April 2003 at 03:51 PM Pete Harcoff said this in Post #153



From what I read the only place metallic hydrogen occurs naturally is at the center of gas giants (like Jupiter) where there is pressure intense enough to create it.

Interesting you brought up Jupiter. I've seen many theories of what lies beneath that gas atmosphere... if anything.

Since that gas giant is a seemingly 'unlit sun'... what would it take to ignite it? lol... just wondering.

 

[Pete Harcoff]

One more observation: If the metallic hydrogen canopy could exist in the absense of intense pressure, then it would have to exist at relatively normal temperatures (it certainly would not be near absolute zero). Therefore, breaking it up and dropping it onto the Earth would not lower the Earth's temperature very much, if at all.

 

[Smilin]

How to make metallic Hydrogen:

Source: http://www-phys.llnl.gov/H_Div/GG/metalhydrofact.html

"Metallization of hydrogen has been the elusive Holy Grail in high- pressure physics for many years," said Bill Nellis, one of three Livermore researchers involved in the project. "This is a significant contribution to condensed matter physics because a pressure and temperature that actually produce metallization have finally been discovered."

In a paper delivered today at the American Physical Society's annual gathering in St. Louis, and published in the March 11 issue of Physical Review Letters, Livermore researchers Sam Weir, Art Mitchell, and Bill Nellis described the use of a two-stage gas gun at Livermore to create enormous shock pressure on a target containing liquid hydrogen cooled to 20 K (-420 F).

By measuring the electrical conductivity, they found that metallization occurs at pressure equivalent to 1.4 million times Earth's atmospheric pressure, nine times the initial density of hydrogen, and at a temperature of 3000 K (5000 F). Because of the high temperature, the hydrogen was a liquid. The intense pressure lasted less than a microsecond.

I stand corrected,
if metallic hydrogen was formed (by this method, the Earth would be pulverized by the pressure, then cooked by the extreme heat)

Big explosion to follow....

 

[Smilin]

I'm confused why such notions are even considered?

A basic understanding of chemistry, physics, etc. shows their impossible.

What's the true motive behind those who publish/promote such nonsense?

 

[look]

Lookit dat!!! I've got 4 people on my tail! Hehehe
[move]____________ [/move]

 

[Arikay]

Yep those four people are mad at the lack of research that goes into some of these creationist arguments