From what law did Paul set us free?

Leaf473 · Aug 4, 2023

guevaraj said:
We are not automatically forgiven by the death of Jesus; we are forgiven when we turn daily to Jesus in prayer as our High Priest to "intercede" for us to forgive our past sins in disobedience to the Eleven Commandments.

Hello brother! Good to see you again

This passage came to my mind while reading your post

Bible Gateway passage: Romans 4:11 - New Living Translation

Circumcision was a sign that Abraham already had faith and that God had already accepted him and declared him to be righteous—even before he was circumcised. So Abraham is the spiritual father of those who have faith but have not been circumcised. They are counted as righteous because of their...

www.biblegateway.com

Dahveed · Aug 5, 2023

guevaraj said:
Brother, happy Sabbath, starting this Friday, August 4, 2023, at 12:33 pm EDT! Why do we need a priest with the power of an endless life to save those who come to God through Him?

That was already addressed post-179 He became the source of eternal salvation...Heb 5:9

guevaraj said:
We are not automatically forgiven by the death of Jesus; we are forgiven when we turn daily to Jesus in prayer as our High Priest to "intercede" for us to forgive our past sins in disobedience to the Eleven Commandments. This repetitive cycle continues until we no longer sin by disobeying the Eleven Commandments.

Well then, since God’s grace has set us free from the law (of humans in Judaism), does that mean we can go on sinning (disobeying the Eleven Commandments)? Of course not (don't misunderstand God's grace in the Father putting Jesus as our High Priest)!

For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance—now that he has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant. Heb 9:15

guevaraj said:
Don’t you realize that you become the slave of whatever you choose to obey (sin or God)? Now you are free from your slavery to sin (when you obey Jesus' Eleven Commandments), and you have become slaves to righteous living (obeying the Eleven Commandments). (Romans 6:15-18 NLT

Coming to Him, the living Stone—rejected by humans but chosen by God and precious to him— 5 you also, like living stones, are being built into a spiritual house to be a holy priesthood, offering spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ. 6 For in Scripture it says:
“See, I lay a stone in Zion, a chosen and precious cornerstone, 1 Peter 2

guevaraj said:
United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and strangers, but fellow citizens with God’s people and also members of his household, 20 built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone. Eph 2

Gary K · Aug 5, 2023

Dahveed said:
That was already addressed post-179 He became the source of eternal salvation...Heb 5:9

For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance—now that he has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant. Heb 9:15

Coming to Him, the living Stone—rejected by humans but chosen by God and precious to him— 5 you also, like living stones, are being built into a spiritual house to be a holy priesthood, offering spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ. 6 For in Scripture it says:
“See, I lay a stone in Zion, a chosen and precious cornerstone, 1 Peter 2

Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and strangers, but fellow citizens with God’s people and also members of his household, 20 built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone. Eph 2

Dahveed,

How can you answer like that? The clue is in Romans 6.

Rom 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
Rom 6:2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
Rom 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
Rom 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
Rom 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
Rom 6:7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.
Rom 6:8 Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:
Rom 6:9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.
Rom 6:10 For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
Rom 6:11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Rom 6:12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.
Rom 6:13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
Rom 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
Slaves to Righteousness
Rom 6:15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
Rom 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
Rom 6:17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.
Rom 6:18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.
Rom 6:19 I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness.
Rom 6:20 For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness.
Rom 6:21 What fruit had ye then in those things whereof ye are now ashamed? for the end of those things is death.
Rom 6:22 But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.
Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Dahveed · Aug 5, 2023

Dahveed said:
That was already addressed post-179 He became the source of eternal salvation...Heb 5:9

For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance—now that he has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant. Heb 9:15

Coming to Him, the living Stone—rejected by humans but chosen by God and precious to him— 5 you also, like living stones, are being built into a spiritual house to be a holy priesthood, offering spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ. 6 For in Scripture it says:
“See, I lay a stone in Zion, a chosen and precious cornerstone, 1 Peter 2

Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and strangers, but fellow citizens with God’s people and also members of his household, 20 built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone. Eph 2

Gary K said:
Dahveed,

How can you answer like that? The clue is in Romans 6.

The clue is that you have an evil heart of unbelief and you can stop pretending that you're justified by faith.

Marvel and perish!
For I work a work in your days, A work which you will by no means believe; Acts 13:39-41

Gary K · Aug 5, 2023

Dahveed said:
Dahveed said:
That was already addressed post-179 He became the source of eternal salvation...Heb 5:9

For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance—now that he has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant. Heb 9:15

Coming to Him, the living Stone—rejected by humans but chosen by God and precious to him— 5 you also, like living stones, are being built into a spiritual house to be a holy priesthood, offering spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ. 6 For in Scripture it says:
“See, I lay a stone in Zion, a chosen and precious cornerstone, 1 Peter 2

Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and strangers, but fellow citizens with God’s people and also members of his household, 20 built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone. Eph 2

The clue is that you have an evil heart of unbelief and you can stop pretending that you're justified by faith.

Marvel and perish!
For I work a work in your days, A work which you will by no means believe; Acts 13:39-41

So I can quote you an entire chapter of Romans and you claim what I bolded in it is because I have an evil heart of unbelief? Just how did I take an entire chapter out of context?

Dahveed · Aug 6, 2023

Gary K said:
So I can quote you an entire chapter of Romans and you claim what I bolded in it is because I have an evil heart of unbelief? Just how did I take an entire chapter out of context?

And what makes you think that whatever you quote nullifies God's grace?

Through Him we have received grace to promote the faith. Rom 1:4-6

Gary K · Aug 6, 2023

Dahveed said:
And what makes you think that whatever you quote nullifies God's grace?

Through Him we have received grace to promote the faith. Rom 1:4-6

I don't think that. God's word nullifies what you said. I'm nothing in such a thing. I just pointed out what the Bible says.

Dahveed · Aug 6, 2023

Dahveed said:
And what makes you think that whatever you quote nullifies God's grace?

Through Him we have received grace to promote the faith. Rom 1:4-6

Gary K said:
I don't think that. God's word nullifies what you said.

You are entitled to your opinion.

Gary K said:
I'm nothing in such a thing.

God’s Sovereign Choice
The Messiah is Lord over all, forever praised! Amen. It is not as though God’s word failed. Rom 9:5-6

You know the word God sent Israel, declaring the good news of peace through Jesus Christ, who is Lord of all. Acts 10:36

Gary K said:
I just pointed out what the Bible says.

But whoever does not believe will be condemned. Mark 16:16
For what does a believer have in common with an unbeliever?

Gary K · Aug 6, 2023

Dahveed said:
You are entitled to your opinion.

God’s Sovereign Choice
The Messiah is Lord over all, forever praised! Amen.
It is not as though God’s word failed. Rom 9:5-6

You know the word God sent declaring the good news of peace through Jesus Christ, who is Lord of all. Acts 10:36
For what does a believer have in common with an unbeliever?

I don't understand your position. Scripture means nothing means nothing when it contradicts you?

NewLifeInChristJesus · Aug 6, 2023

Gary K said:
So I can quote you an entire chapter of Romans and you claim what I bolded in it is because I have an evil heart of unbelief? Just how did I take an entire chapter out of context?

Let's inspect some of what you quoted from Romans 6 and see if your interpretation is solid. For starters, please explain this one thing:

For sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under law but under grace. (Ro 6:14)

The phrase, "for you are not under law but under grace" is easy to understand. You/we are under grace, not under law. These two are opposite one another. Furthermore, the fact that we are under grace and not under law is the explanation for why "sin shall not have dominion" over you/us. We know it is the explanation because of the word, γάρ (which means, "because"), which occurs after the comma in verse 14. Sin shall not have dominion over you BECAUSE you are not under law but under grace.

The question for you is this: How does being under grace and not under law prevent sin from having dominion over you/us?

Dahveed · Aug 6, 2023

Dahveed said:
You are entitled to your opinion.
God’s Sovereign Choice
The Messiah is Lord over all, forever praised! Amen. It is not as though God’s word failed. Rom 9:5-6
You know the word God sent Israel, declaring the good news of peace through Jesus Christ, who is Lord of all. Acts 10:36
But whoever does not believe will be condemned. Mark 16:16
For what does a believer have in common with an unbeliever?

Gary K said:
I don't understand your position.

As previously posted, Marvel and perish post-244

Gary K said:
Scripture means nothing means nothing when it contradicts you?

They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved.

Gary K · Aug 6, 2023

B Griffin said:
Let's inspect some of what you quoted from Romans 6 and see if your interpretation is solid. For starters, please explain this one thing:

For sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under law but under grace. (Ro 6:14)

The phrase, "for you are not under law but under grace" is easy to understand. You/we are under grace, not under law. These two are opposite one another. Furthermore, the fact that we are under grace and not under law is the explanation for why "sin shall not have dominion" over you/us. We know it is the explanation because of the word, γάρ (which means, "because"), which occurs after the comma in verse 14. Sin shall not have dominion over you BECAUSE you are not under law but under grace.

The question for you is this: How does being under grace and not under law prevent sin from having dominion over you/us?

Do you understand dominion. It means rulership or control. How does just being forgiven nullify being controlled by sin? It doesn't. A person who sins daily is controlled by sin. not righteousness for being controlled by righteousness means we will be living a holy life.

Gary K · Aug 6, 2023

Dahveed said:
As previously posted, Marvel and perish.

They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved.

Yeah? How does that nullify an entire chapter of Romans? Does the Bible argue with itself? The only way it doesn't is when HS finds for us a way to make the apparent contradictions agree.

NewLifeInChristJesus · Aug 6, 2023

Gary K said:
Do you understand dominion. It means rulership or control. How does just being forgiven nullify being controlled by sin? It doesn't. A person who sins daily is controlled by sin. not righteousness for being controlled by righteousness means we will be living a holy life.

So you don't know the answer. You bolded it as if it fits into your theology, but now you admit you don't know what it means.

Dahveed · Aug 6, 2023

Dahveed said:
You are entitled to your opinion.
God’s Sovereign Choice
The Messiah is Lord over all, forever praised! Amen. It is not as though God’s word failed. Rom 9:5-6
You know the word God sent Israel, declaring the good news of peace through Jesus Christ, who is Lord of all. Acts 10:36

But whoever does not believe will be condemned. Mark 16:16 For what does a believer have in common with an unbeliever?
They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved.

Gary K said:
Yeah? How does that nullify an entire chapter of Romans?

It certainly doesn't nullify Chpt 6
For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Gary K said:
Does the Bible argue with itself?

I'll concede that to the unregenerate it's all in parables.

Gary K said:
The only way it doesn't is when HS finds for us a way to make the apparent contradictions agree.

To you has been entrusted the mystery of the kingdom of God but to those outside the faith, it's all in parables. Mark 4:11

Gary K said:
Do you understand dominion. It means rulership or control.

Remember, that when you were saved, you were transferred from the dominion of darkness into the kingdom of the beloved Son. Col 1:12-15

Gary K said:
How does just being forgiven nullify being controlled by sin? It doesn't.

You, however, are not in the flesh but are in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, they do not belong to Christ. Rom 8:9

Gary K said:
A person who sins daily is controlled by sin. not righteousness for being controlled by righteousness means we will be living a holy life.

So then account yourselves dead to sin but alive to God in Christ Jesus.

Awake, rise from the dead, and Christ will shine on you; Ephesians 3:14
Let Your light shine on us, that we may be saved, that we may have life PCD

Gary K · Aug 6, 2023

Dahveed said:
It certainly doesn't nullify Chpt 6
For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

I'll concede that to the unregenerate it's all in parables.

To you has been entrusted the mystery of the kingdom of God but to those outside the faith, it's all in parables. Mark 4:11

Remember, that when you were saved, you were transferred from the dominion of darkness into the kingdom of the beloved Son. Col 1:12-15

You, however, are not in the flesh but are in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, they do not belong to Christ. Rom 8:9

So then account yourselves dead to sin but alive to God in Christ Jesus.

Awake, rise from the dead, and Christ will shine on you; Ephesians 3:14
Let Your light shine on us, that we may be saved PCD

So it is impossible for a Christian to lose their salvation at some future time? We give up our status as free moral agents by accepting Jesus as our Savior?

NewLifeInChristJesus · Aug 6, 2023

Gary K said:
Do you understand dominion. It means rulership or control. How does just being forgiven nullify being controlled by sin? It doesn't. A person who sins daily is controlled by sin. not righteousness for being controlled by righteousness means we will be living a holy life.

Please answer this one question (it is ok if you just say you don't know what it means): How does being under grace and not under law prevent sin from having dominion over you/us?

Dahveed · Aug 6, 2023

Dahveed said:
It certainly doesn't nullify Chpt 6
For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
I'll concede that to the unregenerate it's all in parables.
To you has been entrusted the mystery of the kingdom of God but to those outside the faith, it's all in parables. Mark 4:11
Awake, rise from the dead, and Christ will shine on you; Ephesians 3:14
Let Your light shine on us, that we may be saved, that we may have life PCD

Gary K said:
So it is impossible for a Christian to lose their salvation at some future time? We give up our status as free moral agents by accepting Jesus as our Savior?

Surely you jest. For if you rely on free moral agents you will die.

It is the Spirit that gives life.

Gary K · Aug 6, 2023

Dahveed said:
Surely you jest. For if you rely on free moral agents you will die.

It is the Spirit that gives life.

Where have I said anything different?

Dahveed · Aug 6, 2023

Gary K said:
Where have I said anything different?

Attaboy. Romans 16:25-27
He saved us, and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus...2 Tim 1:9

From what law did Paul set us free?

From what law did Paul set us free?

the law of Judaism

the law of God

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