Yamialpha said:
It's amazing how they strive so hard to not conform that through their nonconformity they conform to a nonconformity trend.
Couldn't have said it better myself.
Infernal said:
Hmm...remember, you are generally speaking. You can't judge the whole phreaking age group by the ones you've encountered.
But I can apply a statistical result of the part to the whole unless given reason to think that there is an inconsistency in the relationship. I have been given no reason.
First off, if you actually understood my post you'd know that I was at first taking up for teenagers, so to speak. I wasn't saying anything of goths then. I was saying that not all teens are all stupid and ignorant to everything. Quite a few of us have good minds. We may dress different [or the same, or whatever] but we aren't idiots.
Well then I must ask what was the relevence? Your comment would only be relevent if I or someone has said that most or all teenagers or stupid.
BTW...yes, you are stereotyping goths...you were all but saying they go around misinterpretting Nietzsche...which is not, in its entirety, true. To many goths the conformity isn't meant to be different from one another...they're trying to be different from the preps, the punks, the jocks, the cheerleaders, the sleezbags, etc. [That's also not meant to be stereotypical. It's a way of dress.]
I never said that all or most goths go around misinterpreting Fred. I did say that many teenagers who misinterpret Nietzsche go around spouting nihilism and subscribing themselves to goth. That wasn't even supposed to be a serious statement when I made it anyway, any more than saying "If people don't start regulating their diets we'll have a bunch of fat people rolling around in wheel chairs bleeding gravy. *shudder*".
You seem to not understand who they're trying to set themselves apart from...how...and why.
Would you care to enlighten me? I'm teaming with anticipation.
Anti-Fear said:
From what I know about him I strongly disagree with him because he says that God is dead.
This is easily his most famous line, found in his work
The Gay Science, first, and later in
Also Sprach Zarathustra. It is also easily one of the most misinterpreted statements made by a philosopher EVER.
Nietzsche is not making an atheist statement, he is not saying that God doesn't exist, or God has abandoned us, or anything even close to that. He's making on observation about believers and their attitude toward God and religion. He's saying that people have lost their belief in cosmic order, in absolute values. People are turning to God less and less in their lives, they are consulting and leaning on these morals less and less. Nietzsche saw this as a pathway to Nihilism, as specifically Christian principles are abandoned and way is given to moral relativism.
This is where most people stop understanding Nietzsche. They often believe that he is saying "Down with God, let's all forget morality and party". However, Nietzsche did not advocate or believe this. He saw the death of God and moral structure to be a tragedy. He sought to remedy the situation by reconstructing a moral foundation that was not based simply in tradition as the Christian values were, but that was based more fundamentally in human nature.
"God is dead. God remains dead. And we have killed him. How shall we, murderers of all murderers, console ourselves? That which was the holiest and mightiest of all that the world has yet possessed has bled to death under our knives. Who will wipe this blood off us? With what water could we purify ourselves? What festivals of atonement, what sacred games shall we need to invent? Is not the greatness of this deed too great for us? Must we not ourselves become gods simply to be worthy of it?" -
Nietzsche,
Also sprach Zarathustra
It's of note that Nietzsche didn't actually turn this phrase. In both accounts the phrase comes from the mouth of one of the characters in his works. Nietzsche is foreshadowing the demise of morality as people abandon moral principles and succumb to nihilism and moral relativism. He is not a nihilist. Nietzsche is not a moral relativist either.
It should be noted that my understanding of one of the most difficult to understand philosophers is naturally not fullproof. I very well may stand corrected in light of refutations from one who is more knowledgable on the man and his philosophy that I am. That being said though, in my experience I have found there to be a large consensus among the well informed readers of Nietzsche that at least the general points of the above post are accurate.
