Fornication - Is It Still A Sin, TODAY?

Fornication - Choose Up to 3 Statements That Describe Your Thoughts

  • Nothing wrong with sleeping with someone before marriage

  • It is a sin to sleep with someone before marriage

  • The Bible is old fashioned and does not apply to today

  • The Bible applies today as much as it did the day it was written

  • Christians should encourage abstinence

  • Abstinence is old-fashioned and not possible


Results are only viewable after voting.

Tammy

Junior Member
Dec 26, 2009
463
95
Kingsville, OH
Visit site
✟8,730.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
So... ever thought that maybe... just maybe... what God says in the Bible may be conditional according to context? That maybe... just MAYbe... what is sin for a group of semi-nomadic pastoralist patriarchists with a cultural bloodline fixation, might not be sin for post industrialist, post contraception universal suffragists? Because wwhat is demonstrably a bad thing in one context is not at all bad in the other?

Rather than turning off your brain after "the Bible says" perhaps try to think about WHY the Bible says what it says?

I'm glad I'm not where you are in your thinking...you have no foundation....your mind will find an excuse to commit any sin it takes a fancy to.

1Corinthians 3:19 For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness.​
 
Upvote 0

Armoured

So is America great again yet?
Site Supporter
Aug 31, 2013
34,358
14,061
✟234,967.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
I'm glad I'm not where you are in your thinking...you have no foundation....your mind will find an excuse to commit any sin it takes a fancy to.

1Corinthians 3:19 For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness.​

So you're happy with "the Bible says" as the end point of your intellectual process.
 
Upvote 0

Skybringr

Well-Known Member
Apr 18, 2014
876
43
✟1,363.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Single
I voted for 'Christians should encourage abstinence'.

A good parent does not like the idea of their kids having sex, because they are protective over them. This is most potent among fathers and their daughters, as young girls are more often subject to abuse.

If a quality of a good parent is this, shouldn't it be said the same to God, whom we are all children of?

Premarital sex does not do any justice to society, and it's cons far outweigh any justification for it. For it's fun and vanity, what comes from it is social hostility, diseases, unplanned pregnancy, and so on.

This makes it, by sheer definition, sinful. Anything that is not a sin cannot ultimately harm mankind, the very notion of 'sin' is that it disrupts Godliness. Premarital sex has been shown through all history to cause only harm.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

grasping the after wind

That's grasping after the wind
Jan 18, 2010
19,458
6,354
Clarence Center NY USA
✟237,637.00
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Matt 5:28
I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart
1John 1:8
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
Romans 3:23-24
for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus.

I find it wearisome that so many seek to justify themselves by finding complicated arguments to attempt to prove that what they do is not sin. Are such people distrustful of God's promises? Do they think God would renege on His promises but be swayed by their rationalizations? Are they more interested in finding loopholes than in keeping the spirit of the law? As Jesus points out in the quote above, the standard for the keeping the law is higher than the OT's standard suggests rather than less stringent. We sin whenever we do a selfish thing. Fornication, no matter how broadly one cares to define it, is a sin because it is an act based upon self gratification rather than on selfless love. The good news is that God still loves you and will forgive you even if you sin. The bad news is if you insist that your sin is not sin you aren't asking for forgiveness.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Tammy
Upvote 0

Messy

Well-Known Member
Jan 30, 2011
10,027
2,082
Holland
✟21,082.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Premarital sex has been shown through all history to cause only harm.

Yes. Oh we're gonna marry anyway, the Torah says it's okay. Oh yeah, that makes sense, okay then. Oh sorry, I don't want to marry after all. It was sex outside of marriage.
Paul said this:
Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body.
And then:
Nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband.
And no, someone is not your husband or wife when you're not married, although Jacob married this way. Jesus was at a wedding. A lawful wife is what he's talking about.
 
Upvote 0

Messy

Well-Known Member
Jan 30, 2011
10,027
2,082
Holland
✟21,082.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
1968 Prophecy by 90 Year Old Woman in Norway
"There will be a moral disintegration that old Norway has never experienced the likes of. People will live together like married without being married. (I do not believe the concept ‘co-habitor’? existed in 1968 - E. Minos.) Much uncleanness before marriage, and much infidelity in marriage will become the natural (the common), and it will be justified from every angle. It will even enter Christian circles and we pet it - even sin against nature.
 
Upvote 0
T

ToBeBlessed

Guest
The only 'argument' for looser standards of sexual purity is that of 'cultural pressure'. Just for the tally book, I do NOT agree with this argument.

The Bible and the message of God has not changed. Only 'popular opinion'. In my experience, God is far more pleased with serving His will than with chasing popular opinion.

:thumbsup:
 
Upvote 0
T

ToBeBlessed

Guest
I'm really disappointed in a lot of these responses...as to whether or not fornication is sin. I looked up the word "fornication" in the Bible and it is used 32 times. There are two types of fornication - spiritual or physical - BUT BOTH are sin, according to the Bible. I don't need to understand anything about GNOSTIC influences to understand that fornication was a sin and is still a sin today. If you don't believe fornication is a sin, then you really should stop calling yourself a Christian, because when you call yourself a Christian, you are stating you believe the Bible - God's Word - to be true.

2Ch_21:11 Moreover he made high places in the mountains of Judah, and caused the inhabitants of Jerusalem to commit fornication, and compelled Judah thereto.
Isa_23:17 And it shall come to pass after the end of seventy years, that the LORD will visit Tyre, and she shall turn to her hire, and shall commit fornication with all the kingdoms of the world upon the face of the earth.
Eze_16:26 Thou hast also committed fornication with the Egyptians thy neighbours, great of flesh; and hast increased thy whoredoms, to provoke me to anger.
Eze_16:29 Thou hast moreover multiplied thy fornication in the land of Canaan unto Chaldea; and yet thou wast not satisfied herewith.
Mat_5:32 But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.
Mat_19:9 And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.
Joh_8:41 Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to him, We be not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God.
Act_15:20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.
Act_15:29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.
Act_21:25 As touching the Gentiles which believe, we have written and concluded that they observe no such thing, save only that they keep themselves from things offered to idols, and from blood, and from strangled, and from fornication.
Rom_1:29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
1Co_5:1 It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife.
1Co_6:13 Meats for the belly, and the belly for meats: but God shall destroy both it and them. Now the body is not for fornication, but for the Lord; and the Lord for the body.
1Co_6:18 Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body.
1Co_7:2 Nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband.
1Co_10:8 Neither let us commit fornication, as some of them committed, and fell in one day three and twenty thousand.
2Co_12:21 And lest, when I come again, my God will humble me among you, and that I shall bewail many which have sinned already, and have not repented of the uncleanness and fornication and lasciviousness which they have committed.
Gal_5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
Eph_5:3 But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints;
Col_3:5 Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry:
1Th_4:3 For this is the will of God, even your sanctification, that ye should abstain from fornication:
Jud_1:7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.
Rev_2:14 But I have a few things against thee, because thou hast there them that hold the doctrine of Balaam, who taught Balac to cast a stumblingblock before the children of Israel, to eat things sacrificed unto idols, and to commit fornication.
Rev_2:20 Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols.
Rev_2:21 And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not.
Rev_9:21 Neither repented they of their murders, nor of their sorceries, nor of their fornication, nor of their thefts.
Rev_14:8 And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication.
Rev_17:2 With whom the kings of the earth have committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her fornication.
Rev_17:4 And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:
Rev_18:3 For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies.
Rev_18:9 And the kings of the earth, who have committed fornication and lived deliciously with her, shall bewail her, and lament for her, when they shall see the smoke of her burning,
Rev_19:2 For true and righteous are his judgments: for he hath judged the great harlot, which did corrupt the earth with her fornication, and hath avenged the blood of his servants at her hand.


As Christians, we need to stop trying to lower the standard of righteousness into the gutter, and raise the banner high above this world filled with sin.

:thumbsup:
 
Upvote 0
T

ToBeBlessed

Guest
Originally Posted by Tammy I'm glad I'm not where you are in your thinking...you have no foundation....your mind will find an excuse to commit any sin it takes a fancy to.

1Corinthians 3:19 For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness.​

So you're happy with "the Bible says" as the end point of your intellectual process.

I'm sure she (Tammy) is happy with what "the Bible says" and so am I.

There are quite a few Christians who believe the Bible is the Word of God.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Tammy
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

dayhiker

Mature veteran
Sep 13, 2006
15,557
5,288
MA
✟220,077.00
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
In Relationship
Politics
US-Others
I'm also quite happy with what the Bible says when it was written. It was interesting that fornication meant prostitution when when the KJV was written. Its been since the Elizabethan age that the definition of fornication was changed to premarital sex.
So I've not found anywhere that the Bible says per-marital sex is a sin.
 
Upvote 0

RDKirk

Alien, Pilgrim, and Sojourner
Site Supporter
Mar 3, 2013
39,253
20,260
US
✟1,450,592.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
In ancient times people were married by about 14-16 years old...todays sociological practices extend the adolescence to about 25 or 30...we have caused this particular sin to escalate far far beyond what could have been conceived of 2000 years ago....this is a sin about 90% of all Christians commit (I was guilty of this before I got saved so I am not judging)

Those aren't "sociological pressures," those are "economic desires." The sole reason we expect young people to remain celibate for 10 to 20 years after sexual maturity is mo' money, mo' money, mo' money.

We as Christians have gone along with the anti-Christian idea that young people should abstain from marriage until they are financially independent, and given lip service to abstention from sex.

We Christians have disrespected marriage since WWII, and by our own actions we have made marriage less desirable for our own children.

The fact is, even in the 1st century, newlyweds were not self-sufficient as young couples. They continued to live in the homes of their parents, continued to work for parents, continued to be a part of whatever business or estate the parents had.

That didn't really change as a cultural expectation even in the US until the latter half of the 20th century. There is no reason why Christians should not reject it.
 
Upvote 0
D

DiligentlySeekingGod

Guest
Originally Posted by Tammy I'm glad I'm not where you are in your thinking...you have no foundation....your mind will find an excuse to commit any sin it takes a fancy to.

1Corinthians 3:19 For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness.​

I'm sure she (Tammy) is happy with what "the Bible says" and so am I.

There are quite a few Christians who believe the Bible is the Word of God.

I will also stand with you and Tammy, proclaiming the ABSOLUTE truth of God's Word.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Tammy
Upvote 0

grasping the after wind

That's grasping after the wind
Jan 18, 2010
19,458
6,354
Clarence Center NY USA
✟237,637.00
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
I'm also quite happy with what the Bible says when it was written. It was interesting that fornication meant prostitution when when the KJV was written. Its been since the Elizabethan age that the definition of fornication was changed to premarital sex.
So I've not found anywhere that the Bible says per-marital sex is a sin.


The Bible was not written in the Elizabethan age. If your looking for a statement that says "X (premarital sex , pediphilia, inappropriate contentography, etc.) is a sin" before you will accept that an act of pure self gratification is a sin, then you are looking for a loophole in the command to love God and love your neighbor as yourself. The OT contains 613 various rules that the Pharisees kept and considered themselves holy because they kept them to the letter of the law(including finding any loopholes they could). Jesus called those Pharissees hypocrites and said about them the following
Matthew 5:20
"For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven."
He summed up the law in one sentence
Luke 10:27
"Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbor as thyself."
and removed the possibility of loopholes in so doing.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Tammy
Upvote 0

RDKirk

Alien, Pilgrim, and Sojourner
Site Supporter
Mar 3, 2013
39,253
20,260
US
✟1,450,592.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
The Bible was not written in the Elizabethan age. If your looking for a statement that says "X (premarital sex , pediphilia, inappropriate contentography, etc.) is a sin" before you will accept that an act of pure self gratification is a sin, then you are looking for a loophole in the command to love God and love your neighbor as yourself. The OT contains 613 various rules that the Pharisees kept and considered themselves holy because they kept them to the letter of the law(including finding any loopholes they could). Jesus called those Pharissees hypocrites and said about them the following
Matthew 5:20
"For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven."
He summed up the law in one sentence
Luke 10:27
"Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbor as thyself."
and removed the possibility of loopholes in so doing.

Yes.

"Everything is permissible to me."

Establishes first that our intent is not to be Pharisaic in depending on written code for a "bright line" defining "righteous" and "unrighteous" for every possible situation.

Righteousness is not found in declaring a rule about how far can you walk on the Sabbath before it becomes "work."

"But not everything is beneficial."

What we're seeking is the "beneficial." How can we live in such a way that our actions provide continual benefit to ourselves as Christians, to others who are Christians, and to the mission of the Church to spread the gospel of Jesus?

"Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbor as thyself."

That's not looking for lower boundaries of righteousness. The one-talent steward was only interested in "not doing the wrong thing," but he failed in doing the beneficial thing. He didn't even try.

Casual sex between unmarried people...the question is not "is it a sin?" the question is: Does it provide benefit to ourselves as Christians, to others who are Christians, and to the mission of the Church to spread the gospel of Jesus?
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

grasping the after wind

That's grasping after the wind
Jan 18, 2010
19,458
6,354
Clarence Center NY USA
✟237,637.00
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Yes.

"Everything is permissible to me."

Establishes first that our intent is not to be Pharisaic in depending on written code for a "bright line" defining "righteous" and "unrighteous" for every possible situation.

Righteousness is not found in declaring a rule about how far can you walk on the Sabbath before it becomes "work."

"But not everything is beneficial."

What we're seeking is the "beneficial." How can we live in such a way that our actions provide continual benefit to ourselves as Christians, to others who are Christians, and to the mission of the Church to spread the gospel of Jesus?

"Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbor as thyself."

That's not looking for lower boundaries of righteousness. The one-talent steward was only interested in "not doing the wrong thing," but he failed in doing the beneficial thing. He didn't even try.

Casual sex between unmarried people...the question is not "is it a sin?" the question is: Does it provide benefit to ourselves as Christians, to others who are Christians, and to the mission of the Church to spread the gospel of Jesus?

Luke 18:10-14
Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector.The Pharisee stood by himself and prayed: 'God, I thank you that I am not like other people--robbers, evildoers, adulterers--or even like this tax collector.http://biblehub.com/luke/18-12.htm I fast twice a week and give a tenth of all I get.'
"But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, 'God, have mercy on me, a sinner.'
"I tell you that this man, rather than the other, went home justified before God. For all those who exalt themselves will be humbled, and those who humble themselves will be exalted."
 
Upvote 0

dayhiker

Mature veteran
Sep 13, 2006
15,557
5,288
MA
✟220,077.00
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
In Relationship
Politics
US-Others
I'm well aware that the Bible wasn't written in the Elizabethan age. That's what I don't follow the redefining of the meaning of fornication from that time like most do.

Also an amen to the righteousness verses. 1 Cor.1:30

The Bible was not written in the Elizabethan age. If your looking for a statement that says "X (premarital sex , pediphilia, inappropriate contentography, etc.) is a sin" before you will accept that an act of pure self gratification is a sin, then you are looking for a loophole in the command to love God and love your neighbor as yourself. The OT contains 613 various rules that the Pharisees kept and considered themselves holy because they kept them to the letter of the law(including finding any loopholes they could). Jesus called those Pharissees hypocrites and said about them the following
Matthew 5:20
"For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven."
He summed up the law in one sentence
Luke 10:27
"Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbor as thyself."
and removed the possibility of loopholes in so doing.
 
Upvote 0
D

DiligentlySeekingGod

Guest
I Corinthians 6:9-11 "9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, 10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God."

I Corinthians 6:18-20 "18 Flee sexual immorality. Every sin that a man does is outside the body, but he who commits sexual immorality sins against his own body. 19 Or do you not know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and you are not your own? 20 For you were bought at a price; therefore glorify God in your body and in your spirit, which are God’s."
 
Upvote 0

Nani-Day

Lambda 11
Dec 8, 2013
881
120
New York
✟1,600.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
1968 Prophecy by 90 Year Old Woman in Norway
"There will be a moral disintegration that old Norway has never experienced the likes of. People will live together like married without being married. (I do not believe the concept ‘co-habitor’? existed in 1968 - E. Minos.) Much uncleanness before marriage, and much infidelity in marriage will become the natural (the common), and it will be justified from every angle. It will even enter Christian circles and we pet it - even sin against nature.

Wow that is spot on. Anyway from what I know and have read it is most certainly a sin, and Should not be condoned by any Christian. It will not be condoned by the Father or any true Christian.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Skybringr

Well-Known Member
Apr 18, 2014
876
43
✟1,363.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Single
People will live together like married without being married.
It wasn't too long ago, relatively speaking, that an unmarried man and woman couldn't live together. By law.

So it can't really be said that the headline hasn't always read that pre-marital sex is not okay. In fact, all the way back to ancient Judaism, marriage is initially where the virginity of a woman is supposed to be lost, not before.

In Elizabethian times, this obviously was still very much binding, and the argument that 'fornication' meant only prostitution is basically wrong.
 
Upvote 0