Forgiveness?

[pc_76]

I know if you are Christian, you are told that you need to forgive others, even your most brutal enemies. I wonder if some of the people in Hitler and Stalin's death camps thought differently. Jesus Christ was crucified and tortured on the cross (even though in its context it was part of God's fulfillment).

I could forgive someone rationally in my mind, but my heart still thinks that the most evil and vile deserve their justice and be accountable, even from others besides just God. I already can't forgive certain people in high places now, I can't imagine doing it if I was in the same situation as those historical examples above.

 

[sandman]

I don't think the forgiveness is for them....It's for you.
Most all of those you forgive could probably care less or are even aware of your resentment, anger, and hatred....
But that baggage will eat at you like a cancer

 

[Brihaha]

Forgiveness is difficult for humans. Even those not in a prison camp. We can learn to forgive much easier once we learn enough faith to let God take care of others' punishment. I still feel an urge for revenge or vengeance upon those who have done me wrong occasionally. But with God's help I have learned to forgive without this urge more often than not. Forgiveness is the key to our salvation in more than one way.

 

[RileyG]

Forgiveness is a choice. Having feelings is not.

 

[RileyG]

I don't think the forgiveness is for them....It's for you.
Most all of those you forgive could probably care less or are even aware of your resentment, anger, and hatred....
But that baggage will eat at you like a cancer

Amen

 

[Jonaitis]

I know if you are Christian, you are told that you need to forgive others, even your most brutal enemies. I wonder if some of the people in Hitler and Stalin's death camps thought differently. Jesus Christ was crucified and tortured on the cross (even though in its context it was part of God's fulfillment).

I could forgive someone rationally in my mind, but my heart still thinks that the most evil and vile deserve their justice and be accountable, even from others besides just God. I already can't forgive certain people in high places now, I can't imagine doing it if I was in the same situation as those historical examples above.

I don't know, but if I was given the opportunity to witness all the circumstances that lead up to the actions of everyone at every point in time, I think I would understand why it happened, and I would no longer desire vengeance. It is like disliking the antagonist in a movie until toward the end when he/she is about to die and you get a glimpse of their backstory, you no longer feel angry toward them. You understand them and all those negative feelings subside. You now feel conflicted and want a happy ending for everyone, not just the hero. I believe God will do that for everyone after they die. They will immediately understand everything and why it happened, and those unfortunate events that they thought wronged them will no longer matter to them. They can move on without regret or with unfulfilled revenge.

 

[Sophrosyne]

Forgiving people of their sins against you takes away the power those sins can have on your life. People often sin against others to control them and the spirits behind some sins/sinners actions want people to be permanently damaged by the action and suffer unable to get past it. We forgive because God forgives us. Forgiving others doesn't mean we have to forget what they did or treat them like some loved family member. People who do evil things we cannot trust them to not do more evil things and must protect ourselves and others from them.
Those who dwell on sin, will be a victim till they stop doing so.

 

[Desk trauma]

I believe God will do that for everyone after they die. They will immediately understand everything and why it happened, and those unfortunate events that they thought wronged them will no longer matter to them. They can move on without regret or with unfulfilled revenge.

Wait, those who suffered and died in the gulag or nazi death camps only think they have been wronged and in actuality we’re not wronged?

 

[Jonaitis]

Wait, those who suffered and died in the gulag or nazi death camps only think they have been wronged and in actuality we’re not wronged?

A controversial question, so I refrain from answering.

 

[Desk trauma]

A controversial question, so I refrain from answering.

Imply and deny, the ever ready standby.

 

[Jonaitis]

Imply and deny, the ever ready standby.

It has nothing to do with denying, but everything to do with it being controversial. If you want my answer, you can PM me.

 

[Tinker Grey]

It has nothing to do with denying, but everything to do with it being controversial. If you want my answer, you can PM me.

You mean you don't want to admit in public that you think all those who died in concentration camps are now roasting in Hell?

 

[Desk trauma]

It has nothing to do with denying, but everything to do with it being controversial. If you want my answer, you can PM me.

I don’t use PMs.

 

[Jonaitis]

You mean you don't want to admit in public that you think all those who died in concentration camps are now roasting in Hell?

Sure.

 

[Jonaitis]

I don’t use PMs.

You can always start.

 

[Desk trauma]

You can always start.

No.

 

[Blade]

I know if you are Christian, you are told that you need to forgive others, even your most brutal enemies. I wonder if some of the people in Hitler and Stalin's death camps thought differently. Jesus Christ was crucified and tortured on the cross (even though in its context it was part of God's fulfillment).

I could forgive someone rationally in my mind, but my heart still thinks that the most evil and vile deserve their justice and be accountable, even from others besides just God. I already can't forgive certain people in high places now, I can't imagine doing it if I was in the same situation as those historical examples above.

Take Jesus out of this.. were all the same. There is no one is more evil then the other. Our good works (righteousness) means nothing to God. The most evil as you say are the ones He came for.. those are the ones He loves just exactly as He loves you and me. No matter how we here see sin, no sin will enter heaven. No sin is ok to God. Its not ok to kill/do harm no more then is ok to lie.

So fact Christ already forgave them. For God so loved the world He gave His only son. Christ came in the flesh died rose AMEN AMEN AMEN and is at the right hand of the Father. Where we won't go those we don't care about those we give up on toss under the buss ignore... He is with them. What has not changed is the laborers are few. So Christ change me first. Hear I am .. I will go.. take all I have for you ..your all that matters.

 

[Tolworth John]

I know if you are Christian, you are told that you need to forgive others, even your most brutal enemies.

Please look at how God and Jesus forgave those who hated them.
You are the example. You were not forgiven by God untill you repented.
God was willing and ready to forgive, but you were not actually forgiven until as the bible says, you repented.

Look at the OT, the promise of blessings and of curses at sini. When Israel departed from Gods law, there were consequences which would last untill they turned back to God, untill they repented.

If someone sins against you, we are supposed to tell them, if they repent we are to forgive them.
However if they do not repent, or we cannot talk to them, then like Jesus on the cross. We hand the situation over to God.
Note Jesus prayed, " Father, forgive them." He did not pray ' I forgive them.'
We do the same, telling God of our hurt, our feelings about the incident and the people involved.
Then we do what those who reject this teaching don't like.
We pray regularly and intelligently for the good of those people.

 

[pc_76]

Forgiveness is difficult for humans. Even those not in a prison camp. We can learn to forgive much easier once we learn enough faith to let God take care of others' punishment. I still feel an urge for revenge or vengeance upon those who have done me wrong occasionally. But with God's help I have learned to forgive without this urge more often than not. Forgiveness is the key to our salvation in more than one way.

I don't believe in some kind of vengeance or revenge if it is a minor spat or just words, but I believe if the whole system of something is being cruel to them without mercy, if innocent people have are destroyed physically or psychologically, it would never end until the end, so yes, I believe that somebody has to make them suffer the effects of their own action and laws if given the opportunity.

 

[John Owen]

Sometimes it is hard. But we are told to do it, and ask God for help to do it when we cannot.