Flight 93 Never Crashed In The Empty Shanksville Field

[jamesrwright3]

Wow this dude is on serious drugs
He is trying to compare crashes where the pilot ACTUALLY TRIED TO LAND THE PLANE to Flight 93 where the Pilot INTENTIONALLY crashed the plane into the ground at a steep angle and at a high speed.

 

[jamesrwright3]

http://www.flight93crash.com/flight93_eyewitness.html

Crash Witnesses Accounts:

"I heard like a boom and the engine sounded funny," she told the Daily News. "I heard two more booms - and then I did not hear anything."

What does Temyer think she heard? "I think the plane was shot down,"
http://dailynews.philly.com/content/daily_news/2001/11/18/local/SHOT15C.htm


"It came in low over the trees and started wobbling," said Tim Thornsberg, a resident of Somerset County, who was working near an old strip mine when he saw the plane.

"Then it just rolled over and was flying upside down for a few seconds ... and then it kind of stalled and did a nose dive over the trees. It was just unreal to see something like that."
http://www.pittsburgh.com/partners/wpxi/news/flightheroes.html

Eric Peterson, 28, was working in his shop in the Somerset County village of Lambertsville yesterday morning when he heard a plane, looked up and saw one fly over unusually low.

The plane continued on beyond a nearby hill, then dropped out of sight behind a tree line. As it did so, Peterson said it seemed to be turning end-over-end.

Then Peterson said he saw a fireball, heard an explosion and saw a mushroom cloud of smoke rise into the sky.
http://www.post-gazette.com/headlines/20010912crashnat2p2.asp

“I saw the plane flying upside down overhead and crash into the nearby trees. My buddy, Doug, and I grabbed our fire extinguishers and ran to the scene,” said Blair.
http://www.dailyamerican.com/disaster.html#3


Eric Peterson of Lambertsville looked up when he heard the plane. "It was low enough, I thought you could probably count the rivets," Peterson said. "You could see more of the roof of the plane than you could the belly. It was on its side."

"There was a great explosion and you could see the flames. It was a massive, massive explosion. Flames and then smoke and then a massive, massive mushroom cloud."
http://www.cleveland.com/news/plain...tandard.xsl?/base/news/100028703529429109.xml

“Normally I wouldn’t look up, but I just heard on the news that all the planes were grounded and thought this was probably the last one I would see for a while, so I looked up,” she said. “I didn’t see the plane but I heard the plane’s engine. Then I heard a loud thump that echoed off the hills and then I heard the plane’s engine. I heard two more loud thumps and didn’t hear the plane’s engine anymore after that.”
http://www.dailyamerican.com/disaster.html#3


"We didn't hear that plane coming until it was right on top of us," she said. "Then there was a roar." She said the plane appeared to be gliding into the ground. "All at once it just stopped. There was no engine noise, nothing. Someone hollered, Oh my God!' and then there was a real loud thud."
http://www.cleveland.com/news/plain...tandard.xsl?/base/news/100028703529429109.xml


Shortly after 10 a.m., workers on farms and scrap yards in Somerset County looked up to see an airliner flying low and erratic at an estimated 450 mph.
http://www.dailyamerican.com/disaster.html#3

Bob Blair of Stoystown was driving a coal truck on state Route 30 when he saw the jet plummet "straight down." Barn windowpanes for half a mile around shattered as the jet dived into a reclaimed strip mine and exploded at 10:10 a. m.
http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2001/09/17/MN40630.DTL

A witness told WTAE-TV's Paul Van Osdol that she saw the plane overhead. It made a high-pitched, screeching sound. The plane then made a sharp, 90-degree downward turn and crashed.
http://newsandviews.tripod.com/news/091101tv2.html

Bob Blair was completing a routine drive to Shade Creek just after 10 a.m. Tuesday, when he saw a huge silver plane fly past him just above the treetops and crash into the woods along Lambertsville Road.
Blair, of Stoystown, a driver with Jim Barron Trucking of Somerset, was traveling in a coal truck along with Doug Miller of Somerset, when they saw the plane spiraling to the ground and then explode on the outskirts of Lambertsville.
“I saw the plane flying upside down overhead and crash into the nearby trees. My buddy, Doug, and I grabbed our fire extinguishers and ran to the scene,” said Blair.
http://www.dailyamerican.com/disaster.html


Another witness, Michael Merringer, said he was out on a mountain bike ride with his wife, Amy, about two miles from the crash site.


"(I) heard the engine gun two different times," he said. "(I) heard a loud bang and the windows of the houses all around rattled."
http://www.pjstar.com/news/worldtrade/g34835a.html

Larry Williams, a former state police trooper who is now a private investigator, was golfing on the 17th green at Oakbrook Golf Course about eight miles away when he heard the engines “roar real loud and shut off.”
http://www.dailyamerican.com/disaster.html#3

"We got the call about 9:58 this morning from a male passenger stating that he was locked in the bathroom of United Flight 93 traveling from Newark to San Francisco, and they were being hijacked," said Glenn Cramer, a 911 supervisor.

"We confirmed that with him several times and we asked him to repeat what he said. He was very distraught. He said he believed the plane was going down. He did hear some sort of an explosion and saw white smoke coming from the plane, but he didn't know where.

"And then we lost contact with him."
http://www.post-gazette.com/headlines/20010912crashnat2p2.asp


Meanwhile, investigators also are combing a second crime scene in nearby Indian Lake (2.5 miles from main crash site), where residents reported hearing the doomed jetliner flying over at a low altitude before "falling apart on their homes."

"People were calling in and reporting pieces of plane falling," a state trooper said. Jim Stop reported he had seen the hijacked Boeing 757 fly over him as he was fishing. He said he could see parts falling from the plane.
I lost this link.. but since the witness name is there I've left it up.

Some witnesses reported that the plane was flying upside down for a time before the crash; others said they heard up to three loud booms before the jetliner went down.
http://www.post-gazette.com/headlines/20010912crashnat2p2.asp

"There was no way anything was left," Pluta added. "There was just charred pieces of metal and a big hole. The plane didn't slide into the crash. It went straight into the ground. Wings out. Nose down."

Bits of metal were thrown against a tree line like shrapnel, said state police spokesman Trooper Thomas Spallone of Troop A in Greensburg.

"Once it hit, everything just disintegrated," he said. "There are just shreds of metal. The longest piece I saw was 2 feet long."
http://www.mypittsburghlive.com/myp...rial.dll?render=y&eetype=Article&eeid=5245814

 

[MachZer0]

Wow this dude is on serious drugs
He is trying to compare crashes where the pilot ACTUALLY TRIED TO LAND THE PLANE to Flight 93 where the Pilot INTENTIONALLY crashed the plane into the ground at a steep angle and at a high speed.

And he's using planted evidence and doctored photos to do it

 

[Morcova]

Wow this dude is on serious drugs
He is trying to compare crashes where the pilot ACTUALLY TRIED TO LAND THE PLANE to Flight 93 where the Pilot INTENTIONALLY crashed the plane into the ground at a steep angle and at a high speed.

Pretty much.

Honestly guys, I admire all of you who are taking the time to actually debate this person.. you have infinitely more patience than I do.

But you cannot convince a conspiracy theorist that they are wrong. In their eyes all of the evidence you provide is further evidence of a coverup by "THEM".

Not asking yall to stop as it's entertaining to watch, just making sure nobody expects to actually convince this person using logic and evidence.

 

[jamesrwright3]

Thanks Morcova. I am done with this guy after today
First person I have ever used the ignore button on

 

[Btodd]

This is old hat for him, believe me. He's been banned from multiple forums, both Twoofer and Government Shill. When even the Loose Change forums think you're a paranoid idiot, that's saying a LOT.

I'm still giddy, hoping I'll get arrested for being a co-conspirator for posting pics of 'planted evidence'. That made my day, and this whole debate worth it! Satan totally made me do it, too.


Btodd

 

[jamesrwright3]

a LOT.

I'm still giddy, hoping I'll get arrested for being a co-conspirator for posting pics of 'planted evidence'. That made my day, and this whole debate worth it! Satan totally made me do it, too.


Btodd

The Feds will be at your door shortly. They will land in your back yard in a black helicopter.

 

[Maren]

This is old hat for him, believe me. He's been banned from multiple forums, both Twoofer and Government Shill. When even the Loose Change forums think you're a paranoid idiot, that's saying a LOT.

I'm still giddy, hoping I'll get arrested for being a co-conspirator for posting pics of 'planted evidence'. That made my day, and this whole debate worth it! Satan totally made me do it, too.


Btodd

Which helps explain why I read this thread for the entertainment value.

 

[Archaeopteryx]

Terral, earlier you posted an unsubstantiated speculation that 'Senor Bush obviously planted it.' In the context of a government complicity theory, that speculation makes sense. But even then, however, it is pure speculation, and unless you can substantiate it with some evidence, it will remain as thus and you are not likely to persuade many. It is advisable, therefore, to avoid such speculations and to simply go with the evidence. If there is reasonable evidence to suggest that agents of the government did plant evidence at the crash site, then present it. If there is not, then speculate, but do not think that many will find it believable without substance.

In other news, I'm currently going away on a retreat and will be back Thursday afternoon EST. I will, therefore, be unable to contribute any further to these discussions until then. Remember guys to keep an open mind and continue searching for the truth, in the auspices of reason. Adios.

 

[_Zap_]

If cheap ridicule is all you have (aka nothing of substance), then I advise you don't even bother posting.

A thread about nothing of substance deserves no other response.

 

[Panzerkamfwagen]

 

[Archaeopteryx]

A thread about nothing of substance deserves no other response.

"Nothing of substance" is merely your opinion and demonstrates poor judgment. I will persist until the proper kind of inquiry into the 9/11 attacks is attained, and whatever cheap ridicule I receive on the way I will take... knowing that it is all for a good cause. As for you, if cheap ridicule is all you have to offer, then don't even bother posting. Ridicule is so easy and cheap to generate, but no reason there is behind it. So if there is no reason behind your posts, why post?

 

[_Zap_]

"Nothing of substance" is merely your opinion and demonstrates poor judgment.

Personally, I think it displays excellent judgment.

 

[kathaksung]

How about this photo

Or this one

1. It's a part picture which could be taken from anywhere.

2. The piece of fuselage is big. How couldn't we never spot it in whole scene picture?

3. The piece of fuselage is clean, more for demonstration but not from reality.

4. The background field seems clean and full of life, no trace of impact.

You could find the other similar picture all having the similar charactristic.

 

[lemmings]

Have you ever seen a bullet fired at a steel plate? The plate will receive a small dent and there will essentialy be no trace of the bullet.

In a normal plane crash, the plane is nearing the ground near it's landing speed of 100-150 mph. This is only two or three times the kinetic energy that a car crash would see so you would expect damage comparable. In this plane crash, the plane was traveling at close to 600 mph at the time of impact. 4 times the normal speed means that the total kinetic energy is 16 times greater than other pictures that you have seen.

At this speed, the impact looks more like that of a bullet than anything else. This plane impacted at the same speed at the average bullet from a handgun. Aluminum has roughly the same physical properties of strength and melting point as lead. The key difference is that the bullet is solid but a plane is engineered to have the largest possible volume, this makes a plane a lot weaker than a bullet.


The 3.2 gigajoules of kinetic energy released during this crash where mostly used making that nice hole in the ground you see and ripping the plane to shreds. You wouldn't expect much of anything to actually be recognizable at the crash site. As a result, the two crash site photos you see there are not actually from the impact site itself but hundreds of feet away from it where that landed. The vegetation here would be relatively unharmed since the fireball was elsewhere and the debris were only moving at a fraction of the speed that the plane was originally.

 

[TheNewWorldMan]

 

[KarateCowboy]

Actually Terral it did crash. I just cleaned it up really, really fast. I'm fast like that. No worries, OK?

 

[kathaksung]

Have you ever seen a bullet fired at a steel plate? The plate will receive a small dent and there will essentialy be no trace of the bullet.

In a normal plane crash, the plane is nearing the ground near it's landing speed of 100-150 mph. This is only two or three times the kinetic energy that a car crash would see so you would expect damage comparable. In this plane crash, the plane was traveling at close to 600 mph at the time of impact. 4 times the normal speed means that the total kinetic energy is 16 times greater than other pictures that you have seen.

At this speed, the impact looks more like that of a bullet than anything else. This plane impacted at the same speed at the average bullet from a handgun. Aluminum has roughly the same physical properties of strength and melting point as lead. The key difference is that the bullet is solid but a plane is engineered to have the largest possible volume, this makes a plane a lot weaker than a bullet.


The 3.2 gigajoules of kinetic energy released during this crash where mostly used making that nice hole in the ground you see and ripping the plane to shreds. You wouldn't expect much of anything to actually be recognizable at the crash site. As a result, the two crash site photos you see there are not actually from the impact site itself but hundreds of feet away from it where that landed. The vegetation here would be relatively unharmed since the fireball was elsewhere and the debris were only moving at a fraction of the speed that the plane was originally.

The wreckage doesn't seem to experience the speed you declared. They are bright and clean and rest on a planted ground. It's speed to land was likely near zero.

http://www.911myths.com/html/flight_93_5.html

http://www.911myths.com/html/flight_93_4.html

 

[lemmings]

The wreckage doesn't seem to experience the speed you declared. They are bright and clean and rest on a planted ground. It's speed to land was likely near zero.

Flight 93

Flight 93

You should re-read the last paragraph that you quoted from me.


I mentioned both of the pictures that you mentioned including as to why they are next to vegetation as well as not even smaller bits of shrapnel.

To say that the pieces are clean is absurd. The second picture (4) clearly shows extensive burn damage which would make since if an explosion blew the 'shell' off the plane.

The second picture is clean, but that is because we are looking at the outside of the plane. Any fiery explosion would have been the result of the fuel tanks which are located inside, therefore, the explosion would have come from the interior and not burn the exterior as substantially.

 

[TheNewWorldMan]

The second picture is clean, but that is because we are looking at the outside of the plane. Any fiery explosion would have been the result of the fuel tanks which are located inside, therefore, the explosion would have come from the interior and not burn the exterior as substantially.

I don't know about that...depends on where the HAARP Death Ray impacted the airplane at.