Flaw in Sabbath Keepers Argumentation

[stinsonmarri]

The flaw is against those who refuse to accept that "the Sabbath was made for man and not man for the Sabbath. Mark 2:27 I guess the Jews is the only people known as man! Secondly those who truly have the flaw and refuses to accept the ONE whom they claim to worship! YAHSHUA said that HE is the MASTER of the Sabbath. Mark 2:27 John was in the spirit on the Master's day-the Sabbath. Rev 1:10
Now YAHWEH stated clearly that from "one Sabbath to another shall all flesh come to worship before HIM." Isa 66:23 So I guess all flesh are Jews! ELOHIM said that Heavens, and then the earth all the host were complete. HE YAHWHEH finish HIS work always during a weekly cycle of time of six days and every Seventh day which means complete and perfect the MOST HIGH stop working. The word rest is not correct it should be to celebrate. There is a celebration of worship Sabbath to Sabbath as it states in Isaiah all stop and worship the MOST HIGH ELOHIM-known as the FATHER. Even Paul told the Hebrew who should have understood that YAHWEH cease from creating to worship. All those unbelievers or people who call other flaw keepers of HIS day that was spoken of when? Doing creation of course! But unbelievers, delusional ones who call others names that they will believe a lie with all these facts. Trying to make ELOHIM to be racist think that just because HE told the Hebrews they could be peculiar a royal priesthood or priest bringing people of other nations back to HIM to HIS Holy Sanctuary to do what? Worship and obey HIM. These name calling people forget that killing is in the Law and stealing, cheating on your wife, dishonoring your parents, taking YAHWEH sacred name changing it into a lie, saying Mary is a deity and she is not, worshiping stone and wood that cannot speak or moved, making people saints who are dead and have turn back to ashes, go around believing in ghost, still in Egypt like bondage, believing that their priest are holy and one is suppose to be like the MOST HIGH but he is not he dies another one takes his place until lately. Full of hate against their fellowman, those in this country hate the president because of the color of his skin, don't marry where YAHWEH made marriage a law. The problem is they want to change time (a day) so they can worship on their Sun-deity day! Now I wonder who really is the flaw keepers um! Finally stop talking about Paul and tell me what YAHWEH YAHSHUA said THEY are the ELOHIM'S.

Happy Sabbath,
stinsonmarri

 

[stenerson]

Even Paul told the Hebrew who should have understood that YAHWEH cease from creating to worship.

Huh?

 

[stenerson]

Now YAHWEH stated clearly that from "one Sabbath to another shall all flesh come to worship before HIM." Isa 66:23

Similar language is used throughout the prophets concerning other Holy Days, like New Moons and festivals and ceremonial sabbaths. So why aren't you keeping those?

 

[stenerson]

The word rest is not correct it should be to celebrate.

Says who?

 

[stinsonmarri]

stenerson

Responding to your comments:

Similar language is used throughout the prophets concerning other Holy Days, like New Moons and festivals and ceremonial sabbaths. So why aren't you keeping those?

Ceremonial sabbaths is not found in the Bible anywhere. I suggest that you should prove that this is there first my friend!

Says who?

When understanding Hebrew it is something that is taught when learning the ancient Hebrew language in college. There are today some sites that will teach you the basic but you must have experience in the field of Biblical history. Note first that ELOHIM do not need to rest. So next you should look up to see why this English word was used. Strong sometime used implication and not necessarily the facts. If you want to understand true meaning of a sentence you must check the words to get the full understanding. Remember the scholar during the 15000-1800 did have the tools and resources we have today. Also you want to be familiar with a Hebrew site who better will know how to explain their language. Here first is Strong definition of this word.

A primitive root; to repose, that is, desist from exertion used in many implied relations (causatively, figuratively or specifically): - (cause to, let, make to) cease, celebrate. Strong Dictionary

Why did the scholars used the verb rest which comes from the noun rest

rest (n.1) "sleep," Old English ræste, reste "rest, bed, intermission of labor, mental peace," from Proto-Germanic *rastjo, *rasto. Original sense seems to be a measure of distance pause (n.) Look up pause at early 15c., from Old French pausee "a pause, interruption" (14c.) and directly from Latin pausa "a halt, stop, cessation," from Greek pausis "stopping, ceasing," from pauein "to stop, to cause to cease," from PIE root *paus- "to leave, desert, cease, stop." Etymology Dictionary Online

You then see according to the word rest actually means sleep. So we look up both words repose and desist.


repose (v.1) "lie at rest," late 15c., from Middle French reposer, from Old French repauser (10c.), from Late Latin repausare "cause to rest," from Latin re-, here probably an intensive prefix, + Late Latin pausare "to stop" (see pause). Related: Reposed; reposing. Etymology Dictionary Online

Well repose means to lie at rest in English but tracing the word back in Latin the word actually comes from the word pausare to stop in English that word is pause.

pause (n.) early 15c., from Old French pausee "a pause, interruption" (14c.) and directly from Latin pausa "a halt, stop, cessation," from Greek pausis "stopping, ceasing," from pauein "to stop, to cause to cease," from PIE root *paus- "to leave, desert, cease, stop." Etymology Dictionary Online

But we also need to now look at desist:

desist (v.) Look up desist at Dictionary.commid-15c., from Middle French désister (mid-14c.), from Latin desistere "to stand aside, leave off, cease," from de- "off" (see de-) + sistere "stop, come to a stand" (see assist). Related: Desisted; desisting.

So with just tracing the word back etymologically we find that a better word should have been repose or desist which both means to stop but not going to sleep! Now also keep in mind that Strong also used the word to celebrate. So does the Bible gives this thought as well?

Blessed is the man who does [what is right], the man who holds it fast, who keeps the Sabbath without desecrating it, and keeps his hand from doing any evil. (Isaiah 56:2)

If you keep your feet from breaking the Sabbath and from doing as you please on my holy day, if you call the Sabbath a delight and YAHWEH'S Holy day honorable, and if you honor it by not going your own way and not doing as you please or speaking idle words, then you will find your joy in YAHWEH, and I will cause you to ride on the heights of the land and to feast on the inheritance of your father Jacob. The Mouth of YAHWEH has spoken. (Isaiah 58:13-14)

Now of the other Holy Assembly Days were written by ELOHIM with the Sabbath known as Statutes or Law. All the others are called Commandments! (See Ex 24:12) Please do a complete study about the Holy Appointed Set Times. Start with Gen 1:14, Dan 7:25 and find out and truly understand what the Hebrew word moed mean.

Blessings,
stinsonmarri

 

[stenerson]

Ceremonial sabbaths is not found in the Bible anywhere. I suggest that you should prove that this is there first my friend!

Ceremonial sabbaths is a term that I get from SDA folks when they refer to Colosians 2:16..

As far as the word rest I'll trust the bulk of Hebrew biblical scholars concerning how it should be interpreted. Using etymology on the English, Latin, French words is just reaching/twisting desperately.
When the commandment was given to the Jews they were told to stay in and around their tents and go nowhere. A man was stoned for picking a few pieces of kindling.

The 10 commandment were called The Covenant, or The Words of the Covenant. The Sabbath was at the heart of this covenant, it was the seal and sign..That Covenant is obsolete. We have a New Covenant with new signs and a new seal and commands concerning behavior.
Jesus Himself is the New Covenant, The Lord's Supper the sign and the Holy Spirit the seal.

 

[Castaway57]

1. The 7th day Sabbath was not made known until after Egyptian bondage according to Ezekiel 20:10-12 and Nehemiah 9:14-15. Notice what the Bible says:

Ezekiel 20:10-12: "Therefore, I made them go out of the land of Egypt and brought them into the wilderness...Moreover I also gave them my Sabbaths, to be a sign between them and Me..."

Nehemiah 9:14-15: You made known to them Your holy Sabbath, And commanded them precepts, statues, and laws, by the hand of Moses Your servant..."

2. The early Fathers of Israel were never given the command or law to keep the seventh day Sabbath (Deuteronomy 5:1-3). Notice what the Bible says:

Deuteronomy 5:12: "Observe the Sabbath day, to keep it holy..."
Deuteronomy 5:1-3: "...Hear, O Israel, the statues and judgments which I speak in your hearing today, that you may learn them and be careful to observe them. The LORD our God made a covenant with us in Horeb. the Lord did not make this covenant with our fathers, but with us, those who are here today, all of us who are alive."

The Sabbath day was never a command or covenant given or made with their fathers.

3. There is not one single account of action of anyone observing the Sabbath until Exodus 16 when it was first made known.

According to the above scripture, the 7th day Sabbath was not made known, commanded, or observed until the days of Moses.

Hmmm; I must have missed something here. I don't see one scripture in what the OP contains which actually says: "I did not ever speak about the Sabbath before this day when I told Moses about it."

It is amazing how some people draw conclusions out of scripture that just are not there. The text itself contains all the evidence we need to disprove this errant claim

 

[stinsonmarri]

stenerson:

I am a SDA and it is still not in the Bible and it does not matter who says it. I will say this and be done. The Christian world is racist and that's sad. The Sabbath (which is one as well) and the other Holy Appointed Set Times are YAHWEH'S and not man. They are observed through out the universe. All of the sons of ELOHIM observed them because they not like us are loyal and obedient to HIS Commands. Everything you see feel and touch from the sun, moon and starts to the creation here on earth and the vast bottomless universe are govern by HIS Law and Commands. Those who claim to know HIM here do not know HIM at all. You do not know or love HIM. If you did you would realizes that HE gave to all mankind the same principles of love and the requirement of obedience. YAHWEH'S SON came down and died because ELOHIM Law said if you sin the only way for remission is the shedding of blood. For our own good a temporary system (animals who have blood but it could not take away SIN), which is still awful was place so we would not have to died until YAHWEH'S SON would come to die in our place. Yet we don't get it or appreciate it at all! How sad and unremorseful we are! To think that the GREAT ALMIGHTY FATHER would give something for one ethnic group of people is absurd! I can quote you Scriptures but what good would it do Because of your unbelief in truth! Delusion is when you reject what is fact and refuse to see not matter what is given or provided. Denominations has nothing to do with this because all have fallen short of HIS Truth and HIS Glory. The proof is shown clearly how we act or treat each other. A good example is the Republicans who say they love the MOST HIGH but hate their brother President Obama. Because his daddy was black. We all bleed the same we have different types but we all are human coming from one man and woman. Look at us, if we cannot get along with each other do you thing you can see and understand the MOST HIGH FATHER and HIS far reaching Principles?
The day will come and it is very soon when all the violence, others accepting their type of sexual preference over what ELOHIM Said will come back and judge them. That is just as wrong and not believing that HIS Law and Commands were not set up for all mankind. Yes the time is at hand and it will be a shocker to all who refuse to accept that HIS Holy Appointed Set Times are correct, Sacred and will be observe once again through out the universe. No longer will there be a rebellious planet call earth it will be made new and peace will come again forever!

I pray for us all,
stinsonmarri

 

[Castaway57]

stenerson:

I am a SDA and it is still not in the Bible and it does not matter who says it. I will say this and be done.

The Christian world is racist and that's sad.

The seventh-day Sabbath is in the Bible from Genesis to revelation, and your other point re "racism" has nothing to do with the topic of this thread.

 

[stinsonmarri]

The seventh-day Sabbath is in the Bible from Genesis to revelation, and your other point re "racism" has nothing to do with the topic of this thread.

Well I see that you are back with all of your shall we say unfeeling remarks. Genesis to Revelation also reveals the Holy Appointed Set Time in which the Sabbath is one of them. Also they begin in Gen 1:14-hello!

Love ya,
stinsonmarri

 

[Castaway57]

Well I see that you are back with all of your shall we say unfeeling remarks. Genesis to Revelation also reveals the Holy Appointed Set Time in which the Sabbath is one of them. Also they begin in Gen 1:14-hello!

Love ya,
stinsonmarri

It has been shown a number of times on this forum that some of the "appointed times" were infact "shadows" or types of Christ crucified, and therefore are not currently binding on Christians today. The Sabbath was not ever one of those shadows.

 

[stinsonmarri]

It has been shown a number of times on this forum that some of the "appointed times" were infact "shadows" or types of Christ crucified, and therefore are not currently binding on Christians today. The Sabbath was not ever one of those shadows.

How many people do you know have shown that the Sabbath should not be kept today because it was for the Jews hum? All those who show this are delusional and they believe I'm afraid a lie. It says "which are shadows of things to come." This word shadows means symbols of things to come and all refer to the body of YAHSHUA in HIS Ministry who is the MESSIAH our RIGHTEOUSNESS! Those who think that they came show everyone anything that does not make sense is not thinking rationally. Many of us have a brains and we can read for ourselves we do not depend on man but on the HOLY SPIRIT. Common sense would tell you that the Sabbath is a Holy Appointed Set Time. You can say all you want what others have shown I've shown that YAHWEH said these Holy Appointed Set Times were HIS. No I'll take YAHWEH'S Word over any man any day. If any man does not take YAHWEH'S Word he will be curse just like Paul said. Who these delusional people are trying to make Paul out to be a liar!

Happy Sabbath,
stinsonmarri

 

[Castaway57]

How many people do you know have shown that the Sabbath should not be kept today because it was for the Jews hum? All those who show this are delusional and they believe I'm afraid a lie. It says "which are shadows of things to come." This word shadows means symbols of things to come and all refer to the body of YAHSHUA in HIS Ministry who is the MESSIAH our RIGHTEOUSNESS! Those who think that they came show everyone anything that does not make sense is not thinking rationally. Many of us have a brains and we can read for ourselves we do not depend on man but on the HOLY SPIRIT. Common sense would tell you that the Sabbath is a Holy Appointed Set Time. You can say all you want what others have shown I've shown that YAHWEH said these Holy Appointed Set Times were HIS. No I'll take YAHWEH'S Word over any man any day. If any man does not take YAHWEH'S Word he will be curse just like Paul said. Who these delusional people are trying to make Paul out to be a liar!

Happy Sabbath,
stinsonmarri

You have not given a single BIBLE text that calls the seventh-day Sabbath a "shadow" or "type" of something else. Common sense also shows the word "ceremonial" to be quite appropriate in it's use by Seventh-day Adventist doctrinal beliefs. You have shown absolutely nothing to disprove what's being said here. All the feast days and holy days of the OT sanctuary service which were types or shadows of Christ and Him crucified, while still remaining instructive for Christians today, are not needed for our salvation, nor are they binding for Christians today, as they were in the OT sanctuary system.

 

[stenerson]

The Sabbath was of course a shadow..The book of Hebrews makes it clear that it was a shadow of the true rest we are to enter..Jesus Christ as our High Priest. Rest from the enemies coming into the promised land, and the Sabbath rest of creation were not the true rest, but a rest remained for the people of God..A rest which these pointed towards.

You have not given a single BIBLE text that calls the seventh-day Sabbath a "shadow" or "type" of something else.

Colosians 2:16...It's clear as day.

 

[stenerson]

delete, posted in wrong forum.

 

[Castaway57]

The Sabbath was of course a shadow..The book of Hebrews makes it clear that it was a shadow of the true rest we are to enter..Jesus Christ as our High Priest. Rest from the enemies coming into the promised land, and the Sabbath rest of creation were not the true rest, but a rest remained for the people of God..A rest which these pointed towards.




Colosians 2:16...It's clear as day.

There is not a single verse in the Bible you can show that calls the seventh-day Sabbath a "shadow" or a "type." What verse in Hebrews are you saying does this?

 

[stinsonmarri]

Castaway:

My response to your comment:

You have not given a single BIBLE text that calls the seventh-day Sabbath a "shadow" or "type" of something else. Common sense also shows the word "ceremonial" to be quite appropriate in it's use by Seventh-day Adventist doctrinal beliefs. You have shown absolutely nothing to disprove what's being said here. All the feast days and holy days of the OT sanctuary service which were types or shadows of Christ and Him crucified, while still remaining instructive for Christians today, are not needed for our salvation, nor are they binding for Christians today, as they were in the OT sanctuary system.

Let me see who truly have common sense my friend. I have shown repeatedly to unbelievers. Common sense should tell anyone that the Sabbath is a Holy Appointed Set Time. It is a day that alway comes at a specfic time of the week-the Seventh day of each week. It is a Set Time and it is Holy also appointed by whom ELOHIM! Now here is another common sense fact in Lev 23:3 and it comes directly after ELOHIM is telling Moses that these are HIS Holy Appointed Set Times. ELOHIM then speaks of the others yearly that is all. Just as Gen 1:14 which I have given to those who should have common sense!

So now let's see who has common sense to believe EGW when she shows what ELOHIM presented to her about words being changed in HIS Word ok!

I saw that ELOHIM had especially guarded the Bible; yet when copies of it were few, learned men had in some instances changed the words, thinking that they were making it more plain, when in reality they were mystifying that which was plain, by causing it to lean to their established views, which were governed by tradition. But I saw that the Word of ELOHIM, as a whole, is a perfect chain, one portion linking into and explaining another. True seekers for truth need not err; for not only is the Word of ELOHIM plain and simple in declaring the way of life, but the HOLY SPIRIT is given as a guide in understanding the way to life therein revealed. EW p. 220, 221

Well let's look up a word to make common sense shall we:

Skia: Apparently a primary word; “shade” or a shadow (literally or figuratively [darkness of error or an adumbration]) Strong Greek Dictionary

Skia thanatou: perhaps a mistranslation of a Hebrew word for "intense darkness. Online Etymology Dictionary Wow!

Adumbration:prefiguration: the act of providing vague advance indications; representing beforehand. wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

Well it only takes common sense to see that the word is actually prefiguration which makes sense to me!

"Which prefigure of things to come but the body is of YAHSHUA"

I truly wonder who have common sense and the ones who are delusional that will believe a lie!

Happy Sabbath,
stinsonmarri

 

[ricker]

The Sabbath was of course a shadow..The book of Hebrews makes it clear that it was a shadow of the true rest we are to enter..Jesus Christ as our High Priest. Rest from the enemies coming into the promised land, and the Sabbath rest of creation were not the true rest, but a rest remained for the people of God..A rest which these pointed towards.




Colosians 2:16...It's clear as day.

Wasting your time. I tell you.

When a person is cornered concerning their main exclusive theological belief they retreat to a defensive position, circle the wagons, and fight tooth and nail without really listening to the other side. Look around at the different denominations and their pet beliefs (Catholics and Mary, Lutherans and the Real Presence, Baptists and Believers Baptism, Assemblies of God and Speaking in Tongues, etc.) and it always ends up the same.

 

[stenerson]

Wasting your time. I tell you.

When a person is cornered concerning their main exclusive theological belief they retreat to a defensive position, circle the wagons, and fight tooth and nail without really listening to the other side. Look around at the different denominations and their pet beliefs (Catholics and Mary, Lutherans and the Real Presence, Baptists and Believers Baptism, Assemblies of God and Speaking in Tongues, etc.) and it always ends up the same.

Yep..In those other cases it's differences in some aspects of scriptural interpretation among scholars and denominations. In the SDA case it's the fact that they believe in a modern day prophetess that's getting this straight from upstairs.

 

[Stryder06]

Wasting your time. I tell you.

When a person is cornered concerning their main exclusive theological belief they retreat to a defensive position, circle the wagons, and fight tooth and nail without really listening to the other side. Look around at the different denominations and their pet beliefs (Catholics and Mary, Lutherans and the Real Presence, Baptists and Believers Baptism, Assemblies of God and Speaking in Tongues, etc.) and it always ends up the same.

To be honest, the sabbath is not an exclusive theological belief of the Adventist church.

And I feel it's always funny how people assume that minds aren't being changed (and this goes both ways) because the individual "just isn't listening to the other side." The truth of the matter is that spiritual things are spiritually discerned, and no matter how much "evidence" one side piles up against the other, it'll never be enough to sway one's belief if the Spirit of God does not attend it.

For this reason, the only thing one need do is sow the truth and leave the watering in God's hand