FLAT or ROUND Earth?

Michael Snow · Sep 24, 2023

Michelangelo Goeloe said:
I hear a lot of Christians saying that we live on a flat earth and nobody can go in or out the earth. Is the Bible clear on this subject?

And since they follow the flat earth delusion, then they believe we certainly have not been in space for over 50 years!
They spurn the truth of God's word on more than one level: The Bible's standard for assessing truth by two or three witnesses.

And the Bible's affirmation of natural revelation. R.C. Sproul

The result is that such Christians put stumbling blocks which detract from the credibility of the Gospel --Augustine

Which all shows the need for a sincere call for repentance.

Michael Snow · Sep 24, 2023

Akita Suggagaki · Sep 24, 2023

Edwin Wright said:
(so-called) Enlightenment

Yes, by all means we should go back to the dark ages of medieval knowledge.

But then what about all the things like cars, jets and espresso machines that the enlightenment paved the way for?

Edwin Wright · Sep 24, 2023

Michael Snow said:
View attachment 336680

Yes, firmament. I rest my case.

Edwin Wright · Sep 24, 2023

ViaCrucis said:
The Pagans believed in geocentrism.

I assume you probably haven't heard of Ptolemy.

-CryptoLutheran

Your assumption is unnecessarily presumptuous. Claudius Ptolemaeus (Ptolemy) is referenced on my website (see Aristarchus of Samos).

Our flat earth, geocentric reality was known widely in the ancient world long, before Ptolemy. Aristotle, for example, was a geocentrist (although he believed the earth to be spherical). Heliocentrism is the aberration, generally believed to have been brought to the West by Pythagoras, but not historically documented until Aristarchus (again, see the webpage titled, Aristarchus of Samos. But the reality of flat earth, geocentrism is clearly manifested in the Holy Bible (see my webpage title, BIBLE VERSES CONFIRMING PLANAR EARTH GEOCENTRISM). Moreover, many of the early fathers of the Church were dyed-in-the-wool flat earth geocentrists as pointed out by the late Robert Schadewald (see Appendix C < Schadewald, Plane Truth). The following excerpt is from Schadewald’s page on the matter:

"Under “Antiochene Theology,” the Oxford Dictionary of the Christian Church explicitly lists Paul of Samosata (3rd century), Lucian of Antioch (d. 312), Marcellus of Ancyra (d. c. 374), John Chrysostom (347–407), Theodore of Mopsuestia (c.350–428), Nestorius (d. c. 451), and Theodoret (c.393–c.458). Elsewhere, it also identifies Diodorus of Tarsus (d. 394) and Severianus of Gabala (fl. 400–408) as Antiochene theologians. Of the nine so identified, at least four—Theodore, Diodorus, Chrysostom, and Severianus—were dyed-in-the-wool flat-earthers, and I am not aware that any Antiochene explicitly endorsed a spherical earth. It seems that flat-earthism may have been a de facto doctrine of the Antiochene school."

d taylor · Sep 24, 2023

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shamayim is used in Genesis 1:1, 1:8, 1:9, 1:14, 1:15, 1:17, 1:20, 1:26, 1:28, 1:30

raqia is used in Genesis 1:6, 1:7, 1:8, 1:14, 1:15, 1:17, 1:20,

What The Bible states is the raqia God created, God called heaven,sky and this is the location where God placed the sun, moon and stars between two bodies of water. It can be seen that the sky is an extended surface that is over the earth God created.

There is no indication that The Bible is stating this is an outer space where the sun, moon stars and (planets not mentioned in The Bible) are millions, billions of miles/light years away from earth

Psalms 19:1 (NKJV)
The heavens declare the glory of God;
And the firmament shows His handiwork.

heavens
8064 [e]
haš·šā·ma·yim,
הַשָּׁמַ֗יִם
The heavens
Art | N‑m

firmament
7549 [e]
hā·rā·qî·a‘.
הָרָקִֽיעַ׃
the firmament
Art | N‑ms

Edwin Wright · Sep 24, 2023

Akita Suggagaki said:
Yes, by all means we should go back to the dark ages of medieval knowledge.

But then what about all the things like cars, jets and espresso machines that the enlightenment paved the way for?

The Enlightenment ideas culminated in the anti-Catholic genocide of the French Revolution. Would you care to go back to the Age of (so-called) Enlightenment?

Akita Suggagaki · Sep 24, 2023

Edwin Wright said:
The Enlightenment ideas culminated in the anti-Catholic genocide of the French Revolution. Would you care to go back to the Age of (so-called) Enlightenment?

We cannot go back nor would I care to go back. But some here seem to want to go back to pre-enlightenment. With such a distaste for science how do they justify living with all its benefits?

Edwin Wright · Sep 24, 2023

Akita Suggagaki said:
We cannot go back nor would I care to go back. But some here seem to want to go back to pre-enlightenment. With such a distaste for science how do they justify living with all its benefits?

It's the heliocentrists that have a distaste for real science. But as far as real science is concerned, please work through my webpage titled, Evolution Refuted by the Ribosme. Do not confuse technology with real science, or with scientism, for that matter, as explained in my webpage titled, Science vs. Scientism.

Benefits you say? It's a mixed bag of tricks to say the least, as anyone who has had an adverse reaction to the COVID-19 "vaccine" would tell you.

Akita Suggagaki · Sep 24, 2023

Edwin Wright said:
It's the heliocentrists that have a distaste for real science. But as far as real science is concerned, please work through my webpage titled, Evolution Refuted by the Ribosme. Do not confuse technology with real science, or with scientism, for that matter, as explained in my webpage titled, Science vs. Scientism.

Benefits you say? It's a mixed bag of tricks to say the least, as anyone who has had an adverse reaction to the COVID-19 "vaccine" would tell you.

and yet here you are on a marvel of a device utilizing the web.

Edwin Wright · Sep 24, 2023

Akita Suggagaki said:
and yet here you are on a marvel of a device utilizing the web.

Which is also a mixed bag of tricks.

d taylor · Sep 24, 2023

d taylor said:
-

shamayim is used in Genesis 1:1, 1:8, 1:9, 1:14, 1:15, 1:17, 1:20, 1:26, 1:28, 1:30

raqia is used in Genesis 1:6, 1:7, 1:8, 1:14, 1:15, 1:17, 1:20,

What The Bible states is the raqia God created, God called heaven,sky and this is the location where God placed the sun, moon and stars between two bodies of water. It can be seen that the sky is an extended surface that is over the earth God created.

There is no indication that The Bible is stating this is an outer space where the sun, moon stars and (planets not mentioned in The Bible) are millions, billions of miles/light years away from earth

Psalms 19:1 (NKJV)
The heavens declare the glory of God;
And the firmament shows His handiwork.

heavens
8064 [e]
haš·šā·ma·yim,
הַשָּׁמַ֗יִם
The heavens
Art | N‑m

View attachment 336682

firmament
7549 [e]
hā·rā·qî·a‘.
הָרָקִֽיעַ׃
the firmament
Art | N‑ms

View attachment 336683

-

...When Psalms was written it is as true then as it is today. Meaning what could be seen (in the sky) from the ground (earth) by humans declared the glory and handiwork of God.

...People did not need science to help them see the glory of God, it was visible. So science has not provided and exposed any more of God's creation in the sky, than was visible when Psalms 19:1 was written.

...Actually now with the artificial lights illuminating the night, people 1000's of years ago have a better view of the glory and handiwork of God's creation.
...Than people do now, satan knows this and has taken advantage, by offering deceptive images of God's glory and handiwork in the sky. of course this was done to draw people away from God, as satan's images go against God recorded descriptions of His glory and handiwork.

Michael Snow · Sep 24, 2023

Edwin Wright said:
Yes, firmament. I rest my case.

You have no case. Pretend scholars who have a one word theology have no credibility. Then there are those who wholly uphold the Word of God.
Faithful Witnessess

Michael Snow · Sep 25, 2023

Apollo 16 Astronaut Charlie Duke - The Circle of the Earth

Edwin Wright · Sep 25, 2023

Michael Snow said:
You have no case. Pretend scholars who have a one word theology have no credibility. Then there are those who wholly uphold the Word of God.
Faithful Witnessess

You are consumed by your presumptuousness.

d taylor · Sep 25, 2023

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Someone should tell the astronaut, what earth means in The Bible.

prodromos · Sep 25, 2023

Edwin Wright said:
You are consumed by your presumptuousness.

And you have resorted to ad hominems, in violation of the rules of these forums.

prodromos · Sep 25, 2023

d taylor said:
-
Someone should tell the astronaut, what earth means in The Bible.

Charlie Duke witnessed the earth from space and it led to him becoming a Christian. You sit there in your comfortable armchair and mock his testimony. I imagine you don't believe that he really became a Christian but simply claimed to be so that he could undermine 'Biblical truth'™ from the inside as part of some great conspiracy.

d taylor · Sep 25, 2023

prodromos said:
Charlie Duke witnessed the earth from space and it led to him becoming a Christian. You sit there in your comfortable armchair and mock his testimony. I imagine you don't believe that he really became a Christian but simply claimed to be so that he could undermine 'Biblical truth'™ from the inside as part of some great conspiracy.

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...No Biblical support for his story, just like the people who state they have died and went to heaven (or hell).

Edwin Wright · Sep 26, 2023

prodromos said:
prodromos said:

And you have resorted to ad hominems, in violation of the rules of these forums.

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FLAT or ROUND Earth?

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