Five Points or less?

[tryme]

I started this thread.

And as such I want to say I intended ONLY fellow calvinist/reformers to respond.

That IS why I posted in this forum and NOT a debate forum.

Thanks for respecting my request that only reformers post.

 

[Jon_]

the best example of such is Richard Baxter , and a fellow Puritan but rigid definite atonement exponent John Owen.

I found Francis Turretin a great help on this issue . (I think he was third in line in Geneva , Calvin ; Beza ; Turretin

Yes, Baxter, unfortunately, could not quite bring himself to accept the logical implication that if Christ's death is effectual unto salvation, then he died only for the elect.

You're right, Cyg, Turretin was the third head at Geneva and his Institutes of Elenctic Theology is supposed to be a masterful work on systematic theology. It was used for years as the definitive work on dogmatic theology (what systematic used to be called). In it, Turretin vigorously refutes the errors of the Amyraldans completely and conclusively. It is no surprise that the decline in the popularity of Turretin's work has also coincided with a rise of Amyraldian error.

Soli Deo Gloria

Jon

 

[Keith Van Horn]

You can not only believe a few of the five points of calvinism, it is all or nothing, but don't take my word for it.

 

[Keith Van Horn]

How much will we worry to know about God, Lets focus our attention on knowing God. We could discuss theology for ever, but nothing outside of prayer and bible study will give you the answers us the answers we are looking for.

 

[Lambeth1595]

.

 

[Keith Van Horn]

Be carefull, yes there is only one real truth, and so that means either calvinsim or arminism is wrong, but i know that this debate seperates christian brothers, and it is not worth it. Seek the truth and you will find the truth.

 

[Keith Van Horn]

The "us" in Rom 5:8 is St. Paul refering to the believers in Rome.

All scripture is God inspired, don't just say stuff that you have heard from others, make sure it is true first.

 

[Proeliator]

The fact Christ became effective salvation for those who believe doesn't negate that He also has given that same opportunity to others who have rejected it.

Now, I may be wrong on this, but if you believe in Total Depravity, that statement is quite ridiculous. Since man has the fallen depraved nature, we CANNOT come to Jesus, we are drawn to Him, as man in his true form wishes to stay in sin. But on the same token, if you believe in universal atonement, then you must believe that God draws all mankind...And that He is the proverbial 98 lb weakling at the beach, since man can resist His drawing. You are gonna have to make up your mind somewhere along the way.

 

[tryme]

T=Total Depravity
U = Unconditional Election
L = Limited Atonement
I = Irresistable Grace
P = Perseverance of the Saints

I was communicating with a reformed pastor who told me he was only four points.
Do you believe all five points?
If not, what do you have trouble with?

Feel free to PM me the answer if you do not feel like posting it.

Reminder of OP

 

[Keith Van Horn]

You should read knowing God by J.I. packer.

 

[Keith Van Horn]

Reminder of OP

Like what was said earler, you cannot believe in only a few points of calvinsm, because each point builds on the one before it. I have a hard time believing in Calvins doctrine, becaue i have heard to much bad stuff about him.

 

[PapaLandShark]

May I gently remind everyone here that this area is not for debate between Reformed folks and those who are not. If you are not Reformed the rules state that you may only post in the realms of praise and fellowship. Please cease and desist. We should all know better.

 

[Proeliator]

Whoops. meant to say, doesn't mean Jesus "hasn't" given the opportunity.

Figures, I finally make a great post, and it was for naught!

 

[Keith Van Horn]

I am going to try to encourage my self to pray and get into the word, and then i know God will show me the answer.

 

[Keith Van Horn]

i never said i do not have reformed beliefs.

 

[ghs1994]

Figures, I finally make a great post, and it was for naught!

It was a great post. My fault on the thing.

 

[PapaLandShark]

i never said i do not have reformed beliefs.

If this was in reference to my last post Keith please understand that it was pointed at everyone in a general sense. Not a specific.

 

[Keith Van Horn]

If this was in reference to my last post Keith please understand that it was pointed at everyone in a general sense. Not a specific.

sorry about that

 

[allieisme]

CLOSED PER OP'S REQUEST.
THIS THREAD WAS NOT UP FOR DEBATE RATHER A DISCUSSION

 

[erin74]

*MOD HAT ON*

Please remember that this is a congregational forum. Non-Reformed members are not permitted to debate in this forum. Please keep posts to fellowship or questions if you do not consider yourself Reformed.

*MOD HAT OFF*