Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed

[Loudmouth]

so i've heard.

What part of the theory of evolution would need to be changed if the universal common ancestor of all life on Earth was created by a deity?

 

[Oncedeceived]

so i've heard.

so i've heard.

and heard....and heard.....and heard.

 

[[serious]]

Evolution says the female comes first.

The exact opposite of what Genesis says.

Where does evolution say that?

As I recall, c elegans (a nematode) has males and hermaphrodites, but no females

 

[AV1611VET]

Where does evolution say that?

As I recall, c elegans (a nematode) has males and hermaphrodites, but no females

I thought we were talking about Homos.

 

[[serious]]

Evolution doesn't explain how or why sex came about at all. Sex is one element in evolution that remains unexplained and even some think it doesn't seem to fit at all. Why go to all that trouble and necessity for two organisms to reproduce.

Actually, the benefit of sexual recombination is well understood. it provides a mechanism by which beneficial genes may spread more quickly in a population

 

[[serious]]

I thought we were talking about Homos.

and where did you hear that human females originated before males?

 

[Loudmouth]

Actually, the benefit of sexual recombination is well understood. it provides a mechanism by which beneficial genes may spread more quickly in a population

It also provides a mechanism by which beneficial genes can be spread independently of detrimental genes, even those on the same chromosome. With asexual reproduction, offspring get both the bad and the good. With a "double" genome that shuffles itself, offspring have the chance of inheriting just the good alleles.

 

[AV1611VET]

and where did you hear that human females originated before males?

I've already backed down from that statement.

But just for fun:

Who is older?

Y-adam or MTdna Eve?

 

[Jan Volkes]

We have historical documents that show He existed and was crucified. Documents that claim He did magic. These are from non-Biblical sources. We have the historic document of the Bible as well.

Short answer......... no there is not, people say that there is but there is not, you may want to believe that there is but there is not, the only documents that a man called Jesus existed are in the bible, that is the ONLY document relating to Jesus there is.

The Bible has shown it is a historic document that provided information about past cultures, people and places.

Short answer............. no it is not, the bible is not an historical document, the bible is a book of stories most of which were around long before the bible was written, Christians however will continue to believe whatever they want to believe no matter what the truth is, so good luck to them.

 

[whois]

You claimed that they're saying that "natural selection is no longer valid as a driving force of evolutionary change." That statement is false.

when scientists say, and apparently proved, natural selection has little no no effect on the vast number of genomes, then by implication natural selection IS NOT the primary driving force of evolution.

from koonin:
There is no consistent tendency of evolution towards increased genomic complexity, and when complexity increases, this appears to be a nonadaptive consequence of evolution under weak purifying selection rather than an adaptation.

this directly implies a neutral or nearly neutral paradigm, with genetic drift being the primary player

 

[Loudmouth]

when scientists say, and apparently proved, natural selection has little no no effect on the vast number of genomes, then by implication naturtal delerction IS NOT the primary driving force of evolution.

Find a single scientist who says that natural selection has no effect on the genome of any species.

from koonin:
There is no consistent tendency of evolution towards increased genomic complexity,

Genome complexity is not the same thing as adaptive evolution. You have been told this on several occasions.

this directly implies a neutral or nearly neutral paradigm, with genetic drift being the primary player

For genomic complexity, yes. For adaptive evolution, no.

 

[whois]

Find a single scientist who says that natural selection has no effect on the genome of any species.



Genome complexity is not the same thing as adaptive evolution. You have been told this on several occasions.



For genomic complexity, yes. For adaptive evolution, no.

is this another one of your strawman arguments like mutated proteins have no effect on evolution?
i still get a chuckle out of that loudmouth, how you could be so crass as to even propose such nonsense.

 

[Loudmouth]

is this another one of your strawman arguments like mutated proteins have no effect on evolution?

"As the scientists report in Nature today, a group of proteins known as the Paf1 complex (Paf1C) – itself part of the RNA polymerase complex – prevents small RNA molecules from silencing sections of the genome."
http://phys.org/news/2015-03-genes-permanently-silenced-small-rnas.html

Wild populations have functional Paf1C that prevents permanent silencing of genes by small rnas.

So how can permanent gene silencing by small RNAs be a mechanism of evolution in these lineages when it is prevented by this protein?

 

[Oncedeceived]

Short answer......... no there is not, people say that there is but there is not, you may want to believe that there is but there is not, the only documents that a man called Jesus existed are in the bible, that is the ONLY document relating to Jesus there is.

Short answer...you are wrong.

“They (the Christians) were in the habit of meeting on a certain fixed day before it was light, when they sang in alternate verses a hymn to Christ, as to a god, and bound themselves by a solemn oath, not to any wicked deeds, but never to commit any fraud, theft or adultery, never to falsify their word, nor deny a trust when they should be called upon to deliver it up; after which it was their custom to separate, and then reassemble to partake of food—but food of an ordinary and innocent kind.”Pliny the Younger (61-113AD)

“Because the Jews at Rome caused constant disturbances at the instigation of Chrestus (Christ), he (Claudius) expelled them from the city (Rome).” (Life of Claudius, 25:4)

“The Christians, you know, worship a man to this day—the distinguished personage who introduced their novel rites, and was crucified on that account….You see, these misguided creatures start with the general conviction that they are immortal for all time, which explains the contempt of death and voluntary self-devotion which are so common among them; and then it was impressed on them by their original lawgiver that they are all brothers, from the moment that they are converted, and deny the gods of Greece, and worship the crucified sage, and live after his laws. All this they take quite on faith, with the result that they despise all worldly goods alike, regarding them merely as common property.” (Lucian, The Death of Peregrine. 11-13)

Short answer............. no it is not, the bible is not an historical document, the bible is a book of stories most of which were around long before the bible was written, Christians however will continue to believe whatever they want to believe no matter what the truth is, so good luck to them.

Short answer...you are wrong. Historically it has not been proven inaccurate and when it has been considered wrong, discoveries have confirmed it.

 

[Oncedeceived]

Actually, the benefit of sexual recombination is well understood. it provides a mechanism by which beneficial genes may spread more quickly in a population

How did males and females originate before they were spread "more quickly in a population"? Why?

 

[[serious]]

I've already backed down from that statement.

But just for fun:

Who is older?

Y-adam or MTdna Eve?

You might need to review your bible. Who was the last common female ancestor? Who was the last common male ancestor in the bible? (hint, there's at least one after Adam)

 

[crjmurray]

Short answer...you are wrong.

“They (the Christians) were in the habit of meeting on a certain fixed day before it was light, when they sang in alternate verses a hymn to Christ, as to a god, and bound themselves by a solemn oath, not to any wicked deeds, but never to commit any fraud, theft or adultery, never to falsify their word, nor deny a trust when they should be called upon to deliver it up; after which it was their custom to separate, and then reassemble to partake of food—but food of an ordinary and innocent kind.”Pliny the Younger (61-113AD)

“Because the Jews at Rome caused constant disturbances at the instigation of Chrestus (Christ), he (Claudius) expelled them from the city (Rome).” (Life of Claudius, 25:4)

“The Christians, you know, worship a man to this day—the distinguished personage who introduced their novel rites, and was crucified on that account….You see, these misguided creatures start with the general conviction that they are immortal for all time, which explains the contempt of death and voluntary self-devotion which are so common among them; and then it was impressed on them by their original lawgiver that they are all brothers, from the moment that they are converted, and deny the gods of Greece, and worship the crucified sage, and live after his laws. All this they take quite on faith, with the result that they despise all worldly goods alike, regarding them merely as common property.” (Lucian, The Death of Peregrine. 11-13)




Short answer...you are wrong. Historically it has not been proven inaccurate and when it has been considered wrong, discoveries have confirmed it.

Well yes, Christians existed.

 

[Ada Lovelace]

No.So she's still a YEC then?Here's a quote from your link:Notice what it doesn't say?

It doesn't say she went from FAITH through DOUBT to FAITH.

It says she went from CERTAINTY through DOUBT to FAITH.

Now she seems to be looking back and insulting the beliefs of those who were instrumental to leading her to Christ.

My pastor is a YEC ... I am not -- scientists think I am.

But scientists think I'm a Homo sapiens as well, and so I don't give a hoot what they think I am.

Anyway, my pastor is a YEC, but you won't find me writing a book that shoots down YEC beliefs.

Av, rather than making fabrications, judgements, or presumptions about Rachel Held Evans, or inaccurately extrapolating on a very brief post I wrote about her, I encourage you to actually read her books for yourself.

She hasn't written derogatory generalized comments about people who believe in Young Earth Creationism; she explained the way those in her own life treated her, which was absolutely her right. Many Christians have written about the unnecessary conflict caused by the false dichotomy Young Earth Creationists perpetrate, and gone through similar experiences as hers. It's one of the reasons why her books have been so meaningful and encouraging to other Christians, especially those in her generation.

You have written quite literally millions of posts essentially shooting down "evolutionists," many of whom are also Christians, so I don't see how it's reasonable for you to then criticize another Christian for writing honestly and fairly about her struggles due to Young Earth Creationism.

And what's with the all-caps? That's the online version of shouting. Chill.

 

[[serious]]

How did males and females originate before they were spread "more quickly in a population"? Why?

Because sexual reproduction can occur before males and females exist separately. c elegans is a hermaphrodite that reproduces sexually in which there are occasional obligate males. sexual reproduction developed, then genders.

 

[Oncedeceived]

Well yes, Christians existed.

This shows Christ did which was the claim:

“Because the Jews at Rome caused constant disturbances at the instigation of Chrestus (Christ), he (Claudius) expelled them from the city (Rome).” (Life of Claudius, 25:4)

And:

“The Christians, you know, worship a man to this day—the distinguished personage who introduced their novel rites, and was crucified on that account….You see, these misguided creatures start with the general conviction that they are immortal for all time, which explains the contempt of death and voluntary self-devotion which are so common among them; and then it was impressed on them by their original lawgiver that they are all brothers, from the moment that they are converted, and deny the gods of Greece, and worship the crucified sage, and live after his laws. All this they take quite on faith, with the result that they despise all worldly goods alike, regarding them merely as common property.” (Lucian, The Death of Peregrine. 11-13)