Ex nihilo event in Isaiah 54:16 ".. I have created the waster to destroy" ?

[busterdog]

by this word i mean ex nihilo. you are right, ex nihilo is normally considered fast but i also could imagine slower "ex nihilos", but practically you are right - with fast event i mean ex nihilo event.

Since bara sometimes mean immediate creation ex nihilo, where does that leave your hermeneutics?

I understand the argument against YEC. But, we have built our caes not on a single word, but on other literary principles. We needn't argue those here. SUffice it to say that no single word is the basis for YEC.

What does this view of a single word mean for TE? That bara is always a gradual evolutionary or historical process?

 

[Assyrian]

It can be either. The Big Band was as instantaeous as you can get. How long does it take to create a clean heart in me? How long to create a nation? Isaiah 43:15 I am the LORD, your Holy One, the Creator of Israel, your King. How long does God spend creating the wind? Amos 4:13 For behold, he who forms the mountains and creates the wind.

 

[busterdog]

It can be either. The Big Band was as instantaeous as you can get. How long does it take to create a clean heart in me? How long to create a nation? Isaiah 43:15 I am the LORD, your Holy One, the Creator of Israel, your King. How long does God spend creating the wind? Amos 4:13 For behold, he who forms the mountains and creates the wind.

I don't understand your response. We do agree that it can be both?

My post was responding to a point in the TE forum about an "inconsistent hermeneutic" on this point. I am not sure what xaero intends with respect to his use of bara. I think the word does not give either of us a proof text, however.

I do see the point repeated many times that because one verse is figurative, then maybe all of them are figurative, including Gen. 1.

I say, playing devil's advocate, since there are at least a few that are exactly literal, maybe they are all literal. But, I keep seeing the argument presented that if something like "bara" can be a slow process then this favors an interpretation that makes six days into six eons. Maybe that is not where xaero was going.

 

[Assyrian]

I don't understand your response. We do agree that it can be both?

Yes, not at the same time of course. Did I say Big Band? And God said let there be Glenn Miller...

My post was responding to a point in the TE forum about an "inconsistent hermeneutic" on this point. I am not sure what xaero intends with respect to his use of bara. I think the word does not give either of us a proof text, however.

I do see the point repeated many times that because one verse is figurative, then maybe all of them are figurative, including Gen. 1.

I say, playing devil's advocate, since there are at least a few that are exactly literal, maybe they are all literal. But, I keep seeing the argument presented that if something like "bara" can be a slow process then this favors an interpretation that makes six days into six eons. Maybe that is not where xaero was going.

It has been a convoluted discussion and I have not quite followed all the ins ans outs. To my understanding xaero was trying to tackle a common YEC argument that bara always mean immediate ex nihilo creation, therefore sea creatures and man could not have evolved slowly. But the claim about bara simply does not hold water when we look at other places it is used.