Evolution's Debt to Christianity

[Tropical Wilds]

Some solid and easy to understand reasons not to believe Evolution.
(Comments based on the video content are welcome.)

I’m trying to work out what’s more troubling... Using YouTube as a source of scientific information, or using YouTube as a source of spiritual information...

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

Indeed. Imagine how much more seriously people would take religious claims when they saw priests flying those things with faith alone.

That would fly in the face of natural physics!

 

[GodLovesCats]

There is no such thing as a solid and easy reason to stop believing in evolution. The opposite is true. A lot of evidence around the world is undisputed proof that evolution has always occured in Earth's history and never stops.

 

[GodLovesCats]

Creation was a straight miracle that can't be explained by science. Evolution is a process given by those who refuse to believe in the existence of God, and that He is powerful enough to create a whole universe out of nothing in six days.

How do you know everyone who believes the undisputed truth about evolution based on the mountains of evidence worldwide and living species today (including humans) is an atheist? It is impossible to deny the facts which have been studied extensively by hundreds of researchers without being one yourself. There are so many scientists who specialize in evolution and have discovered tons of evidence to prove it is real they can't all be atheists.

 

[Anguspure]

. Anyone who goes directly to atheism/theism when discussing a scientific theory doesn’t understand even basic middle school science . Science doesn’t deal with supernatural phenomena at all

In so far as Science is committed to methodological naturalism, that is true, which means this sort of science is not qualified to pass comment on things that have clearly taken place with input beyond the material world, acts of creation being among them.

 

[Anguspure]

There is no such thing as a solid and easy reason to stop believing in evolution. The opposite is true. A lot of evidence around the world is undisputed proof that evolution has always occured in Earth's history and never stops.

Since you are just marching to the tune of your DNA why should anybody consider what you are saying is true?

 

[GodLovesCats]

Since you are just marching to the tune of your DNA why should anybody consider what you are saying is true?

Because DNA is physical and observable evidence, of course. So are all of the fossils and carcasses. If the observable evidence has been studied and proven to be past life, we know for a fact evollution occured in a very long time period. Scientists cannot observe what happened 4.6 billion years ago, so how much time passed between the creation of Earth and creation of living organisms cannot be known. This fact means we cannot definitively say the Creation happened in less than a week. Evolution has been proven beyond all doubt thousands of times.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

How do you know everyone who believes the undisputed truth about evolution based on the mountains of evidence worldwide and living species today (including humans) is an atheist? It is impossible to deny the facts which have been studied extensively by hundreds of researchers without being one yourself. There are so many scientists who specialize in evolution and have discovered tons of evidence to prove it is real they can't all be atheists.

Well, In Genesis 1, we see that God spoke the universe into being by saying just, "Let it be", and it instantly appeared, fully formed on the same day He said it. And the days were our 24 hour days, not quadzillions of years.

That is not evolution. A person who believes in evolution, does not believe what is written in Genesis 1. That person either has to say that God does not exist, He lied in His account in Genesis 1, or that Genesis 1 was not God-inspired Scripture. The latter brings up a problem because Paul says that all Scripture is God-inspired, so to say that Genesis 1 is not inspired, makes Paul out to be a liar. This puts serious doubts on all the things he wrote, especially the gospel he preached.

Therefore, there are big problems if we say that Genesis 1 is not literally true, that God spoke the universe into being in an instant of time. If God doesn't exist, we have no hope of the future. If He lied, then we can't trust Him in anything else He said in the Scriptures, and if Scripture is not God-inspired then we can't trust Paul either!

Also, if we don't believe one passage of Scripture - if God does exist, He told the truth, and Scripture is God-inspired, then we cannot believe the rest of Scripture either. This means we have no basis for salvation, because we cannot have faith in Christ without believing the whole Bible as God-inspired, including Genesis 1!

 

[zoidar]

Well, In Genesis 1, we see that God spoke the universe into being by saying just, "Let it be", and it instantly appeared, fully formed on the same day He said it. And the days were our 24 hour days, not quadzillions of years.

That is not evolution. A person who believes in evolution, does not believe what is written in Genesis 1. That person either has to say that God does not exist, He lied in His account in Genesis 1, or that Genesis 1 was not God-inspired Scripture. The latter brings up a problem because Paul says that all Scripture is God-inspired, so to say that Genesis 1 is not inspired, makes Paul out to be a liar. This puts serious doubts on all the things he wrote, especially the gospel he preached.

Therefore, there are big problems if we say that Genesis 1 is not literally true, that God spoke the universe into being in an instant of time. If God doesn't exist, we have no hope of the future. If He lied, then we can't trust Him in anything else He said in the Scriptures, and if Scripture is not God-inspired then we can't trust Paul either!

Also, if we don't believe one passage of Scripture - if God does exist, He told the truth, and Scripture is God-inspired, then we cannot believe the rest of Scripture either. This means we have no basis for salvation, because we cannot have faith in Christ without believing the whole Bible as God-inspired, including Genesis 1!

Could it be that some parts of the Bible are 100% true in message but not 100% true in literal story?

There are lots of Christians who believe in evolution. I believe most of them would argue for the whole Bible being inspired by God.

Maybe Paul just didn't know everything?

 

[Brightmoon]

Because DNA is physical and observable evidence, of course. So are all of the fossils and carcasses. If the observable evidence has been studied and proven to be past life, we know for a fact evollution occured in a very long time period. Scientists cannot observe what happened 4.6 billion years ago, so how much time passed between the creation of Earth and creation of living organisms cannot be known. This fact means we cannot definitively say the Creation happened in less than a week. Evolution has been proven beyond all doubt thousands of times.

Scientists are pretty sure that life has been on the planet at least 3.8 billion years .

 

[GodLovesCats]

Scientists are pretty sure that life has been on the planet at least 3.8 billion years.

What does that have to do with my post?

 

[Brightmoon]

You’re the one who said YOU weren’t sure how long life started after Earth was formed . Some chemicals are only formed by living organisms and they find minerals based on these . Some minerals won’t form unless life jumpstarts them . That’s how geologists know.

 

[Brightmoon]

I Recommend this book even though it’s about 15 years old .

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

Could it be that some parts of the Bible are 100% true in message but not 100% true in literal story?

There are lots of Christians who believe in evolution. I believe most of them would argue for the whole Bible being inspired by God.

Maybe Paul just didn't know everything?

If God had brought the universe into being through evolution, He would have plainly said so. God does not say one thing and mean another. If you are saying that Paul didn't know everything, you are saying that what he wrote was not inspired by the Holy Spirit (who actually does know everything!). If Paul said that all Scripture is inspired of God, then it is literally true.

If professing Christians say that they believe that the Bible is inspired by God, but do not believe Genesis 1 literally, that shows that God did not create the universe through evolution, then they are mistaken or lying, because we can't say that the Bible is God-inspired, and then decide not to believe parts of it that don't comply with our understanding.

God says what He means and means what He says. Jesus, in speaking about the mansions waiting in heaven for believers, He said, "If it were not so, I would have told you." There can be only one interpretation when God speaks directly, and that is what He literally says. If He says that He created the universe in one out of six days, then that is what He did. If it were otherwise, He would have said so.

Those who cannot just have faith in what God has said, play the "another interpretation" card to try and shrink God down to their limited mortal understanding. My attitude is that if God said it, I believe it, so it is a straight-out case and there it is!

Even professing Christians can in their own way just repeat what the devil said to Eve: "Has God said?" or "Did He mean literally that you would actually die if you ate of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil? Not necessarily. You will becomes gods instead!" That's what the devil meant when he asked Eve the question. But God's words came true 800 years later when both Adam and Eve were dead. So they did die after all. God is never wrong in what He says. It is just that some don't want to believe it somethings because they like to be their own gods and have things their own way.

 

[Brightmoon]

If God had brought the universe into being through evolution, He would have plainly said so. God does not say one thing and mean another. If you are saying that Paul didn't know everything, you are saying that what he wrote was not inspired by the Holy Spirit (who actually does know everything!). If Paul said that all Scripture is inspired of God, then it is literally true.

If professing Christians say that they believe that the Bible is inspired by God, but do not believe Genesis 1 literally, that shows that God did not create the universe through evolution, then they are mistaken or lying, because we can't say that the Bible is God-inspired, and then decide not to believe parts of it that don't comply with our understanding.

God says what He means and means what He says. Jesus, in speaking about the mansions waiting in heaven for believers, He said, "If it were not so, I would have told you." There can be only one interpretation when God speaks directly, and that is what He literally says. If He says that He created the universe in one out of six days, then that is what He did. If it were otherwise, He would have said so.
(Snip)

But God DID say so ! Nature, which God created , doesn’t lie and mainstream scientists only report what nature says about itself.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

But God DID say so ! Nature, which God created , doesn’t lie and mainstream scientists only report what nature says about itself.

I don't see God mentioning anything about evolution in Genesis 1. If He created the universe through evolution, He would have said so directly. It is not wise to put words into God's mouth which He did not say. I don't know what god you believe in, but I believe in the living God of the Bible who has the almighty power to create a whole universe out of nothing and make it appear as if it existed for quadrillions of years, in an instant of time just by telling it to come into existence.

Scientists can report only on the nature and characteristics of the universe, but not how it was created.

 

[PaulCyp1]

• Biological evolution is not a "belief". It is a fact supported by millions of pieces of physical evidence obtained through the investigative efforts of thousands of professional scientists. I'm sorry if your denomination's misinterpretations of the Bible contradict the known facts, but that doesn't make the facts any less true. Jesus founded one Church, said it was to remain one, and promised that one Church the fullness of God's truth. Which is why that one Church remains one in belief, one in teaching, one in worship, one in biblical understanding throughout the world after 2,000 years. And, why the teaching of the one Church never conflicts with natural truths revealed by science. Truth cannot conflict with truth.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

• Biological evolution is not a "belief". It is a fact supported by millions of pieces of physical evidence obtained through the investigative efforts of thousands of professional scientists. I'm sorry if your denomination's misinterpretations of the Bible contradict the known facts, but that doesn't make the facts any less true. Jesus founded one Church, said it was to remain one, and promised that one Church the fullness of God's truth. Which is why that one Church remains one in belief, one in teaching, one in worship, one in biblical understanding throughout the world after 2,000 years. And, why the teaching of the one Church never conflicts with natural truths revealed by science. Truth cannot conflict with truth.

The "one Church" may have that attitude, and I am not going to argue against or doubt that it teaches it. But, because I hold, without compromise, that the Bible is the direct Word of God, and Church tradition isn't, that because God did not expressly state that He created the universe through evolution, then I conclude that evolution is an invention of man. I hold that God is absolutely true in what He says, and in comparison man's invention is a made-up lie to try and describe the formation of the universe without taking into account of the omnipotence of God, that He is quite capable of creating the universe without having to cause it to evolve.

 

[Brightmoon]

I don't see God mentioning anything about evolution in Genesis 1. If He created the universe through evolution, He would have said so directly. It is not wise to put words into God's mouth which He did not say. I don't know what god you believe in, but I believe in the living God of the Bible who has the almighty power to create a whole universe out of nothing and make it appear as if it existed for quadrillions of years, in an instant of time just by telling it to come into existence.

Scientists can report only on the nature and characteristics of the universe, but not how it was created.

the universe was started from the Big Bang not evolution and is only about 13.8 billion years old . Maybe it’s time you learned what evolution and other scientific terminology means.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

the universe was started from the Big Bang not evolution and is only about 13.8 billion years old . Maybe it’s time you learned what evolution and other scientific terminology means.

It appears that you are pretty well convinced about evolution and other theories about how the universe was formed, and don't seem to be able to accept that God can and did create it in an instant of time and set every galaxy, star and planet in its appointed places.

So, we have gone as far as we can in this topic and we can respectfully agree to disagree.