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Evolution Deceit

alec

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How did the endless universe we live in come into being?

How did the equilibrium, harmony, and order of this universe develop?

How is it that this Earth is such a fit and sheltering place for us to live in?

Questions such as these have attracted attention since the dawn of the human race. The conclusion reached by scientists and philosophers searching for answers with their intellects and common sense is that the design and order of this universe are evidence of the existence of a supreme Creator ruling over the whole universe.

This is an indisputable truth that we may reach by using our intelligence. God declares this reality in His holy book, the Qur'an, which He inspired as a guide for humanity fourteen centuries ago. He states that He has created the universe when it was not, for a particular purpose, and with all its systems and balances specifically designed for human life.

God invites people to consider this truth in the following verse:

Are you stronger in structure or is heaven? He built it. He raised its vault high and made it level. He darkened its night and brought forth its morning light. After that He smoothed out the earth… (Surat an Naziat: 27-30)

Elsewhere it is declared in the Qur'an that a person should see and consider all the systems and balances in the universe that have been created for him by God and derive a lesson from his observations:

He has made night and day subservient to you, and the sun and moon and stars, all subject to His command. There is certainly Signs in that for people who pay heed. (Surat an-Nahl: 12)

In yet another verse of the Qur'an, it is pointed out:

He makes night merge into day and day merge into night, and He has made the sun and moon subservient, each one running until a specified time. That is God, your Lord. The Kingdom is His. Those you call on besides Him have no power over even the smallest speck. (Surah Fatir: 13)

This plain truth declared by the Qur'an is also confirmed by a number of the important founders of the modern science of astronomy. Galileo, Kepler, and Newton all recognized that the structure of universe, the design of the solar system, the laws of physics and their states of equilibrium were all created by God and they arrived at that conclusion as a result of their own research and observations.



Materialism: A 19th-Century Fallacy

The reality of the creation of which we speak has been ignored or denied since the earliest times by a particular philosophical point of view. It is called "materialism". This philosophy, which was originally formulated among the ancient Greeks, has also made an appearance from time to time in other cultures and has been advanced by individuals as well. It holds that matter alone exists and that it has done so for an infinity of time. From these tenets, it claims that the universe has also "always" existed and was not created.

In addition to their claim that the universe exists in an infinity of time, materialists also assert that there is no purpose or aim in the universe. They claim that all the equilibrium, harmony and order that we see around us are merely the product of coincidence. This "coincidence assertion" is also put forward when the question of how human beings came into being comes up. The theory of evolution, widely referred to as Darwinism, is another application of materialism to the natural world.

We just mentioned that some of the founders of modern science were faithful people who were in agreement that the universe was created and organized by God. In the 19th century, an important change took place in the attitudes of the scientific world with respect to this matter. Materialism was deliberately introduced to the agenda of modern science by various groups. Because the 19th century's political and social conditions formed a good basis for materialism, the philosophy gained wide acceptance and spread throughout the scientific world.

The findings of modern science however undeniably demonstrate how false the claims of materialism really are.



The Findings of 20th-Century Science

Let us recall the two assertions of materialism about the universe:

The universe exists in infinite time and, because it has no beginning or end, it was not created.

Everything in this universe is merely the result of chance and not the product of any intentional design, plan, or vision.

Those two notions were boldly advanced and ardently defended by 19th-century materialists, who of course had no recourse other than to depend upon the limited and unsophisticated scientific knowledge of their day. Both have been utterly refuted by the discoveries of 20th-century science.

The first to be laid in the grave was the notion of the universe existing in infinite time. Since the 1920s, there has been mounting evidence this cannot be true. Scientists are now certain that the universe came into being from nothingness as the result of an unimaginably huge explosion, known as the "Big Bang". In other words, the universe came into being-or rather, it was created by God.

The 20th century has also witnessed the demolition of the second claim of materialism: that everything in the universe is the result of chance and not design. Research conducted since the 1960s consistently demonstrates that all the physical equilibriums of the universe in general and of our world in particularly are intricately designed to make life possible. As this research deepened, it was discovered each and every one of the laws of physics, chemistry, and biology, of the fundamental forces such as gravity and electromagnetism, and of the details of the structure of atoms and the elements of the universe has been precisely tailored so that human beings may live. Scientists today call this extraordinary design the "anthropic principle". This is the principle that every detail in the universe has been carefully arranged to make human life possible.

To sum up, the philosophy called materialism has been utterly refuted by modern science. From its position as the dominant scientific view of the 19th century, materialism collapsed into fiction in the 20th.

How could it have been otherwise? As God indicates "We did not create heaven and earth and everything between them to no purpose. That is the opinion of those who are disbelievers." (Surah Sad: 27) it is wrong to suppose that the universe was created in vain. A philosophy so utterly flawed as materialism and systems based on it were doomed to failure from the very beginning.



visit muhammedhasenoglu's site or harunyahya's site for further reading about this issue
 

Dragar

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How did the endless universe we live in come into being?

Dunno. Working on it.

Well, okay, I'm not really working on it. I'm learning how to solve equations for waves on a string. But one day!

How did the equilibrium, harmony, and order of this universe develop?

Dunno. Physics, I guess.

How is it that this Earth is such a fit and sheltering place for us to live in?

Ooh, I know this!

We evolved here! We're adapted to the Earth, like the water in a puddle fits in its hole.

And it'll probably kill us off one day. It's done so to a lot of other species. Conditions change, we'll die out. 'Nuff said.

The conclusion reached by scientists and philosophers searching for answers with their intellects and common sense is that the design and order of this universe are evidence of the existence of a supreme Creator ruling over the whole universe.

Not really. There's no reason to think that. But maybe. Who knows?

Scientists are now certain that the universe came into being from nothingness as the result of an unimaginably huge explosion, known as the "Big Bang". In other words, the universe came into being-or rather, it was created by God.

No they don't, and that's not Big Bang theory.

As this research deepened, it was discovered each and every one of the laws of physics, chemistry, and biology, of the fundamental forces such as gravity and electromagnetism, and of the details of the structure of atoms and the elements of the universe has been precisely tailored so that human beings may live. Scientists today call this extraordinary design the "anthropic principle". This is the principle that every detail in the universe has been carefully arranged to make human life possible.

The fine tuning argument falls, because God himself appears to fall under the criteria of 'fine tuned'. (If God had been slightly different, he wouldn't have created humans, or any form of intelligent life...what an amazing coincidence we have a God that produces universes where humans can develop!)

So either God himself is fine tuned, or the argument relies on the fallacy of Special Pleading.
 
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Loudmouth

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Firstly, the title you gave this thread is "Evolution Deceit". Let's see if any of this is even related to evolution.

alec said:
How did the endless universe we live in come into being?

This is not covered by evolution or biology. This is covered by a theory in astronomy.

How did the equilibrium, harmony, and order of this universe develop?

Firstly, there is no such thing as harmony in nature. It is a human term that is not seen in nature. Secondly, equilibrium and order are functions of physics, not biology.

How is it that this Earth is such a fit and sheltering place for us to live in?

For the same reason that coffee fits so well into a coffee cup. Life adapts to the earth, not the other way around.

Questions such as these have attracted attention since the dawn of the human race. The conclusion reached by scientists and philosophers searching for answers with their intellects and common sense is that the design and order of this universe are evidence of the existence of a supreme Creator ruling over the whole universe.

And not a single scientists or philosopher thinks differently?

This is an indisputable truth that we may reach by using our intelligence. God declares this reality in His holy book, the Qur'an, which He inspired as a guide for humanity fourteen centuries ago. He states that He has created the universe when it was not, for a particular purpose, and with all its systems and balances specifically designed for human life.

It is disputed. There are atheists, you know.
 
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alec

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When terrestrial strata and the fossil record are examined, it is to be seen that all living organisms appeared simultaneously. The oldest stratum of the earth in which fossils of living creatures have been found is that of the Cambrian, which has an estimated age of 500-550 million years.

The living creatures found in the strata belonging to the Cambrian period emerged all of a sudden in the fossil record–there are no pre-existing ancestors. The fossils found in the Cambrian rocks belonged to snails, trilobites, sponges, earthworms, jellyfish, sea hedgehogs, and other complex invertebrates. This wide mosaic of living organisms made up of such a great number of complex creatures emerged so suddenly that this miraculous event is referred to as the "Cambrian Explosion" in geological literature. Most of the life forms found in this stratum have complex systems like eyes, gills, circulatory system, and advanced physiological structures no different from their modern counterparts. For instance, the double-lensed, combed eye structure of trilobites is a wonder of design. David Raup, a professor of geology in Harvard, Rochester, and Chicago Universities, says: "the trilobites used an optimal design which would require a well trained and imaginative optical engineer to develop today".

These complex invertebrates emerged suddenly and completely without having any link or any transitional form between them and the unicellular organisms, which were the only life forms on earth prior to them. Richard Monastersky, the editor of Earth Sciences, which is one of the popular publications of evolutionist literature, states the following about the "Cambrian Explosion" which came as a total surprise to evolutionists:
A half-billion years ago, the remarkably complex forms of animals we see today suddenly appeared. This moment, right at the start of Earth's Cambrian Period, some 550 million years ago, marks the evolutionary explosion that filled the seas with the world's first complex creatures. The large animal phyla of today were present already in the early Cambrian and they were as distinct from each other as they are today



How the earth came to overflow with such a great number of animal species all of a sudden and how these distinct types of species with no common ancestors could have emerged is a question that remains unanswered by evolutionists. The Oxford zoologist Richard Dawkins, one of the foremost advocates of evolutionist thought in the world, comments on this reality that invalidates the very roots of all the arguments he has been defending:



For example the Cambrian strata of rocks, vintage about 600 million years, are the oldest ones in which we find most of the major invertebrate groups. And we find many of them already in an advanced state of evolution, the very first time they appear. It is as though they were just planted there, without any evolutionary history. Needless to say, this appearance of sudden planting has delighted creationists.








 
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Phred

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alec said:
How did the endless universe we live in come into being?

Gosh... what's that got to do with evolution? I mean, if you're not going to care enough to even try and address the right issue...

But... I can play. How come Zeus doesn't respond to my prayers??? Huh? Huh?




.​
 
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Dragar

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When terrestrial strata and the fossil record are examined, it is to be seen that all living organisms appeared simultaneously.

This is utterly false. And can someone more familiar with debunking the quote mining grab the rest of this.

Alec, have you been fed misinformation, or are you simply lying?
 
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Loudmouth

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alec said:
When terrestrial strata and the fossil record are examined, it is to be seen that all living organisms appeared simultaneously. The oldest stratum of the earth in which fossils of living creatures have been found is that of the Cambrian, which has an estimated age of 500-550 million years.

Wow. I guess the rumor is true. Creationists only have to follow 9 of the 10 commandments.

Answer this question for us alec. Can you find a buffalo and a T. rex in the same strata anywhere in the world? If no, then I have just exposed your reiterated lies.

Secondly, fossils are found in the pre-Cambrian. This isn't even denied by most creationist organizations.

Let's clear this up first and then we can move to the rest of your plagarism.
 
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alec

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The completion of human's gene map today does not yield the result that man and ape are relatives. One need not be deceived by evolutionists' attempts to exploit this new scientific development just as they do with all others.

As known, the recent completion of the human gene map within the scope of the Human Genome Project has been a very important scientific improvement. However, some results of this project are being distorted in some evolutionist publications. It is claimed that the genes of chimpanzees have a similarity to human genes by 98 % and this is promoted as an evidence to the claim that apes are close to humans, and therefore, to the theory of evolution. In truth, this is a "fake" evidence put forward by evolutionists who benefit from the lack of knowledge of society about this subject.
Moreover, the above mentioned basic proteins are common vital molecules present in various other living beings. The structure of the same kinds of proteins present not only in chimpanzee, but also in completely different living beings, is very similar to that in the humans.

For example, the genetic analyses published in New Scientist have revealed a 75 % similarity between the DNAs of nematode worms and man. (New Scientist, 15 May 1999, p.27) This definitely does not mean that there is only a 25% difference between man and these worms! According to the family tree made by evolutionists, the Chordata phylum, in which man is included, and Nematoda phylum were different from each other even 530 million years ago.

On the other hand, in another finding which also appeared in the Turkish media, it was stated that the comparisons carried out between the genes of fruit fly belonging to the Drosophila species and human genes yielded a similarity of 60%. (Hürriyet, 24 February 2000)

On the other hand, the analyses done on some proteins show man as close to some very different living beings. In a survey carried out by the researchers in Cambridge University, some proteins of land dwelling animals were compared. Amazingly, in nearly all samples, man and chicken were paired as the closest relatives. The next closest relative was crocodile. (New Scientist v.103, 16 August 1984, p.19)

Another example used by evolutionists on "the genetic similarity between man and ape", is the presence of 48 chromosomes in chimpanzees and gorillas versus 46 chromosomes in man. Evolutionists regard the closeness of the number of chromosomes as indication of an evolutionary relationship. However, if this logic used by evolutionists were true, then man should have an even closer relative than chimpanzee: "the potato"!. Because the number of chromosomes in potatoes is the same as that of man: 46

These examples certify that the concept of genetic similarity does not constitute evidence for the theory of evolution. This is because the genetic similarities are not in line with the alleged evolution schemes, and on the contrary, they yield completely opposite results. This "common material" is not the result of an evolution but of "common design", that is, their being created upon the same plan.
For example, the genetic analyses published in New Scientist have revealed a 75 % similarity between the DNAs of nematode worms and man. (New Scientist, 15 May 1999, p.27) This definitely does not mean that there is only a 25% difference between man and these worms! According to the family tree made by evolutionists, the Chordata phylum, in which man is included, and Nematoda phylum were different from each other even 530 million years ago. And genetically, at most we resemble potatoes. Then French fries must be our ancestors right?

Plus: That's right I get these basicly from Harun Yahya and I see he has answered all aspects of evolution. Do not think his are the only books I've read but they are the ones I'm satisfied with. I am sincere right?
 
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:æ:

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alec said:
How did the endless universe we live in come into being?
What evidence do you have that it "came into being" at all?

How did the equilibrium, harmony, and order of this universe develop?
Who says it "developed" at all?

How is it that this Earth is such a fit and sheltering place for us to live in?
How does the earth mold to fit the shape of every mud puddle perfectly?

Questions such as these have attracted attention since the dawn of the human race. The conclusion reached by scientists and philosophers searching for answers with their intellects and common sense is that the design and order of this universe are evidence of the existence of a supreme Creator ruling over the whole universe.
Oh, REALLY? "The" conclusion? Don't be ridiculous.

This is an indisputable truth that we may reach by using our intelligence.
Wanna bet that your claims are "indisputable"?


<snip tired old Creationism in new clothes>

In addition to their claim that the universe exists in an infinity of time, materialists also assert that there is no purpose or aim in the universe.
Malarkey. The truth is that these are the words repeatedly stuffed into the mouths of materialists by propagandizing religious zealots.

They claim that all the equilibrium, harmony and order that we see around us are merely the product of coincidence.
Quote a materialist claiming this. Quote it with context.

This "coincidence assertion" is also put forward when the question of how human beings came into being comes up. The theory of evolution, widely referred to as Darwinism, is another application of materialism to the natural world.
Strictly speaking, Darwinism isn't the current theory of evolution. It's the "Modern Synthesis."

We just mentioned that some of the founders of modern science were faithful people who were in agreement that the universe was created and organized by God.
And ignorant of the leaps and bounds we've made in observing the cosmos since their contemporary period.

<snip>
The first to be laid in the grave was the notion of the universe existing in infinite time. Since the 1920s, there has been mounting evidence this cannot be true. Scientists are now certain that the universe came into being from nothingness as the result of an unimaginably huge explosion, known as the "Big Bang". In other words, the universe came into being-or rather, it was created by God.
Ridiculous. The matter is no way as settled as you falsely paint it. M-theory is just one example which falsifies your assertion.

The 20th century has also witnessed the demolition of the second claim of materialism: that everything in the universe is the result of chance and not design. Research conducted since the 1960s consistently demonstrates that all the physical equilibriums of the universe in general and of our world in particularly are intricately designed to make life possible.
Even more ridiculous. No such demonstrations exist.

As this research deepened, it was discovered each and every one of the laws of physics, chemistry, and biology, of the fundamental forces such as gravity and electromagnetism, and of the details of the structure of atoms and the elements of the universe has been precisely tailored so that human beings may live.
Continually ridiculous. Where is the evidence that any natural laws could have been different? What would an undesigned universe look like?

:æ:
 
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Arikay

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Do Muslims follow the commandments? It should be noted that Harunyahya is a muslim creationist. Although he gets data and support from christian creationists. Which has led some to believe he is being used to try and get people to go to christianity, by pulling them into creationism.

Alec, can you talk on your own?
 
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Loudmouth

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alec said:
The completion of human's gene map today does not yield the result that man and ape are relatives. One need not be deceived by evolutionists' attempts to exploit this new scientific development just as they do with all others.

It does reveal that chimps and man have a common ancestor.

As known, the recent completion of the human gene map within the scope of the Human Genome Project has been a very important scientific improvement. However, some results of this project are being distorted in some evolutionist publications. It is claimed that the genes of chimpanzees have a similarity to human genes by 98 % and this is promoted as an evidence to the claim that apes are close to humans, and therefore, to the theory of evolution. In truth, this is a "fake" evidence put forward by evolutionists who benefit from the lack of knowledge of society about this subject.

So how is this "fake evidence". Are we supposed to take you on your word when you have been shown to be lying via quote in previous posts?

Moreover, the above mentioned basic proteins are common vital molecules present in various other living beings. The structure of the same kinds of proteins present not only in chimpanzee, but also in completely different living beings, is very similar to that in the humans.

Question: And out of those proteins common to all life, which species is closest to humans?

Answer: Chimps, just as expected from the evidence.

For example, the genetic analyses published in New Scientist have revealed a 75 % similarity between the DNAs of nematode worms and man. (New Scientist, 15 May 1999, p.27) This definitely does not mean that there is only a 25% difference between man and these worms! According to the family tree made by evolutionists, the Chordata phylum, in which man is included, and Nematoda phylum were different from each other even 530 million years ago.

So how far apart should they be? 50% different, 99% different? Please show your math.

On the other hand, the analyses done on some proteins show man as close to some very different living beings. In a survey carried out by the researchers in Cambridge University, some proteins of land dwelling animals were compared. Amazingly, in nearly all samples, man and chicken were paired as the closest relatives. The next closest relative was crocodile. (New Scientist v.103, 16 August 1984, p.19)

Can you please list the genes that were used in the comparison. I wasn't able to find the reference online.

Another example used by evolutionists on "the genetic similarity between man and ape", is the presence of 48 chromosomes in chimpanzees and gorillas versus 46 chromosomes in man. Evolutionists regard the closeness of the number of chromosomes as indication of an evolutionary relationship. However, if this logic used by evolutionists were true, then man should have an even closer relative than chimpanzee: "the potato"!. Because the number of chromosomes in potatoes is the same as that of man: 46

Wrong. It is the pattern of homologous genes and the remanants of a chromosomal fusion, in precisely the correct place, that explains why man has 46 compared to the ape 48.

These examples certify that the concept of genetic similarity does not constitute evidence for the theory of evolution.

Maybe if you are a kindergartener.

Plus: That's right I get these basicly from Harun Yahya and I see he has answered all aspects of evolution. Do not think his are the only books I've read but they are the ones I'm satisfied with. I am sincere right?

Why don't you make your arguments in your own words like the rest of us?
 
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Split Rock

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alec said:
When terrestrial strata and the fossil record are examined, it is to be seen that all living organisms appeared simultaneously.
This is a lie. Amphibians do not appear until the Carboniferous. Reptiles do not appear until the Permian. Dinosaurs do not appear until the Triassic. Flowering plants do not appear until the Cretaceous, etc. etc.




alec said:
The oldest stratum of the earth in which fossils of living creatures have been found is that of the Cambrian, which has an estimated age of 500-550 million years.

Another lie. Fossils have been found in Precambrian rocks.

alec said:
The living creatures found in the strata belonging to the Cambrian period emerged all of a sudden in the fossil record–there are no pre-existing ancestors. The fossils found in the Cambrian rocks belonged to snails, trilobites, sponges, earthworms, jellyfish, sea hedgehogs, and other complex invertebrates. This wide mosaic of living organisms made up of such a great number of complex creatures emerged so suddenly that this miraculous event is referred to as the "Cambrian Explosion" in geological literature. Most of the life forms found in this stratum have complex systems like eyes, gills, circulatory system, and advanced physiological structures no different from their modern counterparts..
Another lie: there were no earthworms, there were a few species of polychaete worms. Where were the fish, lobsters, crabs, shrimp, whales, etc., etc.?
 
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