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Evolution - and their take over/destruction of science

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Strathos

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Infinity is used in mathematics all the time. There are even different degrees of infinity. These ideas were pioneered by a man named Georg Cantor, who was a devout Christian, and believed that his theories were given to him directly by God.
 
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FrumiousBandersnatch

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Science is attempting to understand space time, even though space time may not lend itself to theoretical definition.
Not exactly; spacetime is itself an explanatory model. Science is trying to understand the observations from which models such as spacetime are derived. Promising lines of enquiry include those in which spacetime is emergent from a more fundamental context.
 
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klutedavid

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Like I said, they're taken to be true for the system in which they're used. They may not be true in other systems. See Alternative Axiomatic Set Theories.
This paradox was presented first (Cantor was aware of it) and Cantor did not think that it invalidated his system. (Alternative Axiomatic Set Theories).

Of course his system was invalid, he could not accept that the paradox was self evident.
 
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klutedavid

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Infinity is used in mathematics all the time. There are even different degrees of infinity. These ideas were pioneered by a man named Georg Cantor, who was a devout Christian, and believed that his theories were given to him directly by God.
The concept of infinity creates paradoxes in mathematics, Cantor was not being honest.
 
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klutedavid

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Yes, that's correct, there are no contemporary records of Jesus or his death.
We don't need a contemporary record of Jesus, because we have the historical record.

Do you accept the historicity of Jesus?
 
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FrumiousBandersnatch

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This paradox was presented first (Cantor was aware of it) and Cantor did not think that it invalidated his system. (Alternative Axiomatic Set Theories).

Of course his system was invalid, he could not accept that the paradox was self evident.
The point remains that axioms define the truths of particular system(s), they're not universal.
 
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klutedavid

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The point remains that axioms define the truths of particular system(s), they're not universal.
Axioms don't define truths, axioms are accepted as truth statements.

Mathematics is universal in science.
 
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Zoii

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To make the claim that there existed a singularity, is not a claim that is subject to a scientific test or even to falsification. The claim of the existence of a singularity, is a claim that an entity existed before the natural laws of science even existed. This claim should be rejected by the scientific community. Science is defined as observation, measurement, repeatable experiments, hard evidence supporting a valid theory through objective agreement.

Science cannot progress unless an idea can be tested and is subject to being falsified.

Any claim, theory, hypothesis, that cannot be tested is not in the domain of science.

The Big Bang as a scientific explanation is mere science fiction.

The Big Bang at the initial phase (singularity) is undefined, unbounded, not finite, thus cannot be measured or tested!
Hi David. The predictions emanating the BB/singularity that have been measured are background microwaves (those discovering it were awarded Nobel prizes) and the measurement of gravitational waves. In my discussion about what constitutes evidence, my definition is focused on that which can be measured and particularly where it has the capacity to be replicated.

You replied - well you have a written account from a person who recorded a witness testimony and isnt that evidence. I guess since we take on board eye witness accounts in a court of law I have to accept your point. From my perspective though it weakens when it recorded by a 3rd party, then translated and re-drafted over millenniums, as such records are open to transcription error. That said - I accept your view that its a form of evidence albeit weakened by time and transcription, and not as strong as something you can actually measure and replicate.
 
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klutedavid

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Arius

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Is this not science? This research applies Evidence of natural selection and yields practical results.....

Statistical power to detect disease variants can be increased by weighting candidates by their evidence of natural selection. To demonstrate that this theoretical idea works in practice, we performed an association study of 10 putative resistance variants in 471 severe malaria cases and 474 controls from the Luo in Kenya. We replicated associations at HBB (P=.0008) and CD36 (P=.03) but also showed that the same variants are unusually differentiated in frequency between the Luo and Yoruba (who historically have been exposed to malaria) and the Masai and Kikuyu (who have not been exposed). This empirically demonstrates that combining association analysis with evidence of natural selection can increase power to detect risk variants by orders of magnitude—up to P=.000018 for HBB and P=.00043 for CD36.

Combining Evidence of Natural Selection with Association Analysis Increases Power to Detect Malaria-Resistance Variants - ScienceDirect


.........................................................

How about this? Science?

Genes evolving under strong purifying selection are predicted to include those involved in essential mechanisms of host defense, variation in which should lead to severe disorders.16 This prediction is supported by genome-wide data, because Mendelian disease genes are enriched in signals of purifying selection.8,9,17 Conversely, genes evolving adaptively—through positive or balancing selection (e.g., HBB [MIM: 141900], DARC [MIM: 613665], FUT2 [MIM: 182100], the HLA locus genes, ABO blood group genes, and TRIM5 [MIM: 608487])—are usually more permissive to functional variation, which can exert a protective effect against infections.2,4,7,18 These signals of adaptive evolution in immune-related genes, tending to be recent and population specific, further emphasize the important role of pathogens in local adaptation.

Besides the occurrence of novel mutations, functional variants transmitted through admixture represent another potential source of adaptive variation. Recent data provided evidence that 1%–6% of modern Eurasian genomes were inherited from ancient hominins, such as Neandertals or Denisovans,19–21with specific genomic regions presenting up to 64% of Neandertal ancestry.22In the context of immunity, there is increasing evidence to suggest that modern humans have acquired advantageous variation through admixture with ancient hominins, as documented by candidate gene approaches for HLA class I genes, STAT2 (MIM: 600556), or the OAS gene cluster (MIM: 164350, 603350).23–25


Genomic Signatures of Selective Pressures and Introgression from Archaic Hominins at Human Innate Immunity Genes - ScienceDirect

..........................................

Or this, still not science?

As modern humans dispersed from Africa throughout the world, they encountered and interbred with archaic hominins, including Neanderthals and Denisovans [1, 2]. Although genome-scale maps of introgressed sequences have been constructed [3–6], considerable gaps in knowledge remain about the functional, phenotypic, and evolutionary significance of archaic hominin DNA that persists in present-day individuals. Here, we describe a comprehensive set of analyses that identified 126 high-frequency archaic haplotypes as putative targets of adaptive introgression in geographically diverse populations. These loci are enriched for immune-related genes (such as OAS1/2/3, TLR1/6/10, and TNFAIP3) and also encompass genes (including OCA2 and BNC2) that influence skin pigmentation phenotypes. Furthermore, we leveraged existing and novel large-scale gene expression datasets to show many positively selected archaic haplotypes act as expression quantitative trait loci (eQTLs), suggesting that modulation of transcript abundance was a common mechanism facilitating adaptive introgression. Our results demonstrate that hybridization between modern and archaic hominins provided an important reservoir of advantageous alleles that enabled adaptation to out-of-Africa environments.

Archaic Hominin Admixture Facilitated Adaptation to Out-of-Africa Environments - ScienceDirect

............................................

Or this.....

Toward a Phylogenetic Classification of Primates Based on DNA Evidence Complemented by Fossil Evidence - ScienceDirect

maybe this one?....

Phylogenetic relations of humans and African apes from DNA sequences in the psi-eta-globin region

I could go on and paste tens of thousands of links to scientific research, please not that the first link I posted actually yields practical results that could be used to improve the lives of many people. If you still think that the Theory of Evolution is not based on science then I can only suggest that you are (a) confused about what science actually is or (b) so entrenched in your world view that your ability to think objectively is crippled by cognitive dissonance.


Entrenched in my world view that my ability to think objectively is crippled by cognitive dissonance? I don't know Jimmy, I used to think that both Evolution and the Big Bang made sense, and tried to fit it in the Bible like many Christians are doing, especially now with the Pope having announced both theories as how God would have done Creation.
"God is not a magician!" he said approving both 'magical' theories.

Wow, thank you @Jimmy D for that effort you put into your reply, I do appreciate it buddy!


This is a good example of the: "Can't see the forest for the trees" syndrome.
You are not only standing with your nose right up to the tree, but magnifying it, using an electronic microscope, and then using math and chemistry to get an idea of what happens to the things that even the electronic microscope won't show you, to try to explain the forest to me.

I know, I know, you could say: "well how else could I show you the forest besides examining the tree, .. this is science!" and as logical as that may sound to most people, it no longer works with me. Like thay say: "Been there, done that!"

Remember I am NOT disagreeing that we all, both animals and humans evolve, adapt, change, and I gave you examples like eunuchs:

- In reality, there are more castrated men alive today that at any other point in history. As many as 600,000 men in North America are living as eunuchs for medical reasons. ... "A castrated adult male will lose muscle but gain fat.

Also we have all the GEO-Mutilation like the Chem-Trailing that's going on, or this, .. this going out of control "trans-gender agenda" (see the Olympics for examples), .. or the GMO with our food, which eventually will either make us adapt to fake fruits and vegetables, or we go extinct.

And of course the examples you just gave, and I agree that we were all carefully designed and built to adept, .. yes, and I can show you humans like Filipinos who never seen snow, move to the Netherlands, or even to Yakutsk Russia (Coldest big city in Russia), and they adapt to their environment.

God built us with the incredible ability to adapt.
Out of seven siblings, all none smokers, but I have one brother that smokes, and has been chain-smoking since he was like 12 years old (hiding it from mom and dad) and now he is 70. Now imagine finding him in frozen ice a thousand years from now, let's say 900 years after smoking went out of style, and no cigarettes have been manufactured for all that time, and examining his lungs to determine the atmosphere that this evolving animal of the ape family used to live in? I'm sure Evolutionists would make up some really fantastic stories about him.

There are many reasons why one species of animals and even as you can see, humans would stop mating and reproducing with their own kind, including impotency caused by chemicals in our food, in our water, air and so on.

Take all the domesticated dogs we have and release them into the wild, you think the Great Dane will mate with the Teacup-Poodle? But examining their dried up skull and bones a thousand years from now, Evolutionists would really have something to talk about, .. trying to fit their bones in with the rest of their transitional fossils (you know, the fossils that are transitioning, not the living creatures, because if that happened, it would disprove evolution!) So they stick to fossils.

How about we go back to Dawkins "Common Ancestor", at that "T" where it branches off into two 'distinct' groups, human and chimp/bonobo: "What was the species of that animal?"

I'm not asking about the rest that went on staying whatever species the Common Ancestor was, but the population that changed, some turning/speciating into human, and the other chimp and bonobo, .. only that particular population of Common Ancestor. What species were they?

Oh, and please no more diversions like this:

"Or this, still not science?
As modern humans dispersed from Africa throughout the world, they encountered and interbred with archaic hominins, including Neanderthals and Denisovans [1, 2]. Although genome-scale maps of introgressed sequences have been constructed [3–6], considerable gaps in knowledge remain about the functional, phenotypic, and evolutionary significance of archaic hominin DNA that persists in present-day individuals. Here, we describe a comprehensive set of analyses that identified 126 high-frequency archaic haplotypes as putative targets of adaptive introgression in geographically diverse populations.
etc. .. and so on!

If you can't show me evolution/speciation from the 7 billion humans who were carried away by the same tectonic plates and living all over the world in the same environments, same food they eat, same meteor showers they have experienced including the Ice Age for the past 4 billion years, who by-the-way are living right next to all the Apes, rats, lizards and amoeba, and have been since known history, then just know that you are doing nothing different than let's say an African (Gods Must be Crazy) Bushmen examining a rusted car he found under a rubber tree, and taking it apart, he tells a fantastic story to his villagers of how he believes this car evolved over the millions and billions of years, .. proving how smart he is by showing how "this screw goes into that there nut like so! And maybe even tearing the whole engine apart and re-building it to convince others he knows what he is talking about" where the villagers would obviously just stare in amazement.

That is exactly how I feel coming from your above presentation, as if you really do see me as a dumb evolving animal, .. an ape or something with all that you posted.
Or when showing me dried up skull & bones and fossilized creatures, .. this does not prove that we evolved from amoeba to gorilla, to human. It is your religious belief, and should not be taught in biology.

Biology should be to help us get physically healthier, not to prove your Religious beliefs like how many vestigial organs and body parts an atheist-Evolutionist surgeon could cut out and throw away while we're under anesthesia, since he thinks we no longer need it!

In the past 100 years, because of the influence of this BB-Evolution Religion, our Hospitals have turned into Veterinary clinics where they euthanize the elderly like vets do to sick and other unwanted pets, not to mention all the abortions of children.

Please try again, it's a simple question I am asking here, no need to convince me how awesome and how Intelligently our Creator made us, .. I already know!
 
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Arius

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So you are saying that you can mathematically demonstrate your model of a universe with out gravity?

Please do.

Not mathematically, but by simple observation, including reading notes/info/Revelations taken from Prophets, which they got from the Creator Himself!

- God created all things by rules and laws, each and every particle that makes up the atoms are just rules and laws that the Creator established, which only He, or those He gives authority to can change.

This altering of Gods rules and laws in creation we call "miracles", because there are no 'natural' explanation for them, for they brake 'natural rules and laws'.

It is very much like how a Gaming Programmer creates his own gaming-world, including his characters/creatures in the game, by a program written in a language with it's own rules and laws.

A character in the game cannot walk through a wall, unless the Creator/Programmer changes the rules for that occasion, which the other gamers would consider a miracle since their characters cannot do that.

Same principle, Infinite God has created Word (John 1-) language of laws and rules which define every particle in our universe which are nothing but words/codes/rules/laws and every particle has its place (just like we have in a gaming world program).

So you can better visualize this, picture this from left to right, .. on the left is the less important laws/rules or lower (which are the heavier elements like the earth). And to the right is the higher, or more important rules, ones that are used as standards, which is higher/up spiritual, or what we call Heavenly.
Not much miracle going on there since God does not mess with His Standards.

The more important programming rules and standards are called "up", or "high" (obviously), and the less important ones, that God likes to alter and eventually will rewrite is called "down" or "lower".

Each created law has a hierarchy, and taken out of place, they return to the place they belong. Like a rock belongs to the less important elements/laws, and should we move them towards the right, or to the 'up/higher' elements/particles/laws, they will tend to move back to the left, the lesser important elements/rules/laws, or lower, or "down".

We can mix and match many of these rules/laws like put helium into a balloon and make it pull a basket go towards the right, or towards the "up/higher", while the heavier laws will want to go back to where they belong, or lower/down to the left.

Now Satan created another universe where Gods "Word" (laws/rules/order) does not apply in a story he planted in mans already corrupted minds. This universe does not have higher/more important rules/laws, so there is no "up", or "down", but everything is viewed from their own perspective, or like Einstein described the speed of light (Light-Gods Word) always should be considered relative to your own perspective (lying, cheating, killing, abortion, etc.)

In this imaginary universe, Gods law is whatever you want it to be "Do as Thou Wilt!", even though their existence (reality) is according to Gods rules and laws, which God allows them to enjoy. This is why BB-Evolutionists take apart Gods rules and laws through science, and reinterpret it their own way, presenting their own version of how these rules/laws and order came about and what it means!?

This is why Satan's universe starts out with a Big-Bang, which is a Big-Explosion of all Gods rules/laws and order, and then through no ones will or plan, (taking God and His son Word out of it) they recreate all this order (universe) through chaos.
lol, it's funny really, like stubborn children stumping their feet wanting it their way!

Oh well, we have free will and can make up our own imaginary universe, with magical non-existent force like Gravity, and the other two forces are; Weak and Strong, .. the unholy trinity of the Big-Bang Evolution Religion.
 
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