Evidence for widespread systemic racism.

Hammster · Sep 1, 2021

This has come up in another thread, and I didn’t want to derail it further. I’ve been told that denying widespread systemic racism is giving it a pass. I’d hate to do that because I hate racism. So here’s the chance to show that systemic racism is a widespread problem.

The challenge is to define systemic racism, and show evidence that it exists.

Ready? Go.

friend of · Sep 1, 2021

Hammster said:
Ready? Go.

Okay!

*goes back to knitting a scarf in a rocking chair*

.Jeremiah. · Sep 1, 2021

I am not able to convince you of anything.

I could share my opinion, but then it would end up in the dustbin of opinions.

It’s only you who have the ability to find truth.

But only if you desire it, and seek it.

All the information you seek, does exist. If you cannot find it, try fresh places.

Hammster · Sep 1, 2021

.Jeremiah. said:
I am not able to convince you of anything.

I could share my opinion, but then it would end up in the dustbin of opinions.

It’s only you who have the ability to find truth.

But only if you desire it, and seek it.

All the information you seek, does exist. If you cannot find it, try fresh places.

Your opinion wouldn’t be evidence anyway.

essentialsaltes · Sep 1, 2021

Systemic racism: Despite de jure laws and practices within government and most corporate systems to require racial equality, there is de facto discrimination against black people, which may be conscious or unconscious.

Identical job applications with stereotypical black names receive fewer callbacks for interview.
Identical loan applications with stereotypical black names are equivalent to having a credit score 71 points lower.

These are not the only kinds of systemic racism that exist, but the nature of the studies makes them clean comparisons for assessing evidentiary value.

I don't claim to be an expert on the subject, but this is my layman's take on a definition and evidence.

Gene2memE · Sep 1, 2021

Quote from a 2018 report to the UN on the US criminal justice system:

"The source of such disparities is deeper and more systemic than explicit racial discrimination. The United States in effect operates two distinct criminal justice systems: one for wealthy people and another for poor people and people of color."

Quote from a 2015 report on racial views of justice:

"Many media outlets reinforce the public’s racial misconceptions about crime by presenting African Americans and Latinos differently than whites – both quantitatively and qualitatively. Television news programs and newspapers over-represent racial minorities as crime suspects and whites as crime victims."

Systemic discrimination in the home mortgage market
Systemic discrimination in the UK's mental health system

RDKirk · Sep 1, 2021

Hammster said:
This has come up in another thread, and I didn’t want to derail it further. I’ve been told that denying widespread systemic racism is giving it a pass. I’d hate to do that because I hate racism. So here’s the chance to show that systemic racism is a widespread problem.

The challenge is to define systemic racism, and show evidence that it exists.

Ready? Go.

What difference would it make if you were convinced? What would you stop doing differently?

Hammster · Sep 1, 2021

essentialsaltes said:
Systemic racism: Despite de jure laws and practices within government and most corporate systems to require racial equality, there is de facto discrimination against black people, which may be conscious or unconscious.

Identical job applications with stereotypical black names receive fewer callbacks for interview.
Identical loan applications with stereotypical black names are equivalent to having a credit score 71 points lower.

These are not the only kinds of systemic racism that exist, but the nature of the studies makes them clean comparisons for assessing evidentiary value.

I don't claim to be an expert on the subject, but this is my layman's take on a definition and evidence.

Thanks for that. It’s a good place to start.

I didn’t put it in the OP, but in another thread I did say that I thought there could be systemic racism. I don’t think it’s as widespread as is made out to be. I’ll read your links and get back to you.

.Jeremiah. · Sep 1, 2021

Hammster said:
Your opinion wouldn’t be evidence anyway.

Absolutely true.

You are so wise.

Hammster · Sep 1, 2021

.Jeremiah. said:
Absolutely true.

You are so wise.

That’s what my wife says.

mama2one · Sep 1, 2021

Systemic Racism in Education: It's Real and Pervasive | Shortform Books

essentialsaltes · Sep 2, 2021

Beverly Hills: 99% of people arrested by ‘safe streets’ unit were Black, suit says
Nearly all the people arrested by a Beverly Hills police taskforce over the past year were Black, according to a new lawsuit which alleges egregious racial profiling in the wealthy California city.

The complaint, filed Tuesday by the prominent civil rights lawyer Benjamin Crump, alleges that out of 106 people arrested by a Beverly Hills police “safe streets” taskforce, 105 were Black and one was a dark-skinned Latino person.

The city defended the taskforce on Wednesday, claiming the unit was set up in response to merchants’ complaints about “burglaries, shoplifting, pedestrian and vehicle code violations, street gambling, public intoxication, marijuana smoking and more”.

The city has not disputed the arrest data included in the lawsuit and did not respond to questions about the figures.

(This could be innocuous, as it is conceivable that black people are infinity times more likely to shoplift than white people. Just look at the arrests.)

So now I'm rollin' down Rodeo wit a shotgun
These people ain't seen a brown skin man
Since their grandparents bought one

BNR32FAN · Sep 2, 2021

Hammster said:
This has come up in another thread, and I didn’t want to derail it further. I’ve been told that denying widespread systemic racism is giving it a pass. I’d hate to do that because I hate racism. So here’s the chance to show that systemic racism is a widespread problem.

The challenge is to define systemic racism, and show evidence that it exists.

Ready? Go.

Systematic racism is a term that is used when no examples of actual racism can be found. It’s built on statistics while ignoring the details that are the cause of the statistics. It’s a myth because the government has set laws in place to ensure that systematic racism cannot lawfully exist.

BNR32FAN · Sep 2, 2021

essentialsaltes said:
Systemic racism: Despite de jure laws and practices within government and most corporate systems to require racial equality, there is de facto discrimination against black people, which may be conscious or unconscious.

Identical job applications with stereotypical black names receive fewer callbacks for interview.
Identical loan applications with stereotypical black names are equivalent to having a credit score 71 points lower.

These are not the only kinds of systemic racism that exist, but the nature of the studies makes them clean comparisons for assessing evidentiary value.

I don't claim to be an expert on the subject, but this is my layman's take on a definition and evidence.

How are these the result of systematic racism and not individual racism?

essentialsaltes · Sep 2, 2021

BNR32FAN said:
How are these the result of systematic racism and not individual racism?

The Beverly Hills Police is not an individual.

BNR32FAN · Sep 2, 2021

Gene2memE said:
The source of such disparities is deeper and more systemic than explicit racial discrimination. The United States in effect operates two distinct criminal justice systems: one for wealthy people and another for poor people and people of color."

How would this be an example of systematic racism if whites make up the majority of the poor population?

BNR32FAN · Sep 2, 2021

essentialsaltes said:
The Beverly Hills Police is not an individual.

So the entire department schedules the interviews, or is it an individual?

essentialsaltes · Sep 2, 2021

BNR32FAN said:
So the entire department schedules the interviews, or is it an individual?

Shoot, sorry I thought you were replying to the other story. Going back to my definition of systemic racism, it fits.

De jure, it is illegal to discriminate solely on the basis of race in hiring decisions.
De facto, discrimination solely on the basis of race is happening in hiring decisions.

This applies to the whole system of employment.

BNR32FAN · Sep 2, 2021

Hammster said:
That’s what my wife says.

Nobody’s wife has ever said that.

essentialsaltes · Sep 2, 2021

BNR32FAN said:
How would this be an example of systematic racism if whites make up the majority of the poor population?

Taken at face value, the statement says that 0% of POC get access to the good justice system, but some whites get access to the good justice system.

Evidence for widespread systemic racism.

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