Everlasting - What Does It Mean?

[woobadooba]

As you know, I've posted other things where John appears to contradict some of the other prophets.

I still think anything referring to our immortal God that has "everlasting" or "forever" around it, means just that.

Things regarding satan, sin, and death do have an end, because they are not Godly, therefore not immortal.

Eternal torment in hell is everlasting life (a pretty bad life) and the wicked aren't promised everlasting life.

Yeah, but this doesn't help to answer the question.

 

[OntheDL]

Revelation 20:10
...heemeras (day, 2250) kai (and, 2532) nuktos (night,3571) eis (for, 1519) tous (3588) aioonas (ever, 165) (and, 9999) toon (3588) aioonoon (ever, 165).

Acts 9:24 ...keemeras te kai nuktos...
But their laying await was known of Saul. And they watched the gates day and night to kill him.

Here the 'day and night' came from almost identical greek phrases. In Acts 9:24, it certainly didn't mean eternity but continueously.

Here again in Luke 18:7
And shall not God avenge his own elect, which cry day and night unto him, though he bear long with them?

Here "day and night" is heemeras kai nuktos. Identical as Rev 20:20

Here is the phrase translated from Hebrew

Leviticus 8:35 Therefore shall ye abide at the door of the tabernacle of the congregation day and night seven days, and keep the charge of the LORD, that ye die not: for so I am commanded.

I don't have LXX with me to look up the greek there. But i think it's fairly clear that "day and night" means continueously until it's over.

 

[OntheDL]

Lev 8:35 in LXX is the same phrase: heemeras kai nuktos.

 

[Jon0388g]

Hey Everyone,

To explain a bit before I start, I have a study Bible that is not Adventist in any way. However, the commentary seems to in most cases follow along with our theology, which I find interesting because it will also contradit itself on certain subjects like the Sabbath and the beast power and such.

So, anyway, I was reading Matthew today, and came across something I found interesting that I'd like to ask you guys about.

Matthew 25:46 - And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

My commentary decided to point out that since the same word, everlasting, was used in reference to God being everlasting, it meant that punishment was forever. Also, it tried to say that since the same word is being used it also means that eternal life and everlasting punishment are equal in time.

Since I wasn't satisfied with the verse for God being everlasting that they provided, I looked up different uses for the word and I must admit, it is used for God an awful lot.

Also, I found this:

Matthew 19:29 - And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life.

Same word, but in this case used for life rather than death/punishment.

Now to be clear, I'm not saying I believe in an eternal hell, but today's reading raised a few questions. I'm really interested to see how you guys, as Adventists, work with these verses. I'd also love to see if there's any difference between those who are more traditional Adventists as to progressives in how they view this.

Thanks guys!

Blessings and Love,
Sarah

Tall gave you the "Pièce de résistance", but I'll give you the short, quick answer.


It is indeed the same word "everlasting" - but notice, that it says they will go toward everlasting punishment, not everlasting punishing - see the difference? That usually is the clincher for most people.


The punishment is death: their death is everlasting indeed.


I'm sure someone has posted this by now: take a look at Jude 7:

"just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the cities around them, since they in the same way as these indulged in gross immorality and went after strange flesh, are exhibited as an example in undergoing the punishment of eternal fire." Jude 7


Are Sodom and Gomorrah still burning today? Nope - yet they serve as an example of the eternal hellfire!


Simple!


Jon

 

[OntheDL]

the Greek in both places.

 

[StormyOne]

everlasting = a boring sermon with no end in sight....

 

[TrustAndObey]

everlasting = a boring sermon with no end in sight....

LOL!

 

[IntoTheCrimsonSky]

I was going to quote and reply to all of you since I last wrote here, but that seemed too long. *lol*

Some really good points made in this thread and I especially liked what you pointed out about "ing" vs "ment", Jon. Hadn't thought of that.

Also, the greek stuff is great too. And I'm glad Woob brought up the forever and ever thing, because there's been some good responces to that too.

To be honest, I think my question's been answered to the fullest it can be without actually asking God at this point. Thanks tons, guys. I feel a lot better about it now.

 

[thecountrydoc]

Hi Sarah,


Here are some thoughts on the term "everlasting," and the samantics used in the Greek text, as well as some Old Testment comparisons.

What Does "Forever" Mean In The
New Testament?​

The word “forever” in the New Testament is the word aion, which means “age” and is the root of our word “eon.” It is usually preceded by the word eis (“to”) so the phrase “to the age” might be a literal rendition. In the KJV it is printed as “for ever”. The adjective aionios is translated in the KJV as either “eternal” or “everlasting.”

In the Greek language “aion” and our English “forever” are not exactly the same thing. “Forever” in English comes without qualification, but as can be seen in the literal translation of aion, context may dictate as to whether it really means “forever” as we understand it or not. A simple way to understand it is “as long as it lasts.” It is “for an age,” or an “eon.” When in English we speak of the “computer age,” or the “atomic age,” we recognize that the time period specified is subject to interpretation.

So it is for aion. When referring to the nature of our God, He most certainly is “eternal” in the sense that we understand forever. Thus the life of the redeemed in the hereafter will also be “forever” without qualification. However, when describing the destruction of the wicked, we must allow the basic meaning of the term “as long as it lasts” to predominate.

The destruction of the wicked, according to Scripture, must not be something that lasts “forever” as we understand “forever” because

• <LI class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-list: l0 level1 lfo1; tab-stops: list .5in">This destruction takes place “on the breadth of the earth,” which later becomes the home of the redeemed (Revelation 20:9; 21:1; Matthew 5:5). It would be an impossibility for a continuously burning, never ending hell fire to co-exist with the earth made new. Therefore, we must understand that there will be fire that will “consume” and “devour” the devil, his angels and adherents, but that this fire will come to its end, and God will then recreate this earth (II Peter 3:10-13). <LI class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-list: l0 level1 lfo1; tab-stops: list .5in">There will come a time when the devil himself will “be no more.” (Ezekiel 28:19). The fire that consumes the originator of sin and his followers will leave them “as ashes” (Malachi 4:1-3).
• The explicit contrast between the reward of the saved and the reward of the wicked is “life and death.” The one who receives Christ as his or her Savior “will not perish” (John 3:16). “The wages of sin is death,” not “eternal life in hell.” Romans 6:23.

I pray that this will be of help in understanding the term "everlasting" as found in the New Testament, especially as used in the book of Revelation.

Respectfully, your brother in Christ,
Doc

 

[StormyOne]

everlasting = the person praying on and on for the intercessory prayer and your knees hurt, legs numb...

 

[thecountrydoc]

Stormy, why do you feel the need to make such silly, off topic, post? Are you just trying to create disturbance? Or do you feel a need to read words that you have written?

These kind of post are not helpful, uplifting, or edifying to anyone who may read this or anyother thread in this forum. Please refraine from this practice.

Respectfully,
Doc

 

[StormyOne]

Stormy, why do you feel the need to make such silly, off topic, post? Are you just trying to create disturbance? Or do you feel a need to read words that you have written?

These kind of post are not helpful, uplifting, or edifying to anyone who may read this or anyother thread in this forum. Please refraine from this practice.

Respectfully,
Doc

the question states, what does everlasting mean.... that is what came to mind.... sorry you don't share the thought, or never experienced those things....

Now it might be uplifting, or cause someone to smile.... unless the goal is to be serious all the time.... never smile, never joke, never laugh at some of our practices... Come on Doc, do we really want to discuss edifying or helpful posts here in this forum? I have read quite a bit here just today that would not be considered any of those things....

One last thing, is anything I posted specifically the two comments made in this particular thread in violation of the forum guidelines? If so which? If not, then why the reprimand for this and not the other more egregious comments I know you have read just today?

 

[thecountrydoc]

Stormy,

I fully agree with you in your observation that not all threads or post are edifying or helpful.

But you are dead wrong to think that I want everyone to be serious all the time. People who know me consider me to be a master of one liners, hazzahs and accolades, as well as quips, quotes and short stories. But I don't think there is any place for what might be considered wisecracks when it is couched against an honest question about the Bible and the Scriptures.

Would I consider your post here a violation? The answer is no. Do I think they are in bad taste? The answer is yes. Have I been guilty of the same thing? The answer is yes.

To illustrate: One time when I was a bit younger, a fairly good sized group of belivers were having a prayer meeting. The leader of the group ask for people to state their "needs." Now you and I both know what was ment by "needs." However I opened my mouth and put my foot in it. My quick quip? I need a hudred pounds of $100 dollar bills. A few chuckled, others were insulted. Get the point?


Stormy, you might be happy to know that others have recieved much harsher comments in open forum, and some have recived PMs because what I had to say was only intended for their consumption. It would be my hope that you and others here will think about the effect your words may have on the person who ask the original question, especially when they are serious about the questions ask or the statements made.

Respectfully, your brother in Christ,
Doc

 

[thecountrydoc]

THE END IS NEAR​

Two preachers were in a boat out on a rather large lake discussing biblical theology and what to do their next sermons on. Each had his notes, his bible and a large scratch pad and markers to scratch notes and diagram things.

It wasn't long before a pickup truck full of troublesome teens came brambling up the road that runs beside the lake. Hearing them coming, one of the pastors hurried and wrote "TURN BACK SOON, THE END IS NEAR" with a black magic marker in large letters. He held it up so that the passers by could see it. Of course they only shouted obscenities and made a few rather crude gestures.

About 2 minutes went by and all of a sudden the two preachers heard a lot of screaming and then a really loud splash.

Contemplating this for a minute...then.. one looked at the other and said.. "well, do you suppose they would have understood it any better had we put, BRIDGE OUT AHEAD, instead?"

Doc