Ernie Knoll not a prophet?

[NJK Project]

Hi E.T. Elijah. The reader’s digest account is that Knoll admitted that his private dreams (which he did not publicly post on his website) were evidently not from God, but his priorly and since then posted public dreams were. As I understand an authenticating marker, apart from the actual Biblical soundness of the messages, was that the Angel appearing in his public dream could call him by his heavenly name, and repeatedly did so at the start of those dreams, while the angel appearing in his private dreams, including the dream to either fabricate or to carry on with that made up Candace figure, either do not always do so, or, when asked, could not. However, as 1 Thess 5:19-22 counsels: ‘the proof of the validity of these revelations is found in their internal Biblical soundness’ (Isa 8:20; cf. Deut 13:1-5) and not even if they agree with what either the receiver or the intended audience believe is true/acceptable (=Ezek 14:1-5, 7-11).

They key testing question is would God, as accurately revealed in the Bible, do/accept/allow that?? Thankfully, in the Bible we have many “accredited” examples to make a comparison... e.g., God not allowing Abraham to actually kill his son, yet actually telling him to set out in order to do that. That is just God’s extreme way of testing what is really in someone’s heart (Gen 22:12)

*As I understand 4hispeople.com was Knoll initial website for posting his dreams. However, for some reason, upon resuming his ministry he switched site and opened a new one called formypeople.org.

 

[E.T.Elijah]

So am I understanding correctly. He claimed to have these dreams since around 2005. One of the main testimonials used to provide proof was from a "Candace." Then in 2009 He came out and admitted to fraudulently making up Candace and a Commision and recanted that his dreams weren't really from God. Then afterward, changed his position and claimed that only the dreams that he had made public were false. And then over the last 3 years has had more dreams that are positively from God. Is that the jist of it? That seems to be what I gathered from this thread as well as I have been to his current webpage.

 

[NJK Project]

That is essentially precisely the history except for apparent misunderstanding that Candace was not a proof per se, that his prior dreams before he made her up in November 2007, after his 25th Dream, were from God, just a less generalizing proof that ‘God had supernaturally revealed to someone else that He was a true prophet’.

The actual proof for his prophetic claim remains, as 1 Thess 5:19-22 states, in the Biblicalness of the messages in themselves. If it merely depends on whether or not someone who claims the prophetic gift never sins or even has a major fall, then we e.g., certainly must tear out anything that David ever wrote in the Bible.

 

[E.T.Elijah]

I guess I just don't uunderstand how God can let Him have true and false dreams. And let Him make up people's testimonies to support them. I have not read all his dreams but only the most recent one on his new webpage...there were some things that seemed to stick out as questionable...but I didn't really go in depth into it either...more of just a cursory reading. But thanks for the reply.

 

[Stryder06]

I guess I just don't uunderstand how God can let Him have true and false dreams. And let Him make up people's testimonies to support them. I have not read all his dreams but only the most recent one on his new webpage...there were some things that seemed to stick out as questionable...but I didn't really go in depth into it either...more of just a cursory reading. But thanks for the reply.

I've peaked back and forth a few times, and I share the same objections. I also think that it's suspect for dreams to be from God that have some questionable material in them. It almost feels like his vision for how Adventism should be is the basis for these dreams.

 

[NJK Project]

Elijah and Stryder06: Only Ernie Knoll would actually provide any applicable information as to why God would “let” him go deep into temptation, i.e., not necessarily that Knoll sinned, but that God did not explicitly immediately reprimand him for that started waywardness. Seeing in the Bible how God operates here, indeed as seen with David, I am willing to bet that it was because Ernie Knoll decided to persist in sin. God similarly “let” David, a man who up to then, (and then afterwards) had been “according to his heart, commit adultery with Batsheba, and then have her husband killed and did not at all say or do anything to not “let” him do those sins which both, according to OT Law should have resulted in David being Capitally Executed. My only answer here is that God decided to use this for an object lesson for all of Israel, and indeed one that has probably cause many Church leaders to think twice before committing David’s initial sin. Indeed the mercy demonstrated by God there is enough for the most honest person not to also fall. And David did also pay for his sin, in his family, in his household and in the nation, and quite dearly, eventually leading to the schism which occurred in Israel with all of this probably adversely influencing Solomon who really “one upped” his father in apostasy.

And I am sure that all along the Holy Spirit was battling with Knoll not to persist in his deception and when he would have continued to do so, then God did as stated in 1 Cor 5:5, indeed to purify him, yet not without the natural consequences which Knoll is indeed presently surely feeling. Indeed Jesus similarly let Peter and all of the Disciples variously sin and fall because the just would not heed his long stated warning that he would be violently put to death (Luke 22:31-32), and that was all for their greater good, though through the “hard way”. Like David, since being faithful to God and causing their allotted cause to triumph was very important to them, the consequences of their failures on their influence and ministry surely hurt them the most.

However, we have the imperative to look beyond the fallenness of even God’s chosen messengers and focus on the message. And that is what I am aiming to do. As a recommendation, if one really wants to objectively evaluate Knoll I would recommend reading his various responses to accusations and criticisms in his 2 Volume “Truth” books freely available on his website. Many of the “questionable materials”, which are probably the same as yours, are thoroughly addressed there. At least you’ll have the full view on the matter. I myself am repeatedly surprised how misunderstanding which led to those critical statements are so easily resolved when both sides of the story are heard out. It all reminds me of how EGW was, and still is on the internet today, spuriously accused, criticized and dismissed.

And, as also with EGW, many issue with Ernie Knoll are best understood in a wider spiritual/prophetic context. I.e., Knoll may have a message from God but it is not the only one. I am currently working to harmonize all of those various “messages” of God on my dedicated blog post: [See "Testing the Spirits" post on my blog (Link in Profile)] Much more is said on all of this there.