Engagement rings

[Beautiful Fireball]

Alright faith, you talked me into it. For the sake of originality, I'll propose with a laminated onion ring. Sorry I argued before.

But I want a diamond! *stomps foot and crosses arms*

 

[ImperialPhantom]

But that little hard thing in the onion ring, the crispy part, looks like a diamond!

 

[TheReasoner]

Alright faith, you talked me into it. For the sake of originality, I'll propose with a laminated onion ring. Sorry I argued before.

 

[Blank123]

No, not all of them. But there is hardly any way for the end consumer to know how they were mined.

from stopblooddiamonds.org

In addition to this system, some countries have set up their own measures in order to ensure that blood diamonds are not released in their markets. Amnesty International suggests asking four questions when you are out shopping for diamonds. First, ask the salespeople how you can be sure that what they are selling are non conflict diamonds. Second, ask them if they know where their diamonds come from. Third, ask for the company policy on purchasing diamonds. Fourth, ask if they can show you a written guarantee from their suppliers. Chances are that if they are unwilling to help you out with your questions, they might have something to hide. They might be unable to answer you simply because they themselves do not have assurances as to the nature of their goods. In such instances, Amnesty suggests that you go some place else.

ask those questions and ask for a certificate of origins and you should really have no doubt in your mind






or just get canadian diamonds!

1. What diamonds represent in terms of:
- consumerism/materialism
I think it is disturbing to see diamonds carry such a heavy focus. Why should a young couple who decide to marry pay a laaarge sum for a piece of jewelry when they have so many expenses upcoming? Why put such a heavy focus on the engagement ring, and so little on the actual wedding band for instance? It seems skewed to me.

why are diamonds in particular disturbing? we live in a materialistic age. why aren't cars disturbing? TVs? radios? clothes? money itself?

wait... i'm having a brilliant idea.... we should all throw our money away! that'll show the materialistic ruling classes

- societal structure and status
Again, especially due to the age of newly engaged couples it is hard to get a stone of any size, but us guys feel a pretty intense pressure on getting as large a one as we can, because of what it represents. Because of it's societal importance. Even a small stone can leave a significant dent in our budgets which will be very hard to deal with considering the upcoming expenses related to getting married, building a home, possible children soon after...

funny, i've never heard a guy who was in love and actually wanted to get married complaining about having to buy his girl a ring

(and thats putting to the side that there are cheap rings available to those that want them such as antique/secondhand or manmade diamonds...)

In my personal opinion I find engagement rings for women alone to be an unfair business... What's more though, I am a romantic, though not the kind who thinks what everyone else does is romantic - I prefer to do things my way. I wrote our vows for the wedding ceremony. I proposed in a very unusual fashion. And our rings were a unique representation of our love.
A diamond can't deliver that too easilly. It's too normal. Too common. So it seems to me if you get a diamond you're more concerned about how expensive the engagement ring is than what you say with the ring you give. Oh sure, any ring is a symbol of love - but is it a symbol of your love?

sooo... rather than follow the traditional route of buying a diamond ring because thats not a true indication of one persons love for another we should all follow your example because only you know how to truly express your love for your wife? correct me if i'm wrong but in the end wouldn't that be exchanging one so-called meaningless tradition for another?

 

[TheReasoner]

why are diamonds in particular disturbing? we live in a materialistic age. why aren't cars disturbing? TVs? radios? clothes? money itself?

wait... i'm having a brilliant idea.... we should all throw our money away! that'll show the materialistic ruling classes

*raises an eyebrow*
Come on, the materialism surrounding us has run rampant and is in dire need of being reined in. It brings no good. But it sure brings a lot of bad stuff.

funny, i've never heard a guy who was in love and actually wanted to get married complaining about having to buy his girl a ring

No. Of course not. But look at the bigger picture. In the US what's the amount one is expected to pay for a ring? I recall reading two months' wages. That's a lot of money. Especially if you have a student loan, mortgage and an upcoming marriage. I am not at all saying that giving one's girl jewelry is wrong, I am raising questions as to the wisdom of such a strong focus on one thing.

(and thats putting to the side that there are cheap rings available to those that want them such as antique/secondhand or manmade diamonds...)

Yep. I still think they hold very little originality.

sooo... rather than follow the traditional route of buying a diamond ring because thats not a true indication of one persons love for another we should all follow your example because only you know how to truly express your love for your wife? correct me if i'm wrong but in the end wouldn't that be exchanging one so-called meaningless tradition for another?

lol
Course not. But i find this among certain other aspects of the common western culture to be unwise, and shallow. Another example is what Christmas has become for many people. A consumption fest putting money on the high throne. This is wrong. I think - personally - that such a focus on that one ring is also unhealthy.

Don't you ever pause to ask yourself why we do as we do? The engagement ring you have in your culture is probably a remnant of an ancient culture in which a husband to be needed to show his ability to care for his coming wife. All well and nice, I still think this is a little outdated. I don't think it should be a necessity, and I think the focus on it often goes out of proportions. Like soccer has done in Europe - single people getting paid millions of dollars each match. It isn't wrong to play soccer. It isn't wrong to get paid for it. But when soccer takes half of the prime time news , the players receive the entire GNP of some nations - each - then the focus has gone off, and something's wrong. I think that when a couple establishing a relationship need to prioritize one item like that to such an extent it is almost comparable. How many dates would two months salary give? How many good times together? Instead of buying the ring, maybe the money could be used on an extraordinary event to mark the occasion. After all, events are more personal and carry more weight than a ring. At least I think it does.
I would ask you - as a woman - which would you prefer:
You and your bf are together at home. You're making a nice meal, while he's on the couch watching sports. As you come in, he doesn't rise, but swings his arm out with a box - casually asking 'wouldya marry me?'. With a nice ring carrying a big stone - and then going back to watching sports.
(Yes, I know a guy who did exactly that)
Or would you like, Idunno.... Something a little more substantial and thought through?
You already know what we spent our money on instead of the ring. The actual proposal I worked on for months before hand. I scouted out the place, carefully thought through the symbolism of every single detail. Planned it meticulously and executed it with no flaw, save rainclouds in the horizon, and a nervous stutter (I thought - she didn't notice) when I proposed. I don't say this to boast, but in my experience and opinion the one you love isn't the one you throw a lot of money on primarily. Like the guy in my first example. It's the one you spend time with. And on. Of course, a spectacular event can come together with the ring as well. But I hope you see what I am saying here, about the focus. It seems to me that so much of the focus is on the ring there's so little focus on everything else. Which honestly is what matters. It doesn't really matter if he buys you a ring with the largest stone in the world - if you don't love eachother, or are incompatible (which is an issue) then marriage isn't a good thing. I fear that the focus on the ring can quickly take away focus from other crucial aspects of love, engagement and marriage.

 

[ImperialPhantom]

No. Of course not. But look at the bigger picture. In the US what's the amount one is expected to pay for a ring? I recall reading two months' wages. That's a lot of money. Especially if you have a student loan, mortgage and an upcoming marriage. I am not at all saying that giving one's girl jewelry is wrong, I am raising questions as to the wisdom of such a strong focus on one thing.]

Three months, but I don't know anybody who lives by it. Before I got laid off, that would have equated to an 8,000 dollar ring. If I make 80,000 a year, that's a 20,000 dollar ring.

 

[Blank123]

why are diamonds in particular disturbing? we live in a materialistic age. why aren't cars disturbing? TVs? radios? clothes? money itself?

wait... i'm having a brilliant idea.... we should all throw our money away! that'll show the materialistic ruling classes
*raises an eyebrow*
Come on, the materialism surrounding us has run rampant and is in dire need of being reined in. It brings no good. But it sure brings a lot of bad stuff.

so wouldn't throwing our money away take care of that problem?

No. Of course not. But look at the bigger picture. In the US what's the amount one is expected to pay for a ring? I recall reading two months' wages. That's a lot of money. Especially if you have a student loan, mortgage and an upcoming marriage. I am not at all saying that giving one's girl jewelry is wrong, I am raising questions as to the wisdom of such a strong focus on one thing.

if God blessed him with the money to do that, who are you to question it?

Yep. I still think they hold very little originality.

thats still a very poor argument for telling people not to buy something they want to

Course not. But i find this among certain other aspects of the common western culture to be unwise, and shallow. Another example is what Christmas has become for many people. A consumption fest putting money on the high throne. This is wrong. I think - personally - that such a focus on that one ring is also unhealthy.

again you're assuming the ring has to be expensive which has already been addressed =)

Don't you ever pause to ask yourself why we do as we do? The engagement ring you have in your culture is probably a remnant of an ancient culture in which a husband to be needed to show his ability to care for his coming wife. All well and nice, I still think this is a little outdated.

so you believe the husband shouldn't have to care for his wife at all?

I would ask you - as a woman - which would you prefer:
You and your bf are together at home. You're making a nice meal, while he's on the couch watching sports. As you come in, he doesn't rise, but swings his arm out with a box - casually asking 'wouldya marry me?'. With a nice ring carrying a big stone - and then going back to watching sports.

knowing him i honestly couldn't see that ever happening however thats assuming that if he proposed with a diamond ring that would have to be how its done which does nothing for your argument =)

(Yes, I know a guy who did exactly that)

is he out of the hospital yet?

Or would you like, Idunno.... Something a little more substantial and thought through?
You already know what we spent our money on instead of the ring. The actual proposal I worked on for months before hand. I scouted out the place, carefully thought through the symbolism of every single detail. Planned it meticulously and executed it with no flaw, save rainclouds in the horizon, and a nervous stutter (I thought - she didn't notice) when I proposed.

and a guy couldn't do that if he was proposing with a diamond ring?

I don't say this to boast, but in my experience and opinion the one you love isn't the one you throw a lot of money on primarily.

good point. i know when i buy presents for people i love i always get the cheapest option available!

Like the guy in my first example. It's the one you spend time with. And on.

and a ring obviously says you never spend quality time together

Of course, a spectacular event can come together with the ring as well. But I hope you see what I am saying here, about the focus. It seems to me that so much of the focus is on the ring there's so little focus on everything else. Which honestly is what matters. It doesn't really matter if he buys you a ring with the largest stone in the world - if you don't love eachother, or are incompatible (which is an issue) then marriage isn't a good thing. I fear that the focus on the ring can quickly take away focus from other crucial aspects of love, engagement and marriage.

agreed to a point, however that does nothing to prove your point. No matter if you use a ring or not it could end up being the same thing. Girls dream about the day the man they love will propose to them. That could be the idol in place of the ring. The wedding itself could be the idol. why pick on the ring just because it has a diamond in it? it doesn't make a lot of sense.

 

[Gardener101]

Do you have to ask the jeweler or something to know for sure, I wonder? I wouldn't want to support something like that, call me a hypocrite, I can't be perfect in that sentiment.. But if I can alleviate one person's pain just a bit, I won't have lived in vain..

Don't ask the jeweler. They would just tell lies.

Look for diamonds labelled:


Organic

Or


"Low Carbon Footprint"

Or


"Environmentally Friendly"

Or


"Low fat, low sugar"


Okay, now I am just being silly

 

[The Princess Bride]

What about the girls birthstone in a nice setting?

I think several countries over seas, that is the norm to do instead of a diamond.

Alright faith, you talked me into it. For the sake of originality, I'll propose with a laminated onion ring. Sorry I argued before.

BWWAAHHAHHAHAAH!!!!

Don't ask the jeweler. They would just tell lies.

Look for diamonds labelled:


Organic

Or


"Low Carbon Footprint"

Or


"Environmentally Friendly"

Or


"Low fat, low sugar"


Okay, now I am just being silly

hehehe......

 

[TheReasoner]

What about the girls birthstone in a nice setting?

I think several countries over seas, that is the norm to do instead of a diamond.

We considered that. But we decided on the old Norwegian tradition, which is a simple band for both man and woman.

...low carbon footprint...


hehehe......

Low carbon footprint.... Diamonds ARE carbon....

 

[Beautiful Fireball]

What about the girls birthstone in a nice setting?[/quote]

Yay for me! I'd still get a diamond.

 

[Sketcher]

Canadian diamonds should make you all happy. Get them before the mines get stripped clean.

 

[Bunnymedic]

In all reality,I dont know any girl who wouldnt want a real diamond for her engagment ring.There may be a few out there (but they are far and few between)

I think its fine to get something else if thats something that you both want to do.Just make sure its not something you are pressuring her to do because its something YOU want to do.

Honestly,the first thing that comes ot my mind when a guy tries to argue about not getting a real diamond engagement ring is that he is on the cheap side.

I dont care if you have loans or bills or a wedding to plan.The ring you buy her is a symbol of your ever lasting love and committment,and it will be on her finger long after those bills are paid off.

My fiance doesnt make much,mostly being that he is a full time student.We looked at rings several times,and they are very expensive.
Obviously,depending on your income,you have to set a limit on what you can spend.My fiance gave me an absoulety beautiful diamond engagment ring.
No,its not 2 carots or something crazy like that so we can show off to everyone how huge it is
But,it's the most beautiful ring I have seen and it meant the world to me that I was worth the cost.I know he had to work alot of hours and sacrifice for me to have that ring.That meant more to me than anything.

 

[Monaleezza]

I don't get it. The people in the pic look healthy and happy. Surely buying diamonds help them out?

Are you serious? Wouldn't they be happier and healthier when they're able to sell for themselves what they find?
Maybe they'd be even happier if they weren't beaten and tortured and tormented when they don't work fast enough.

Of course not all diamonds are blood diamonds but in everything we do we have a responsibility as Christians.

We're not seriously saying that we're "Weekend Christians" but when church is finished it's ok to exploit people and support torture and slavery and the abuse of others for the purpose of wearing a rock... or are we?

I will be disappointed if after waiting all these years for a proposal I get a sapphire.

Rather than moan about who does and doesn't buy blood diamonds maybe we could make suggestions of WHERE to get diamonds that AREN'T blood diamonds.

 

[Beautiful Fireball]

Are you serious? Wouldn't they be happier and healthier when they're able to sell for themselves what they find?
Maybe they'd be even happier if they weren't beaten and tortured and tormented when they don't work fast enough.

Of course not all diamonds are blood diamonds but in everything we do we have a responsibility as Christians.

We're not seriously saying that we're "Weekend Christians" but when church is finished it's ok to exploit people and support torture and slavery and the abuse of others for the purpose of wearing a rock... or are we?

I will be disappointed if after waiting all these years for a proposal I get a sapphire.

Rather than moan about who does and doesn't buy blood diamonds maybe we could make suggestions of WHERE to get diamonds that AREN'T blood diamonds.

I'm pretty sure Gardener was joking

 

[none the wiser]

What about the girls birthstone in a nice setting?

Yay for me! I'd still get a diamond.

Ya me too The only reason I'd want a diamond is because they really hold up so well...but it's soooo far from mandatory.

 

[Monaleezza]

I'm pretty sure Gardener was joking

I just used Gardener's quote as a sample of many quotes that were very dismissive. Apologies if I used the wrong example.

 

[Briseis]

I dont get what the big deal is. Diamond, sapphire, ruby. I would say yes if he proposed with a lollipop.

 

[Gardener101]

Diamonds are NOT Biblical, so I really fail to see the big deal about them.

You don't need a diamond ring for the engagement to be real, IMHO....

I really, really couldn't give a toss what kind of ring I got. Heck, I couldn't really give a toss what kind of wedding we had. I don't think about such things...at all.

And as I actually don't wear jewelry, I worry that I might slack and not wear my engagement or wedding rings...at all!

 

[Briseis]

I wouldnt even mind if it was a fake diamond, as long as it is pretty. My birthstone is opal, and that would be pretty too.