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End of the World Talk

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by rynox, Mar 7, 2002.

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  1. rynox

    rynox New Member

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    There is a phenomenon that occurs every time there is war, diplomatic stress, new millennium, etc. in that end of the world talk starts to flare up. I see posts like "The Time is Near" and I'm wondering how much of this discussion is due to this phenomenon.

    Please don't misunderstand me, I don't necessarily disagree, I just want to know what is different now than what has been happening in for the last 1967 years? What signs of the end times are there really?

    Here are some verse that might be useful.

    "And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all [these things] must come to pass, but the end is not yet.
    For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
    All these [are] the beginning of sorrows." Mt 24:6-8

    "Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,
    And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as [they were] from the beginning of the creation." 2Pe 3:3-4

    "But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, [even] to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased." Da 12:4

    Does anyone have any other verse that might answer these questions?

    rynðx
     
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  2. akachel

    akachel New Member

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    I think the key is that at no other time in history did we have the technology in place for prophecy to finally come together.


    Here is one verse that comes to mind:

    math 24:14


    "And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole word as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come".

    We can reach many with television and the internet. This technology did not exist 1967 years ago.
     
  3. parousia70

    parousia70 Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow Supporter

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    But the Bible itself confirms that over 1900 years ago, the Gospel WAS indeed preached to "all the world" Technology or not.

    To Wit:
    Colossians 1:5-6 because of the hope which is laid up for you in heaven, of which you heard before in the word of the truth of the gospel, 6 which has come to you, as it has also in all the world, and is bringing forth fruit, as it is also among you since the day you heard and knew the grace of God in truth;

    Colossians 1:23 if indeed you continue in the faith, grounded and steadfast, and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel which you heard, which was preached to every creature under heaven, of which I, Paul, became a minister.

    In Matthew 24:14, the Greek word for preached is kerusso, it is in the future tense. But in Colossians 1:23 the same word kerusso is in the aorist tense (past). Jesus said that it is to be preached and Paul says in AD 62, that it has been preached to every creature. Paul also said that the faith of the Romans was spoken of throughout the whole world.

    Romans 1:8 First, I thank my God through Jesus Christ for you all, that your faith is spoken of throughout the whole world.

    Paul said that the gospel was made known to all nations.

    Romans 16:25-26 Now to Him who is able to establish you according to my gospel and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery kept secret since the world began 26 but now has been made manifest, and by the prophetic Scriptures has been made known to all nations, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, for obedience to the faith;

    Many today say that the gospel has not been preached to all the world and Matthew 24:14 has not yet been fulfilled. The Bible says that all the nations of the world heard the gospel preached before AD 70. Who are you going to believe? To deny that Matthew 24:14 has been fulfilled is to deny the clear statements of God's Holy Word; it is to call God a liar.

    The Bible says is, I believe it, That settles it.
     
  4. ZiSunka

    ZiSunka It means 'yellow dog'

    +276
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    I agree that they technology to carry out most of the prophesies is in place like no other time in history, plus, Israel again exists as a nation (essential to the prophesies) and that it knows no peace. The unification of Europe, although still incomplete, points in that direction, as does the increased persecution and violence against Believers. People are becoming polarized about faith. We are starting to either have it or hate it. And God is starting to be seen as something evil, which is necessary to the fulfillment of the end times.

    So, I agree that we are closer now than I ever thought we would be in my lifetime!
     
  5. Wildfire

    Wildfire Member

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    Jesus was telling the disciples the signs and the events that would take place in the "last days"; not during their current lifetime.

    We are told that God is longsuffering to all of us, and is not slack in his promise as SOME count slackness; but is desirious that all of us should come to repentance.
    So one day to the Lord is as a thousand years, and a
    thousand years is one day.

    How can one cast doubt on our own creator who made the seasons and time?

    To lambslove; in order to understand this, one needs to look at time on earth as a whole; the events of the "last days" are symbolized as a woman being in labor; which begin as sharp pains that are spread apart, then increase in intensity over a period of time, as she becomes closer to her delivery.

    Are the labor pains wars and famines that those on earth have already suffered?
    Have they increased in frequency over time?
    Is the deliverance of labor the return of Jesus?

    Israel is currently in great distress. This is the country where Jesus was born and then later crucufied. The OT prophets tell us what to expect at the worlds end, and the NT later confirms this.

    Luke 21;
    "And when you see Jeruselam compassed (surrounded) with armies, then know that the desolation (spoken of by Daniel the prophet) is nigh. (very close at hand)

    The abomination of desolation is in the last chapter of Daniel; it is complex in meaning but try and study this for more insight, ask God to help guide you.

    Remember what we are told by Paul;
    For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a theif in the night.
    For when they shall say, peace and safety: then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child: and they shall not escape.
    be ye, brethen are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.
    Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, or of darkness.
    Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober.

    Wildfire
     
  6. Wildfire

    Wildfire Member

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    (oops) I meant to direct this to rynox, who had originally posted this; but Lambslove, you are also welocme! :)
     
  7. ZiSunka

    ZiSunka It means 'yellow dog'

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    Thanks wildfire. I'll ponder it just as if you had really meant it for me. Maybe it was God who was directing you to type my name!
     
  8. rynox

    rynox New Member

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    That is very insightful, thank you. I never really understood what "labor pains" meant, but that makes a lot of sense.

    rynðx
     
  9. parousia70

    parousia70 Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow Supporter

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    But Wildfire, the apostles, writing under infallible inspiration, confirm that they were in fact living in those very "Last Days" that Jesus was telling them about:

    To wit:

    The writer of Hebrews claims infallibly that the scriptural "Last Days" were in fact underway when he wrote:

    Hebrews 1:1-3
    1 God, who at various times and in various ways spoke in time past to the fathers by the prophets, 2 has in these last days spoken to us by His Son, whom He has appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the worlds;

    Next the apostle Peter informs his 1st century audience that they were in fact witnessing "Last Days" prophesy being fulfilled before their very eyes!

    Acts 2:16-17
    16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel; 17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:

    Paul as well, infallibly asserts that the "end of the world" had in fact come upon his "first century generation":

    1 Cor. 10:11
    Now all these things happened to them as examples, and they were written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world have come.

    With all due respect Wildfire, scripture is plain that the apostles were in fact living in the "Last Days" contrary to your opposite assertion.

    YBIC,
    P70
     
  10. sarkazma

    sarkazma New Member

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    hahah, what, are you asserting that Jesus has already returned in the flesh?
     
  11. parousia70

    parousia70 Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow Supporter

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    Hahah, what, Are you denying that the apostles were living in the "Last Days"?
     
  12. sarkazma

    sarkazma New Member

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    last days...you take that term to be extremly literal.... end of days..... a day to god is equal to 1000 years and vice versa. see the coralation?
     
  13. parousia70

    parousia70 Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow Supporter

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    no more so than the apostles did....

    Indeed I do, so the 1000 year "Millennial Reign" of Revelation lasts only 1 earth day? Fascinating.
     
  14. sarkazma

    sarkazma New Member

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    no, you have misunderstood my statement, read again. one day is just the same as 1000 days to god. therefore, one comes to the conclusion, god does not live within the confines of time. knowing this, by last DAYS it could very well mean, ten years just as it could mean 10 hundred majillion quadrafillion years :p. you see?
     
  15. parousia70

    parousia70 Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow Supporter

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    I know what you are saying, but the scriptural record dosen't support such a finding.

    Every time in scripture God puts a time limit on a prophesy, it is given and understood by how time relates to MAN and not how time relates to God.

    This is invariant, without exception or fail, all the time, always.

    There is no record in scripture of God saying he was going to do something within a givin time, but NOT actually doing it within that specific "human" time frame.

    The timing of a prophesy is just as important as the event itself.

    All prophetic time references are meant to be interprated in "human" understanding of time, period.
    The scriptural precident is unwaivering.

    nice try however!
     
  16. Willis Deal

    Willis Deal Member

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    p70,

    yes, there is a scriptural record of God saying he was going to do something within a specific time frame and then not doing it.

    Jon 3:4 And Jonah began to enter into the city a day's journey, and he cried, and said, Yet forty days, and Nineveh shall be overthrown... Jon 3:10 And God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not.

    Do I win a prize :)
     
  17. parousia70

    parousia70 Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow Supporter

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    You win a consolation prize anyway!!

    You are absolutely correct willis!!
    It is I that should have been more clear with my assertion. Please allow me the opportunity to do that now.

    There is no scriptural record of God saying He'd do something within a certain time frame, then following through with "WHAT" He said He'd do, outside of the time frame He ordained for it's fulfillment.

    Good hunting! :wave:
     
  18. Wildfire

    Wildfire Member

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    I don't think it is wise to talk for God by saying he doesn't put a time limit on prophecy; you are not him, or even speaking for him.
    God will do what he wants, when he wants. Period.

    Here is an example that you (parasoua) should read;

    For behold, the day cometh, that ye shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the Lord of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch.
    But unto YOU that FEAR MY NAME shall the Sun of Richeousness arise with healing in his wings; and ye shall go forth, and grow up as calves of the stall.
    And ye shall tread down the wicked; for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet in the day that I shall do THIS, saith the Lord of hosts.
    Remember ye the law of Moses my servant, which I commanded unto him in Ho'reb for all Israel, with the statues and judgements.
    Behold, I will send you the E-li"jah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord:
    And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, LEST I COME AND SMITE THE EARTH WITH A CURSE.

    Wildfire
     
  19. parousia70

    parousia70 Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow Supporter

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    Boy Wildfire, you really have me confused this time! :confused:

    When did I ever say "God dosen't put a time limit on prophesy" I never said any such thing. Have you even been reading my posts? God put time limits on prophesy over and over and over, and Guess what?? when He fulfilled those prophesies, He ALWAYS did it WHEN he said He would, without fail or exception. Our God has proven over and over that He in fact CAN be trusted to do what He says He is going to Do, WHEN He says He's going to Do it!!
    :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

    That truly is a blessed and wonderful scripture Wildfire, thank you for posting it, but I'm unclear as to why you thought it was of paticular relevance to me or to this topic of conversation?
    :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused:

    The only relevance I can see is that God DID send Elijah Just as and when He promised!!

    Matt 11:13-14
    "13For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John. 14 And if you are willing to receive it, he [John the Baptist] is Elijah who was to come.

    YBIC,
    P70
     
  20. thrive

    thrive romans 8:28

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    I don't know that i can add anything to this discussion. But, i just want to say that our generation has witnessed things that, i pray, will never be witnessed again. I know things are just going to get worse (as far as the birth pangs on this earth), but never in my wildest dreams did i ever expect to see the young men (& women) of my generation being sent to fight a war like this in my lifetime.

    I don't believe we, as the church of God, should be worrying so much about whether we are, or are not in the last days. If the Lord comes to take us home & put a stop to all of this, wonderful! But if He doesn't come in our time here, it really shouldn't be of any difference to us. We need to be doing the work He set before us in taking the Gospel to those who need it. (Someone can hear the word a thousand times, even if it HAS or HASN'T been preached to all the world, & not be affected, but then hear it again & get saved.)

    Forgive me for not being able to quote you a direct scripture, but the word says (aside from all these things that have been quoted already), that we should be living as if the end were not near. God wants to find us doing His work.

    I pray that i'll be found a good steward. :D

    *breathes*

    Okay, back to your discussion. lol ;)

    :) :) :)
     
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