• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.

Easy to make things up in science

Status
Not open for further replies.

dad

Undefeated!
Site Supporter
Jan 17, 2005
44,905
1,259
✟25,524.00
Country
Canada
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Has anyone compressed a planet...or even a car to some small thing we can't even see in a microscope? There has to be time to have distances known in space. Even parallax needs time and uses time and space as the base measure point.
 
Upvote 0

timewerx

the village i--o--t--
Aug 31, 2012
16,918
6,403
✟379,843.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian Seeker
Marital Status
Single

My guess if it's due to inelastic scattering, absolute distances would be a lot bigger?

But if that is the case, we could resolve to using apparent sizes from pictures and also from statistical analysis of stellar data to extrapolate distances.



You might take a gander at that Thunderbolts link sometime, and you'll get an earful of reasons to outright dismiss a lot of their claims with respect to dark matter and dark energy.

I agree, there seems to be many counter arguments to dark matter atm. Ironically, the fictitious force physicists immediately dismissed as unaccounted gravitational sources, could also be due to the enormous magnetic fields at play in the hearts of galaxies and other large bodies in the Universe. Also the possibility that an artificial gravity or altered frames of references may be manifested by the unique magnetic fields around these bodies. We actually shouldn't be treating these things lightly as I believe, they may provide us the clue to the next generation of high tech space propulsion systems which will ultimately lead to the warp drive.
 
Upvote 0

SnowyMacie

Well-Known Member
Apr 12, 2011
17,008
6,087
North Texas
✟125,659.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Anglican
Marital Status
In Relationship

The idea of dark matter has been around much longer than that, plus we would have to assume every mass estime ever was wrong in spite of repeated observations and duplicated results.




The universe is expanding.

QUOTE="Michael, post: 68528691, member: 627"]It's simply that he represents everything that is wrong with science and physics today, namely the shunning of empirical physics, in favor of supernatural constructs galore. It is hypocritical for him to sit there and profess that science doesn't have all the answers since he keeps claiming to have them with respect to cosmology theory, and knowledge about the age of the universe which he simply does not actually possess.[/QUOTE]

It's not supernatural constructs, and I've never heard anything remotely from him that leads me to believe he claims to know everything about cosmology. The fact that you keep referring it to "mainstream" science, tells me everything I need to know. I'm done with this conversation.
 
Reactions: Larniavc
Upvote 0

timewerx

the village i--o--t--
Aug 31, 2012
16,918
6,403
✟379,843.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian Seeker
Marital Status
Single
Has anyone compressed a planet...or even a car to some small thing we can't even see in a microscope?

Have you heard about a subject in engineering called "statics of rigid bodies".

They actually assume some things are infinitely rigid. But that is impossible right?


I hope you're just genuinely confused by hypothetical statements and not actually just trolling people.


There has to be time to have distances known in space. Even parallqx needs time and uses time and space as the base measure point.


Interplanetary distances especially the Earth's Orbit around the Sun is used as the base distance and the times against the year when the measurements were taken are used.

At least our data on interplanetary distances, planetary orbits, and dynamics is impeccable, otherwise, there's no way we could even score a near miss with Mars. But we have landed many probes in Mars, shot a probe across Pluto and even landed on a comet!

But Parallax measurement is only accurate up to 10,000 light years at present using the Hubble Telescope. Fortunately, we could use the data to for use in other methods in statistical analysis of distances way beyond that.
 
Upvote 0

Michael

Contributor
Site Supporter
Feb 5, 2002
25,145
1,721
Mt. Shasta, California
Visit site
✟320,648.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
My guess if it's due to inelastic scattering, absolute distances would be a lot bigger?

Shorter actually. The other galaxies aren't moving away from us, there's just a lot of "static" in between galaxies.

Lerner's paper looks at distance relationships in a static universe scenario and it's effect on surface brightness if you're interested in the maths.


You got it. We live in an electric universe with currents flowing all around us. As soon as we learn to surf those currents, space travel becomes a lot easier and a lot faster.

The days of living in the dark ages of astronomy are drawing to a close, and it's only a matter of time before the mainstream starts to realize and accept that we live inside of a electrically active plasma current system, with many circuits that are connecting the various suns and galaxies together.
 
Upvote 0

Michael

Contributor
Site Supporter
Feb 5, 2002
25,145
1,721
Mt. Shasta, California
Visit site
✟320,648.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
The idea of dark matter has been around much longer than that, plus we would have to assume every mass estime ever was wrong in spite of repeated observations and duplicated results.

If you follow that link you'll see that every baronic mass estimate has necessarily been incorrect. They've been underestimating the number of entire stars in those galaxies by between 3 and 20 depending on the size of the star and the type of galaxy. There are more stars *between* galaxies than they realized until recently. In 2012, they found all their missing baryons all *around* the outside of our galaxy and it contains more mass than all the stars put together.

There is amply evidence since 2006 that those galaxy mass estimates were worthless. That's all they *really* discovered in 2006, which they simply misinterpreted as "We're right about the mass estimates, therefore 'supernatural mass did it'.

Furthermore every single empirical lab test has since come up negative, and they've falsified all of their "popular" models.

Both sets of facts suggest that a new cosmology theory is in order, not a bury their collective heads in the sand routine.

The universe is expanding.

Not necessarily. Hubble preferred a "tired light" solution to the redshift phenomenon. How do you know he was wrong? What about the fact that Lambda-CDM failed Lerner's surface brightness test at longer redshifts?

It's not supernatural constructs,

Of course it is. No evidence exists for exotic forms of matter or energy. They *assumed* their galaxy mass estimates were "perfect" and then they fudged the numbers with exotic supernatural agents galore! The needed a whole lot of it too because they botched the stellar mass estimates by a whopping 3 -20 times depending on the size of the star and the type of galaxy. They didn't even find all that million degree plasma around the galaxy until 2012, and it makes up more mass than all the stars in the galaxy, including all the ones they originally missed!

and I've never heard anything remotely from him that leads me to believe he claims to know everything about cosmology.

He claims to know when the universe was created. He claims to know that redshift is directly related to "space expansion' even though "space" isn't even physically defined in GR theory. GR theory only describes objects and the spacetime warp that occurs around objects.

The fact that you keep referring it to "mainstream" science, tells me everything I need to know. I'm done with this conversation.

Lambda-CDM is in fact a "mainstream'' form of science. It's not my fault of course. Suit yourself.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

timewerx

the village i--o--t--
Aug 31, 2012
16,918
6,403
✟379,843.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian Seeker
Marital Status
Single

Seems to be that way but proving they work like circuits will be harder. First we need interstellar probes or at least an interferometer that could observe coronal activity from other stars.
 
Upvote 0

Michael

Contributor
Site Supporter
Feb 5, 2002
25,145
1,721
Mt. Shasta, California
Visit site
✟320,648.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Seems to be that way but proving they work like circuits will be harder. First we need interstellar probes or at least an interferometer that could observe coronal activity from other stars.

Well, we are already measuring magnetic fields that are arranged in Birkeland current type filaments, both large and small. around our own planet, and far out in space.

http://www.news.com.au/technology/s...ting-above-earth/story-fnjwlcze-1227379756018
http://www.space.com/22488-hubble-telescope-space-slinky-video.html

The euphemism "space slinky" is almost adorable if it weren't so tragic.

You're right that we will need to understand exactly how the currents are flowing to be able to surf them properly and accurately so will need to measure them accurately.
 
Reactions: timewerx
Upvote 0

Xalith

Newbie
Apr 6, 2015
1,518
630
✟27,443.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
How about the guy who joins the US military?

There's a bit of a difference between joining a nation's military and joining a terrorist group that is out to kill people first and foremost.

You join a nation's military (hopefully) because you want to help defend your nation. The US Military, in fact, has you take an oath when you join it that you will do all you can to protect the US from all threats "foreign and domestic". There's nothing sinful in that.

Joining a terrorist group that worships Satan with the express purpose to kill everybody who doesn't agree with you, however, is wholly evil. Nowhere did Jesus ever say in the Bible to kill anybody (though I would assume that self-defense and following the orders of your government in times of war are exceptions), in fact He told us to love our enemies and pray for those who would deceitfully use us.

So you tell me, which religion is evil and which is good? The one who says "Kill everybody who doesn't agree with us" or the one that says "Love everybody, including your enemies as you love yourselves" and "Pray for those who would use you deceitfully"?

Not hard to see which is evil and which isn't.
 
Upvote 0

dad

Undefeated!
Site Supporter
Jan 17, 2005
44,905
1,259
✟25,524.00
Country
Canada
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
No. The parallax measure is trashed because you do not know that time exists where the stars are, or that it exists the same as here. Think about it. Without time a light year is not a year at all.

Next, there in no issue with our solar system so forget planet distances that is off topic.

Finally, the big bang theory does claim the universe was too small to see at one time. So, you need to be clear when you talk of shrinking stuff.
 
Upvote 0

SnowyMacie

Well-Known Member
Apr 12, 2011
17,008
6,087
North Texas
✟125,659.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Anglican
Marital Status
In Relationship
Going to another universe in a black hole is a fairy tale. Get it yet?

Maybe in your mind it is, but to Stephen Hawking, it is not. Personally, I believe it's theoretically possible for alternative universes to exist, but I don't think they do.
 
Upvote 0

dad

Undefeated!
Site Supporter
Jan 17, 2005
44,905
1,259
✟25,524.00
Country
Canada
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
There's a bit of a difference between joining a nation's military and joining a terrorist group that is out to kill people first and foremost.
That depends who controls the forces. Right now there in an anti Christ regime in the US. Some say they even were instrumental in helping the Islamist terrorists form. Certainly the drone terror and wiping out whole countries is not a Christian endeavor either.

Hitler's forces were the same and all other countries also. That doesn't make them Christian.
Joining a terrorist group that worships Satan with the express purpose to kill everybody who doesn't agree with you, however, is wholly evil.
?? The Islamists worship Satan now?
Does that mean your military can drone rocket bomb weddings and funerals as desired?
So you tell me, which religion is evil and which is good?
Only Jesus is good.
The one who says "Kill everybody who doesn't agree with us" or the one that says "Love everybody, including your enemies as you love yourselves" and "Pray for those who would use you deceitfully"?
The US military doesn't say that.
 
Upvote 0

dad

Undefeated!
Site Supporter
Jan 17, 2005
44,905
1,259
✟25,524.00
Country
Canada
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Maybe in your mind it is, but to Stephen Hawking, it is not
. Who cares what it seems like in his mind since he could never try it or prove it?
Personally, I believe it's theoretically possible for alternative universes to exist, but I don't think they do.
Only what God created exists.
 
Upvote 0

timewerx

the village i--o--t--
Aug 31, 2012
16,918
6,403
✟379,843.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian Seeker
Marital Status
Single
No. The parallax measure is trashed because you do not know that time exists where the stars are, or that it exists the same as here. Think about it. Without time a light year is not a year at all.

"Solar" flares has been observed taking place on other stars.

http://www.universetoday.com/910/killer-solar-flare-on-another-star/

Had there been significant difference in the passage of time against ours, the astronomers would have noted significant "red" or "blue" shifting of the phenomenon as well as unusually slow or unusually fast progression of the event but we heard none.

So we actually have proof that time progresses normally in other stars. Thus, estimates of stellar distances would be fairly adequate for illustration purposes and further studies but obviously not accurate enough to send a ballistic probe hitting/colliding with a specifically targeted distant star, a close approach may be possible though with our current data.
 
Upvote 0

Archaeopteryx

Wanderer
Jul 1, 2007
22,229
2,608
✟78,240.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
You would expect people to be judged for denying what is true, wouldn't you? After all, its the denial of truth that gets a lot people into trouble, especially denying truth over a long period of time.
You haven't established this "truth" as true.
 
Upvote 0

Larniavc

"Larniavc sir, how are you so smart?"
Jul 14, 2015
15,339
9,350
52
✟396,935.00
Country
United Kingdom
Gender
Male
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
UK-Liberal-Democrats

Psychology uses the scientific method. Or it did when I studied it to post graduate level.
 
Upvote 0

Chriliman

Everything I need to be joyful is right here
May 22, 2015
5,895
569
✟173,201.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
You haven't established this "truth" as true.

That doesn't change the fact that one would expect someone to be judged for denying the truth. Can you at least agree that truth has meaning and is important in keeping justice?
 
Upvote 0

Poor Beggar

Everything is everywhere.
Aug 21, 2015
565
265
47
Arizona
✟24,600.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Psychology uses the scientific method. Or it did when I studied it to post graduate level.
It attempts to. Our postmodern culture simply assumes we can measure constructs the way we can measure actual things. The amount of math we go through trying to represent those hise constructs in a study resembles s Rube Goldberg device. Science is s process for observable phdnomena. Start measuring constructs and you're going to have limited success with application and replication.
 
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.