Doubt In The Context of Faith

[MonstersvsMartyrs]

Well-80% of studies are false, says one study. And I'm not even joking. That was a real peer reviewed finding. Look it up. I guess it's just a matter of who you are going to put your faith in.

 

[Everybodyknows]

Then why did He choose Albert Einstein to head up the great developments in physics and so on - a man who studied physics and maths etc. in order to know more about God whom he did not seem to know personally ?

How has physics told us anything about God?

 

[JoeP222w]

1. Inefficacy of (Intercessory) Prayer
Studies have shown that intercessory prayer doesn’t work. The Bible says it does – Jesus says it does! – but it doesn’t. It doesn’t have better outcomes for sick people, or make you more likely to succeed in your goals, or anything! We’re supposed to be able to move mountains and be immune to snake venom, but people who truly believe they’re safe still die from Christian snake-charming.

Why would a God who exists and loves us and is all-powerful say that He’ll help us, and then turn out to not do anything at all?

What is your measurement for how God answers prayer? What timeline is your expectation? Where in the Bible does it say that all Christians everywhere will be safe playing with venomous snakes (which is putting the Lord God to the test, by the way, that which we are not to do)? When Paul was bitten by an asp, he was not playing with it, trying to "charm" it or trying to tempt God. Why do you believe that God is obligated to man?

2. Why sin/evil/etc? God can do anything, so why this?
Here’s the thing: this is not the best possible world, with or without Eve’s fruit of the knowledge of good and evil. If God is all powerful, why doesn’t He just make it so that whatever makes us have to go to Hell isn’t necessary in the first place? Not just believers: everyone.

God is just and righteous. He uses means to display His glory. God is also grace and mercy. If God used His power to have never allowed evil, He would never demonstrated His justice and righteousness and His grace, mercy and love would be absolutely meaningless. And if God saved everyone, then Jesus sacrifice on the cross was completely pointless.

A good God couldn’t possibly want all of those people to go to Hell, right?

Because God is good, He must hate and punish sin. Because God is good, that should be the most terrifying thing that anyone who is not in Christ will ever hear, because man is not good by any measure, in and of himself.

There’s the argument that God did exactly that through Jesus, but why? Why would he do that when Jesus’s resurrection happened 2,000 years ago (give or take), and we don’t have any solid evidence that the actual miracle of the resurrection (or any other miracles) happened?

Jesus perfectly demonstrated the justice, righteousness, grace and mercy of God through means.

And we do have solid evidence, you simply choose to reject it: more than 500 eye witnesses and the Bible, the most authentic document of ancient history.

I mean, if God is real, shouldn’t there be a lot more hard evidence?

You choose to blind yourself to the evidence that is all around you.

3. Dead Babies:
Everything that happens is God’s will, or can be made to fit His will, right? So how do dead babies make any [staff edit] sense? Babies don’t sin, and their lives aren’t object lessons.

This is called the Pelagian heresy, the denial that all mankind is born into sin. Babies are born with a sin nature. Your assumption is wrong.

4. Why doesn’t God communicate with us in ways that are more sensible and direct?
I mean, His presence is everywhere and all, but why doesn’t He find undeniable ways to show us that He is God? More of the clouds opening with a loud accompanying voice, less of the “communicating with us through our consciences” stuff.

He has through His inerrant and all sufficient word of the Bible.

I mean, His presence is supposed to be implicit, but it’s not. And even if it were – why couldn’t it be more obvious? Why would the subtlety even be necessry?

You are working from a false presupposition. God has made His presence known, you are choosing to suppress it.

Heaven is a big deal in the Bible. Miracles are a big deal in the Bible. But in my own life, and looking at scientific evidence and (not necessarily scientific) well-recorded data, there’s nothing that seems to indicate either one. Few modern-day miracle stories even do anything to prove YHWH, much less the resurrection.

Science is naturalistic and has no explanation for the supernatural. The are many modern day events that claim to be "miracles" that simply are not. However, the miracles described in the Bible are true, though you reject them.

5. Why are all of the arguments used to “prove” Christianity also used to prove basically every other religion?
You can apply them to Islam, to Buddhism, to Hinduism… it’s just the same kind of thinking, the same kind of excuses that don’t quite seem to work, over and over again.

This is simply a fallacious assertion, with no evidence to back it up. No other religion on earth shares the unique claims of Christianity. Not one. Islam, Buddhism and Hinduism have no Savior. Buddhism and Hinduism is Polytheistic. Islam is Deistic. To say that they have the same claims as Christianity demonstrates you have little concern for the truth or little knowledge of Christianity or those other religions.

If Christianity is true, and God is real and watching over us, and there is a heaven… why are we using the same logic, reasoning, excuses and cop-outs as everyone else is? Why do we need to?

The way humans use or abuse knowledge in no way nullifies the truth of God.

---------------------
If you truly have the doubts above and as you wrote, you think that they are rational, I am concerned that you have really not come to even begin to understand Christianity in the first place or if you ever were a Christian. However, it is possible to have doubts for the Christian, and if your questions are genuinely seeking the answers, it is good that you ask, but as you seek out answers, and if you do not see that those questions you pose are not refutable, I don't know that you are seeking truth.

 

[Hieronymus]

How has physics told us anything about God?

Well, how else would you explain a fine tuned universe?

 

[Norbert L]

I've been having a lot of doubts in my faith for the past few months. Not the kind that can be easily dismissed, but actual, relatively rational thoughts.

I haven't really been able to talk to anyone about them, since no one in my family is a Christian and neither are any of my friends (online or off). So I'm wondering: how do y'all deal with doubt?

If anyone's interested, my specific concerns in the doubt are:

1. Inefficacy of (Intercessory) Prayer
Studies have shown that intercessory prayer doesn’t work. The Bible says it does – Jesus says it does! – but it doesn’t. It doesn’t have better outcomes for sick people, or make you more likely to succeed in your goals, or anything! We’re supposed to be able to move mountains and be immune to snake venom, but people who truly believe they’re safe still die from Christian snake-charming.

Why would a God who exists and loves us and is all-powerful say that He’ll help us, and then turn out to not do anything at all?

2. Why sin/evil/etc? God can do anything, so why this?
Here’s the thing: this is not the best possible world, with or without Eve’s fruit of the knowledge of good and evil. If God is all powerful, why doesn’t He just make it so that whatever makes us have to go to Hell isn’t necessary in the first place? Not just believers: everyone.

A good God couldn’t possibly want all of those people to go to Hell, right?

There’s the argument that God did exactly that through Jesus, but why? Why would he do that when Jesus’s resurrection happened 2,000 years ago (give or take), and we don’t have any solid evidence that the actual miracle of the resurrection (or any other miracles) happened?

I mean, if God is real, shouldn’t there be a lot more hard evidence?

3. Dead Babies:
Everything that happens is God’s will, or can be made to fit His will, right? So how do dead babies make any [staff edit] sense? Babies don’t sin, and their lives aren’t object lessons.

4. Why doesn’t God communicate with us in ways that are more sensible and direct?
I mean, His presence is everywhere and all, but why doesn’t He find undeniable ways to show us that He is God? More of the clouds opening with a loud accompanying voice, less of the “communicating with us through our consciences” stuff.

I mean, His presence is supposed to be implicit, but it’s not. And even if it were – why couldn’t it be more obvious? Why would the subtlety even be necessry?

Heaven is a big deal in the Bible. Miracles are a big deal in the Bible. But in my own life, and looking at scientific evidence and (not necessarily scientific) well-recorded data, there’s nothing that seems to indicate either one. Few modern-day miracle stories even do anything to prove YHWH, much less the resurrection.

5. Why are all of the arguments used to “prove” Christianity also used to prove basically every other religion?
You can apply them to Islam, to Buddhism, to Hinduism… it’s just the same kind of thinking, the same kind of excuses that don’t quite seem to work, over and over again.

If Christianity is true, and God is real and watching over us, and there is a heaven… why are we using the same logic, reasoning, excuses and cop-outs as everyone else is? Why do we need to?

Just a couple of thoughts.

Taking the study of prayer at face value, what other reasons can there be for the results? It could just as well indicate that there is a problem with numerous Christians James 4:3.

I wish #2 would also happen with the snap of God's fingers, the closest indication I see of this is Philippians 2:13 coupled with enduring to the end. I think the bottom line is learn to take responsibility for yourself.

Where's the injustice for "Ecclesiastes 12:7". Look at the response by people towards king king David when his child died and his answer 2 Samuel 12:21-23. If there's any kind of answer there, it's God is not always graceful and people don't always get what they want from Him. It also may very well be that such an answer may also be what they need. It's not as if life in general doesn't have its' adversity stories where those who face it tell others of learning the lesson of becoming a better person.

#4 was tried and had rather mixed results for the Jews. Do you really think that if God descended on this world, people will believe and follow Him? Or will you just have more Cain's, Korah's and Balaams popping up? And what about people looking for miracles, what's there inner motivation for a miracle? John 6:26

In my view one of the biggest problems for a Christian to face is how to understand and define "good" and "love" for mankind as a group and as an individual. There's an interesting question in the book of Job 40:8

 

[AlexDTX]

So you dismiss the at least basic argument for a Creator /designer from the order of everything in the universe .
We need to begin with this quote from Romans 1:20 "Since the creation of the world God's invisible attributes ,namely His eternal power ,and Divine nature...so that we are without excuse ..."
And then we need to expand with whatever is neccessary to (physics etc more and more show
God's amazing detail ) help those with rarional minds to come to know Him personally and not dismiss them .

It looks like you are commenting on my last statement. Romans 1:20 is not about using creation to argue for the existence of God. It is saying everyone already knows of the existence of God from creation and they are rejecting that knowledge with their foolish hearts already darkened. No one is convinced to be come a Christian by rational arguments to the mind. They are convinced when rational statements bring epiphanies into the heart, and this was my point. And those epiphanies only lighten the soul when the Holy Spirit illuminates those statements. Only God knows what is needed to unlock a hardened heart, and statements that are led by the Spirit are the ones He uses.

I heard the story of a man who was sharing the Gospel with a Muslim. The Holy Spirit prompted him to read Psalms 119. He thought that was a strange portion of the Bible to use as a testimony. But the Muslim told him that reading of how God's word was so orderly convinced him that the Bible was true.

This is what I am talking about.

 

[PeaceJoyLove]

We’re supposed to be able to move mountains and be immune to snake venom, but people who truly believe they’re safe still die from Christian snake-charming.

The whole of The Bible is the narrative of our soul's journey/process taking place within of coming to KNOW the son through the Son. A picture of which can be seen in the wandering between two mountains in the desert/wilderness, or a snake in the garden. Our measure of faith can move those mountains and remove the serpent from our garden, narrowing the Truth of who we are down to ONE, duality within gone. The spiritual truth of Heaven cannot be found by observation (an over here or over there) for it is within/in our midst like two trees in a garden.

If God is all powerful, why doesn’t He just make it so that whatever makes us have to go to Hell isn’t necessary in the first place?

Though hell be real, it is a spiritual place within, too. Though many perceive as a literal place in a far off place one might go to when their physical body dies. Spiritual death happened to Adam in the garden and Christ is The Way/The Door (back) to being reconciled to the Father and entering into Heaven (within)...

4. Why doesn’t God communicate with us in ways that are more sensible and direct?
I mean, His presence is everywhere and all, but why doesn’t He find undeniable ways to show us that He is God? More of the clouds opening with a loud accompanying voice, less of the “communicating with us through our consciences” stuff.

God's glory fills the whole earth...whether we can 'see' it or not. The process taking place within is awakening us to the Truth of who God is and who we are ...that we might KNOW as fully as we have always been known by HIM. Until our eye becomes single/blind that we might see, we observe with our five senses and not HIS spirit alive within. The clouds are in our mind blocking the 'view', the hearing that is not by ear and seeing not by the eye...If we believe His promises to be true they come to pass for He can only give us what we hope for to be possible.

Miracles are a big deal in the Bible. But in my own life, and looking at scientific evidence and (not necessarily scientific) well-recorded data, there’s nothing that seems to indicate either one. Few modern-day miracle stories even do anything to prove YHWH, much less the resurrection.

My Life (in Him and HIM in me) is a miracle. Amazingly wonderful things HE has revealed to me in spirit and in Truth, lifting me above the world though I still be in it (not of it)...HE will give us what we seek and ask for with all our heart, mind and strength. Pounding on The Door, HE will open...and only the spirit can perceive, not the five senses...

If Christianity is true, and God is real and watching over us, and there is a heaven… why are we using the same logic, reasoning, excuses and cop-outs as everyone else is? Why do we need to?

God and Christ are true. Our own mind and thoughts lead us away from truth for we cannot reason with ourself and come to the Truth...On the other hand...no one can reason with God without becoming clean. When our reality does not reflect what we read/see in scripture, we must never twist scripture to make it fit...we cry out to God and ask Him why and to reveal it. He will. I KNOW. Remember...Jesus said the Kingdom is with in you...and Apostle Paul said the mystery hidden through ages being revealed...Christ IN YOU, the hope of glory.

Seek and ye shall find it to be Truth.

 

[Dave G.]

I kind of like the word picture of moving mountains within. Good stuff !

 

[Greg Merrill]

First of all, I am glad, for whatever reason, that I have never been troubled by an abundance of doubts about God. My grandmother led me to the Lord at age 6. She had a faith so great, that her pastor would say he would always ask her to pray for him when he was flying, because then, even if the wings fell off things would still be OK. I didn't start going to church until I was 19, but have gone ever since (accept one year when I couldn't find a good one), some 45 years. I also have usually had some type of ministry, and not just attending. Along with this I have been a daily reader of the Bible. I will write more, but for now, see that these things I have just written (Christian fellowship and Bible reading) have been my foundation for not being plagued by doubts.

 

[ToBeLoved]

First of all, I am glad, for whatever reason, that I have never been troubled by an abundance of doubts about God. My grandmother led me to the Lord at age 6. She had a faith so great, that her pastor would say he would always ask her to pray for him when he was flying, because then, even if the wings fell off things would still be OK. I didn't start going to church until I was 19, but have gone ever since (accept one year when I couldn't find a good one), some 45 years. I also have usually had some type of ministry, and not just attending. Along with this I have been a daily reader of the Bible. I will write more, but for now, see that these things I have just written (Christian fellowship and Bible reading) have been my foundation for not being plagued by doubts.

I agree. Reading the Bible and knowing what God promises and gives us is the strongest foundation. It has kept me strong all these years.

 

[Greg Merrill]

Continuing my response, "Faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the Word of God." Romans 10:17. The "proper" study of the Word alone is sufficient to live a life of faith, victorious over doubt. "Proper"? As a believer. Filled with the Spirit. Interacting with God. Daily. Reading all of it (2 Timothy 3:16-17; Acts 20:27; Luke 24:27; 2 Timothy 2:15). It is also helpful to read "good" commentaries on the Bible, which can help people understand those difficult passages, and clear up skepticism, doubt, and misunderstanding. When past doubts are kept in mind, and what satisfactory answers were given to totally clear them up, this can be used to greatly strength one's faith and confidence in God's written Word.

 

[Greg Merrill]

Continuing: For a person like you, I would suggest you also get some good study materials on apologetics. These will help you build up your faith. Now if you want to tear down your faith, study the words of atheists now. If you want to build up your faith, study those people that have strong faith, and better learn the Bible, and study apologetics, and seek to believe God and grow spiritually. Once you do that, and have built a solid spiritual foundation you can THEN study the teachings of atheists all you want, for you will be strong enough for it not to deceive you or create any doubts in your mind and spirit.

 

[Greg Merrill]

Continuing: You ask (as if it were a terrible thing) Why does God allow babies to die? There are two good reasons for this. 1. Man has chosen to disobey God, and do things his own way. Therefore we have not paradise, but a world that has been infected by sin, which has brought death into this world, and has received a curse. We can see by all the terrible things in the world what results when God is rejected, and man selfishly tries to run things instead. 2. Dead babies don't go to a fictional Limbo or Purgatory, but to a real Heaven. Only they, and those that never reach a mental level to be able to comprehend right and wrong, have this great privilege. Most people grow up and remain heathens, not followers of the true God, and the receivers of the only Savior God provides, Jesus, and therefore go to hell. Dead babies going to heaven, in light of this, is a great thing because of the grace of God.

 

[Greg Merrill]

Continuing: Failure of intercessory prayer. Prayer fails to do what is intended because people don't follow God's written instructions concerning it, or meet the standards for it to succeed. They may think they are, when they really aren't. They they erroneously come to the idea that prayer doesn't work at all. Someone like me could come to the erroneous idea that a fishing pole is not of much help in catching fish. I may think I know what I am doing, when I really don't. I am not a good, knowledgeable fisherman. But put that pole in the hands of one who is, and they will take it to the right place, with the right bait and other helps, having the right knowledge and the right successful past experience, and they will prove that a fishing pole can be a great tool in catching fish. With the right research, or with that and having an expert fisherman spend enough time to teach me, I also could become a great fisherman. The same relates to prayer.

 

[Greg Merrill]

Continuing intercessory prayer. Study the life of George Mueller, and you will find that he already proved that "proper" prayer works (after he discovered that improper prayer doesn't). I have read of medical studies testing prayer that did work. Then there are the studies you speak of that say it didn't. The results being different would depend on how the study was conducted, and what was involved in the study. Get a bunch of people together that really don't know how to fish, and by studying them you might come to the conclusion that fishing poles really aren't much good in catching fish. Get a bunch of expert fisherman together and you will get a different conclusion.

 

[RisenInJesus]

So, if the twelve apostles preached to the Jews, why didn't the Jews become Christians? It's remarkable how Paul, a single person, managed to create a religion of almost 2 and a half billion followers, but the other apostles couldn't convince a few hundred thousand Jews.

For the most part, all the first Christians and congregations of believers were Jews.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

I've been having a lot of doubts in my faith for the past few months. Not the kind that can be easily dismissed, but actual, relatively rational thoughts.

I haven't really been able to talk to anyone about them, since no one in my family is a Christian and neither are any of my friends (online or off). So I'm wondering: how do y'all deal with doubt?

If anyone's interested, my specific concerns in the doubt are:

1. Inefficacy of (Intercessory) Prayer
Studies have shown that intercessory prayer doesn’t work. The Bible says it does – Jesus says it does! – but it doesn’t. It doesn’t have better outcomes for sick people, or make you more likely to succeed in your goals, or anything! We’re supposed to be able to move mountains and be immune to snake venom, but people who truly believe they’re safe still die from Christian snake-charming.

Why would a God who exists and loves us and is all-powerful say that He’ll help us, and then turn out to not do anything at all?

2. Why sin/evil/etc? God can do anything, so why this?
Here’s the thing: this is not the best possible world, with or without Eve’s fruit of the knowledge of good and evil. If God is all powerful, why doesn’t He just make it so that whatever makes us have to go to Hell isn’t necessary in the first place? Not just believers: everyone.

A good God couldn’t possibly want all of those people to go to Hell, right?

There’s the argument that God did exactly that through Jesus, but why? Why would he do that when Jesus’s resurrection happened 2,000 years ago (give or take), and we don’t have any solid evidence that the actual miracle of the resurrection (or any other miracles) happened?

I mean, if God is real, shouldn’t there be a lot more hard evidence?

3. Dead Babies:
Everything that happens is God’s will, or can be made to fit His will, right? So how do dead babies make any damn sense? Babies don’t sin, and their lives aren’t object lessons.

4. Why doesn’t God communicate with us in ways that are more sensible and direct?
I mean, His presence is everywhere and all, but why doesn’t He find undeniable ways to show us that He is God? More of the clouds opening with a loud accompanying voice, less of the “communicating with us through our consciences” stuff.

I mean, His presence is supposed to be implicit, but it’s not. And even if it were – why couldn’t it be more obvious? Why would the subtlety even be necessry?

Heaven is a big deal in the Bible. Miracles are a big deal in the Bible. But in my own life, and looking at scientific evidence and (not necessarily scientific) well-recorded data, there’s nothing that seems to indicate either one. Few modern-day miracle stories even do anything to prove YHWH, much less the resurrection.

5. Why are all of the arguments used to “prove” Christianity also used to prove basically every other religion?
You can apply them to Islam, to Buddhism, to Hinduism… it’s just the same kind of thinking, the same kind of excuses that don’t quite seem to work, over and over again.

If Christianity is true, and God is real and watching over us, and there is a heaven… why are we using the same logic, reasoning, excuses and cop-outs as everyone else is? Why do we need to?

Hi Audacious,

How do I deal with doubt? I wrestle it to the ground by using logic, reasoning, excuses and cop-outs that many others aren't using. And I do this until my doubt cries, "Uncle!!!" [Man, I'm mean...]

 

[HeLeadethMe]

I've been having a lot of doubts in my faith for the past few months. Not the kind that can be easily dismissed, but actual, relatively rational thoughts.

I haven't really been able to talk to anyone about them, since no one in my family is a Christian and neither are any of my friends (online or off). So I'm wondering: how do y'all deal with doubt?

If anyone's interested, my specific concerns in the doubt are:

1. Inefficacy of (Intercessory) Prayer
Studies have shown that intercessory prayer doesn’t work. The Bible says it does – Jesus says it does! – but it doesn’t. It doesn’t have better outcomes for sick people, or make you more likely to succeed in your goals, or anything! We’re supposed to be able to move mountains and be immune to snake venom, but people who truly believe they’re safe still die from Christian snake-charming.

Why would a God who exists and loves us and is all-powerful say that He’ll help us, and then turn out to not do anything at all?

2. Why sin/evil/etc? God can do anything, so why this?
Here’s the thing: this is not the best possible world, with or without Eve’s fruit of the knowledge of good and evil. If God is all powerful, why doesn’t He just make it so that whatever makes us have to go to Hell isn’t necessary in the first place? Not just believers: everyone.

A good God couldn’t possibly want all of those people to go to Hell, right?

There’s the argument that God did exactly that through Jesus, but why? Why would he do that when Jesus’s resurrection happened 2,000 years ago (give or take), and we don’t have any solid evidence that the actual miracle of the resurrection (or any other miracles) happened?

I mean, if God is real, shouldn’t there be a lot more hard evidence?

3. Dead Babies:
Everything that happens is God’s will, or can be made to fit His will, right? So how do dead babies make any [staff edit] sense? Babies don’t sin, and their lives aren’t object lessons.

4. Why doesn’t God communicate with us in ways that are more sensible and direct?
I mean, His presence is everywhere and all, but why doesn’t He find undeniable ways to show us that He is God? More of the clouds opening with a loud accompanying voice, less of the “communicating with us through our consciences” stuff.

I mean, His presence is supposed to be implicit, but it’s not. And even if it were – why couldn’t it be more obvious? Why would the subtlety even be necessry?

Heaven is a big deal in the Bible. Miracles are a big deal in the Bible. But in my own life, and looking at scientific evidence and (not necessarily scientific) well-recorded data, there’s nothing that seems to indicate either one. Few modern-day miracle stories even do anything to prove YHWH, much less the resurrection.

5. Why are all of the arguments used to “prove” Christianity also used to prove basically every other religion?
You can apply them to Islam, to Buddhism, to Hinduism… it’s just the same kind of thinking, the same kind of excuses that don’t quite seem to work, over and over again.

If Christianity is true, and God is real and watching over us, and there is a heaven… why are we using the same logic, reasoning, excuses and cop-outs as everyone else is? Why do we need to?

Jesus said the kingdom of heaven comes not with our careful observation..............ie, it can't be measured or quantified, it can't be seen with our natural eyes or perceived by our natural reasoning. It can only be perceived in spirit after the Holy Spirit comes to indwell the believer when he/she receives Christ by faith (ie, in spirit, by the spirit). Because only the Spirit of God perceives and knows the mind of God.

If you are not born again, you need to seek the Lord for the new birth, it is necessary to not only perceive but enter the kingdom of heaven. If you have been born of the spirit, then please be strongly encouraged to make a decision to stop feeding your doubts and feed your faith instead, because the bible says if you sow to the flesh you will reap destruction, but if you sow to the spirit, from the spirit you will reap eternal life......it's a very serious matter and I know someone who completely backslid and lost their faith because of feeding their mind with the reasonings of unbelievers.

 

[AmberB]

Continuing: Failure of intercessory prayer. Prayer fails to do what is intended because people don't follow God's written instructions concerning it, or meet the standards for it to succeed.

How do you pray correctly? What standard is there? I genuinely want to know, because I think I'm struggling with this.

 

[RisenInJesus]

How do you pray correctly? What standard is there? I genuinely want to know, because I think I'm struggling with this.

I believe prayer is simply and sincerely talking to God; thanking Him, giving Him praise for who He is, His love and eternal life, and blessings of this life, sharing with Him concerns and requests for others and oneself with a desire for His perfect will in all situations.