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Don't know what to call this: marriage question

dallasapple

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I'm entitled to my opinion and you're entitled to yours. *shrug*

So long as you state it as an opinion after my post that "her kids will never want to go anywhere with them" thats fine.You stated it as if it was a definite that will happen..As well as the 'further embarrasement"..

For all YOU know or I know or anyone knows they are already DESENSITISED to this which eventually WILL happen..I grew up with parents that fought...not in public but at home..after so many years ..we just "assumed' it was normal..We didnt like it..but it was business as usual..We thought thats how everyone acted.They also did the whole "we are a happy family" in public..that is NOT good for children ..Jane mentioned that if felt fake in church.it probably feels "fake" to the kids..or they will assume its how EVERYONE acts...

If she takes a stand AGAINST it..she will teach them..this ISNT O.K..this ISNT how you should allow anyone to treat you period..embarrassed or not embarrased..As well as Jane is a sensitive and caring mother..Im sure she can explain to them..and apologize it had to come to that..

Its a hell of a lot less drastic/traumatic than a separation OR allowing this to happen over and over again.... and it could work .

Dallas
 
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BigDaddy4

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I am reading "Love must be Tough" by Dr. Dobson that was suggested on another thread. It is an interesting read and maybe something Jane should consider reading.

Although, I sense a fear of leaving on her part. That is something that should probably be overcome if she is to get serious about dealing with this behavior.

Just my 2 cents worth...
 
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dallasapple

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I won't be leaving my husband. Period. It's not fear of leaving - it's simply that I'm not going to do it.

I haven't had much time to post this past couple of days but I will catch up! Thank you everyone for your thoughts.

See you soon! :wave::wave::wave::wave::wave:

(and P.S...I understand the "simply not going to do it" )

Dallas
 
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Athene

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I certainly don't advocate "standing there and taking it". I didn't in my previous marriage. But, matching his antics with antics of her own wouldn't accomplish anything but further embarrassment for all of them. JMHO

She's already embarrassed by him swearing at her in public, what is suggested is that she engage him in a non-hostile way, that would make her point and would reflect embarrassment back to him. He doesn't care that his swearing makes him look bad, abusive behaviour back won't do anything but escalate the situation. OTOH putting a bag over her head, pulling out a sign etc would make him feel embarrassed too thus decreasing the likelihood of him verbally abusing her in public.
 
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JaneFW

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We did go on Wednesday night to talk it all out. It wasn't great but one thing I did say is that the shouting/cursing/humiliation is over. Done with. He's not doing that any more. I didn't give any consequences, but he understood that it was an ultimatum of a kind. He said "okay". We went over what happened that day, and he still thought he was in the right to be angry, and I agreed that everyone has the right to be angry, it's just the way that he reacts when he's angry. That's the problem. I get angry too but I don't scream at him. I gave him a verbal image of how it would be if I berated him in front of the boys, and he seemed to absorb that. I told him that it was abusive behavior, and he didn't argue. I reminded him that the boys are learning from him how to be husbands, and how will he feel in 10 years, if he's sitting there listening to his sons scream at their wives.
I wish I could do some of those things like have a notice that says something on it, lol. That hit my funny bone. However, I know from experience that something like that would only up the ante. He would just get madder, he wouldn't get embarassed, because then I would be humiliating him in front of other people. Same thing for doing a "talk to the hand". I have in the past walked away, just gone to another part of the house, but of course his voice follows me - berating me all the way, and getting angrier saying "so you don't have to talk to me now?" Ugh.

I know he has a lot of stress. He hates his new job - although he should be able to switch over to a better job in December, when his 6 months probation period is over. He has a lot of pain from his head and neck, which he has had since before his hearing loss, but which has worsened. The doctors have never been able to find the source.

This is all fine, and I feel for him, but his outbursts pre-date this job, and when I first met him, he didn't have these health problems, but the anger was still there. I was foolish enough to think it would change.

I think that all I can do is, when it happens again, just quietly remind him that he isn't going to do it any more. I can't walk on eggshells, which seems to be his suggestion - "just don't annoy me" - I mean .. who knows what annoys him today and what annoys him tomorrow? He needs to be responsible for his reactions and the extremeness (not a word, lol) of them. No swearing. No shouting. No pulling me or "marriage" in general down. That would be good. That would be a HUGE improvement.
 
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mkgal1

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I'm so glad to hear that the two of you were able to discuss this, and that it seems that he absorbed what you said, instead of arguing with you. That really sounds like a step in the right direction. The tone of your post is very compassionate and I pray that he senses that love (from what you posted, it sounds like it).

Dallas's thread sort of has me thinking along the lines of fear and anger. I wonder if you asked him about his fears, if that would give you more insight? It may even give *him* insight too. If the anger is based on fear the reactive anger may be masking that fear. Digging it up may help to resolve the *real* issue.
 
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chaz345

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I'm so glad to hear that the two of you were able to discuss this, and that it seems that he absorbed what you said, instead of arguing with you. That really sounds like a step in the right direction. The tone of your post is very compassionate and I pray that he senses that love (from what you posted, it sounds like it).

Dallas's thread sort of has me thinking along the lines of fear and anger. I wonder if you asked him about his fears, if that would give you more insight? It may even give *him* insight too. If the anger is based on fear the reactive anger may be masking that fear. Digging it up may help to resolve the *real* issue.

Almost all anger is based in fear of some sort. And I absolutely agree that trying to explore his fears may help get to the root of his anger. Only knowing the little I do of the situation, I'd suspect the root fear is connected to his hearing loss in some way. Jane I know you said he was in the military, was the hearing loss the result of being in combat? Even if not if he's ever been in combat, I'd strongly suspect some form of PTSD as being a contributor to his fear/anger.
 
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chaz345

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Dallas's thread sort of has me thinking along the lines of fear and anger.
General semi-off topic comment on this. I've always said that abusive/controlling/angry behavior is usually rooted in fear or some other brokeness in the one doing it.
 
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JaneFW

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Yes, he was in combat. He was a part of the Mogadishu "situation" and also was in Africa and Serbia for various conflicts. He has referred obliquely to what he has seen and "done", and I have suggested he get counseling, but he doesn't want to. I did finally suggest to him that he have his testosterone checked (he confirmed that he has problems with getting going with tasks, which really does frustrate me because he has promised so many things and then not followed through.) In the first instance, I really want him to go to the doctor again and talk to him about these things. Unfortunately, the clinic that we belong to (for military retirees and dependents) has three absolutely terrible doctors - old fogies to a man! We can't change to a civilian provider (we've tried) and I think okay, so how can you help an an apathetic person get help for their apathy? It's quite the conundrum.
 
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chaz345

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Yes, he was in combat. He was a part of the Mogadishu "situation" and also was in Africa and Serbia for various conflicts. He has referred obliquely to what he has seen and "done", and I have suggested he get counseling, but he doesn't want to. I did finally suggest to him that he have his testosterone checked (he confirmed that he has problems with getting going with tasks, which really does frustrate me because he has promised so many things and then not followed through.) In the first instance, I really want him to go to the doctor again and talk to him about these things. Unfortunately, the clinic that we belong to (for military retirees and dependents) has three absolutely terrible doctors - old fogies to a man! We can't change to a civilian provider (we've tried) and I think okay, so how can you help an an apathetic person get help for their apathy? It's quite the conundrum.

I'm not in any way a professional but I'd suspect that most of his anger/controlling issues are related to some form of PTSD. Don't know how to get him to get help if he doesn't want it though. I've got a recent friend that has PTSD and has a local organization to help other vets with it. I'll ask him if he's got any suggestions for what to do with someone who needs that help but won't get it. Will be sometime next week before I can talk to him though. If you can, send me a PM Sat evening or Sun morning to remind me to talk to him.
 
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mkgal1

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General semi-off topic comment on this. I've always said that abusive/controlling/angry behavior is usually rooted in fear or some other brokeness in the one doing it.
I started a new thread. I agree that abusive/controlling/angry behavior is usually rooted in fear or some other brokenness.
 
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JaneFW

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I'm not in any way a professional but I'd suspect that most of his anger/controlling issues are related to some form of PTSD. Don't know how to get him to get help if he doesn't want it though. I've got a recent friend that has PTSD and has a local organization to help other vets with it. I'll ask him if he's got any suggestions for what to do with someone who needs that help but won't get it. Will be sometime next week before I can talk to him though. If you can, send me a PM Sat evening or Sun morning to remind me to talk to him.
Okay, thanks Chaz. Let's hope I remember to remind you!!
 
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FaithPrevails

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Yes, he was in combat. He was a part of the Mogadishu "situation" and also was in Africa and Serbia for various conflicts. He has referred obliquely to what he has seen and "done", and I have suggested he get counseling, but he doesn't want to. I did finally suggest to him that he have his testosterone checked (he confirmed that he has problems with getting going with tasks, which really does frustrate me because he has promised so many things and then not followed through.) In the first instance, I really want him to go to the doctor again and talk to him about these things. Unfortunately, the clinic that we belong to (for military retirees and dependents) has three absolutely terrible doctors - old fogies to a man! We can't change to a civilian provider (we've tried) and I think okay, so how can you help an an apathetic person get help for their apathy? It's quite the conundrum.

My dad, grandpa, BIL, and husband are all veterans who served during active war time. None of them will really open up about their experiences. DH shared one heartbreaking story with me just before our DD was born. Being able to talk about it helped him come to terms with it to a degree, but I know there is a lot more that he hasn't shared.

My hubby lives with chronic pain, too, due to service-related injuries and has quite a difficult time with the VA getting treatment and services. Part of the the reason why he has a hard time is b/c he isn't a very pleasant patient to deal with. I have told him more than once that I wouldn't like him either if he talked to me the way he talks to doctors and nurses/medical staff. lol

The difficulty starting tasks could be more depression related. Situational depression due to the job situation or depression related to the chronic pain.
 
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BigDaddy4

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I won't be leaving my husband. Period. It's not fear of leaving - it's simply that I'm not going to do it.

I haven't had much time to post this past couple of days but I will catch up! Thank you everyone for your thoughts.


By leaving I wasn't indicating leaving him permanently. Some of your posts seemed to indicate that you didn't want to leave the situation, even for a few hours or days or however long it would take. Just my opinion though, fwiw... :)

I am praying that things will improve and that God will walk you through it whatever you decide to do.
 
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mkgal1

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I don't even WANT to try to imagine what horrifying things our military has seen. They are exposed to a whole different *world*, and I would think it's sort of like going from the innocence that Adam and Eve had to their being exposed to sin. It changes things. It gives the appearance that evil is in control and that has got to incite fear. The only remedy I can think of that is strong enough to offset that fear is KNOWING in your gut that God is in control, if we allow Him to be.
 
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