Does The Third Temple...

[Shocker]

For contrast..

Revelation 3:3
3 Remember therefore how you have received and heard; hold fast and repent. Therefore if you will not watch, I will come upon you as a thief, and you will not know what hour I will come upon you.

I think that is called a parallel.

 

[Aijalon]

The Lord comes as a thief only applies to the way in which he comes against those who are his enemies. The strongman is his enemy, therefore he is a thief to the strongman.

The Saints are not the same, they are watching and ready, therefore the Lord does not come on them as a thief, he comes when they are ready - they are the five wise virgins. They are EXPECTING HIM.

People who make it out that we're basically clueless as to when he will be coming back are tainting the words of the Lord, who instructed us to be ready. We will not be suprised, if we are surprised it means we're spiritually dead!

 

[Shocker]

The Lord comes as a thief only applies to the way in which he comes against those who are his enemies. The strongman is his enemy, therefore he is a thief to the strongman.

The Saints are not the same, they are watching and ready, therefore the Lord does not come on them as a thief, he comes when they are ready - they are the five wise virgins. They are EXPECTING HIM.

People who make it out that we're basically clueless as to when he will be coming back are tainting the words of the Lord, who instructed us to be ready. We will not be suprised, if we are surprised it means we're spiritually dead!

 

[iamlamad]

The Lord comes as a thief only applies to the way in which he comes against those who are his enemies. The strongman is his enemy, therefore he is a thief to the strongman.

The Saints are not the same, they are watching and ready, therefore the Lord does not come on them as a thief, he comes when they are ready - they are the five wise virgins. They are EXPECTING HIM.

People who make it out that we're basically clueless as to when he will be coming back are tainting the words of the Lord, who instructed us to be ready. We will not be suprised, if we are surprised it means we're spiritually dead!

"the Lord does not come on them as a thief, he comes when they are ready"

This is not quite right. There will be some believers who are READY when He comes. They will be watching for His coming. Sadly many believers expect other things to happen first, so will not be ready. For those He will come as a thief. What am I saying? There will be many born again believers who will NOT be ready when He comes, and they will be left behind.

LAMAD

 

[iamlamad]

Scripture does not teach that there are multiple comings of Christ "as a thief", it only teaches one.

And do I have it correct that you assert the one and only Coming of Christ "as a thief" is spiritual and not physical, and happened in the 1st Century?

I disagree: there are TWO comings, first FOR His bride, then WITH His bride. And BOTH will be when NO MAN knows the day nor the hour. For His coming at Paul's rapture, it will be at a time when people are saying "peace and safety," a day quite like TODAY.

When He comes in glory and splendor, again NO ONE will know the day nor the hour. But this time EVERYONE will know His coming; no one will miss it!

LAMAD

 

[iamlamad]

Both Daniel and Revelations occur after the gentile rapture...

WHAT? What part of Daniel? What part of Revelation?

Did you not notice that the first page of Revelation was while John was alive? He wrote, "I, John, IN the tribulation..." So the first page of Revelation was around 95 AD. Chapter 21, on the other hand, is at least 1000 years plus into our future. Does it not make sense, then, that somewhere between chapter 1 and chapter 21 of Revelation is where we are now?

LAMAD

 

[Bible2]

iamlamad said in post 224:

There will be some believers who are READY when He comes. They will be watching for His coming. Sadly many believers expect other things to happen first, so will not be ready. For those He will come as a thief. What am I saying? There will be many born again believers who will NOT be ready when He comes, and they will be left behind.

Do you mean there will be only a partial rapture of the church, sometime before the 2nd coming, of only those in the church who are ready for the rapture by simply believing it's pre-tribulation? If so, note that nothing in the Bible says any believer will be left behind at the rapture, that the entire church won't be raptured at the time of Matthew 24:31, 2 Thessalonians 2:1, and 1 Thessalonians 4:17, which is the time of Jesus' 2nd coming, immediately after the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24 (Matthew 24:29-31; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8; 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17). For the need for believers to be ready for Jesus' 2nd coming (Matthew 24:44, Matthew 25:10) doesn't have to do with whether or not they will be raptured at that time, but with whether or not they will lose their salvation at that time (e.g. Luke 12:45-46, Matthew 25:26,30, Mark 8:35-38).

For some saved people at the judgment of the church by Jesus (2 Corinthians 5:10, Romans 2:6-8, Luke 12:45-48, Matthew 25:19-30) at his 2nd coming (Psalms 50:3-5, cf. Mark 13:27) will lose their salvation because of such things as unrepentant sin (Luke 12:45-46, Hebrews 10:26-29; 1 Corinthians 9:27), unrepentant laziness (Matthew 25:26,30, John 15:2a, Romans 2:6-8), or apostasy (Mark 8:35-38, Hebrews 6:4-8; 2 Timothy 2:12b). That's why saved people know the "terror" of the coming judgment of the church by Jesus (2 Corinthians 5:10-11), why they must remain in fear of being cut off the same as unbelievers if they don't continue in God's goodness (Romans 11:20-22, Luke 12:45-46), why they must be careful to work out their own ultimate salvation with fear and trembling (Philippians 2:12b; 1 Peter 1:17, Romans 2:6-8).

 

[iamlamad]

Do you mean there will be only a partial rapture of the church, sometime before the 2nd coming, of only those in the church who are ready for the rapture by simply believing it's pre-tribulation?

That is EXACTLY what I am saying because that is what the bible teaches - all your 'notes" aside.

YOu still think the Day of the Lord comes when HE comes. This is not what the bible teaches. The Day of the Lord is a DARK day. It is a day when people mourn. God has made it plain, His plan is to DESTROY the earth and those in the earth. John was accurate in what he wrote, at the end of chapter 6:

"THE DAY OF HIS WRATH HAS COME."

Why don't you believe this? We see God's wrath beginning with the very first trumpet judgment. It is the start of the destruction of the world.

You just go ahead with your "notes" and you will MISS what you can't believe. You will be left behind, simply because you will not be watching or expecting His coming.

ALWAYS REMEMBER, He is coming for those LOOKING for Him! Only it will not be a "Partial rapture" as you say, for it will be completed with those who are ready. There is not going to be another rapture at the end of the 70th week when Jesus returns on His white horse.

The ONLY WAY you will get to heaven and join in the marriage supper, since you will be left behind, will be to refuse the mark and lose your head. It is that simple: there will be NO OTHER ROAD to heaven after Jesus comes FOR His bride pretrib.

LAMAD

 

[Bible2]

iamlamad said in post 228:

John was accurate in what he wrote, at the end of chapter 6:

"THE DAY OF HIS WRATH HAS COME."

Note that the tribulation's 6th seal (Revelation 6:12-14) will happen sometime before the day of the Lord (Joel 2:31, Revelation 6:12), whereas the day of the Lord/Christ (2 Thessalonians 2:2) will begin at his 2nd coming (1 Corinthians 1:7-8; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8; 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10), which won't happen until Revelation 19:7 to 20:6, immediately after the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24 (Matthew 24:29-31; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8). Similarly, the day of the Lord's wrath (Psalms 110:5) won't begin until Jesus' 2nd coming (Revelation 19:19-21).

So the people quoted at the 6th seal (Revelation 6:17), during only the first stage of the tribulation, could be just as mistaken as Job was when Job said that what was happening to him was God's wrath against him (Job 19:11). Just as what was happening to Job was actually Satan's wrath against him, not God's wrath, so the 6th seal could actually be Satan's wrath, not God's wrath. And just as the writer of the book of Job didn't go out of his way to correct Job's mistaken statement in Job 19:11, and just as the apostles John and Matthew didn't go out of their way to correct the mistaken statements of the people they quoted in John 7:12b and Matthew 27:63a, so the apostle John could have not gone out of his way to correct the statement of the people he quoted in Revelation 6:17.

After the tribulation's 6th seal will occur its 7th seal (Revelation 8:1), out of which will come its 7 trumpets (Revelation 8:1-2). Note that nothing requires that any of the first 6 trumpets' events in Revelation chapters 8 and 9 will be God's wrath. The 5th trumpet's events will be the work of weird locust-like beings from the bottomless pit (Revelation 9:2-10) led by a fallen angel from the bottomless pit (Revelation 9:11). And the 6th trumpet's events to the end of Revelation 9 will be the work of weird horse-like beings led by 4 fallen angels previously bound at the Euphrates (Revelation 9:14-19). So even though good angels of God will sound the first 6 trumpets, this could be announcing God's allowing the wrath of Satan to destroy 1/3 of different things (Revelation 8:7-12, Revelation 9:15,18), just as Satan will subsequently, mid-tribulation, be allowed by God to cause 1/3 of the angels (i.e. the fallen angels) to be cast down to the earth permanently (Revelation 12:4,9).

Revelation chapters 8 and 9 will happen before the Antichrist's (the individual-man aspect of the beast's) future, literal 3.5-year worldwide Luciferian/Satanic reign (Revelation 13:4-18, Revelation 12:9). And the events in Revelation chapters 8 and 9 could be used by Satan to help prepare the world to welcome that reign. For what he could do is first take great pleasure in causing the destruction in each event, but then claim that the destruction isn't from him, but from YHWH, and that YHWH is a cruel tyrant god who hates mankind and only wants to make it suffer, while he (Satan, as "Lucifer") only wants the best for mankind (cf. Mark 8:33b). In this way, he could deceive the world into turning away from YHWH and instead worshipping him (the dragon) and the Antichrist (Revelation 13:4-18, Revelation 12:9). The Antichrist will utterly revile YHWH (Revelation 13:6, Daniel 11:36).

After the Antichrist's literal 3.5-year reign (Revelation 13:5-7) is declared legally over at the sounding of the tribulation's 7th trumpet (Revelation 11:15), the 7 plagues of the 7 vials of God's wrath will come out of the heavenly-temple opening of the 7th trumpet (Revelation 11:19, Revelation 15:5 to 16:1). The vials will then be poured out on the Antichrist's followers as God's judgment for their receiving the Antichrist's mark and worshipping his image (Revelation 16:2), and for their killing of people in the church (Revelation 16:6-7, Revelation 13:7-10, Revelation 14:12-13, Revelation 20:4-6, Matthew 24:9-13).

During the Antichrist's worldwide reign, people in the church will be hated and killed in every nation for refusing to renounce the name of Jesus Christ (Matthew 24:9-13). They will be beheaded for refusing to renounce the witness of Jesus Christ (Revelation 20:4), for refusing to accept the antichrist lies that Jesus himself isn't the Christ (1 John 2:22), and that Christ himself isn't in the flesh (2 John 1:7). They will be beheaded for refusing to renounce the sound doctrine of the Bible, the Word of God (Revelation 20:4; 2 Timothy 3:15 to 4:4), for refusing to depart from the Biblical faith and give heed instead to seducing spirits and doctrines of devils (1 Timothy 4:1-2). They will be beheaded for refusing to worship the Antichrist's image (Revelation 20:4, Revelation 13:15). And all of this will be Satan's wrath against the church (Revelation 12:17), not God's wrath, for the church isn't appointed to God's wrath (1 Thessalonians 5:9).

Even when God's wrath comes in the 7 vials (Revelation 16), the tribulation's final stage, because the church isn't appointed to God's wrath (1 Thessalonians 5:9), none of the vials will be directed at any of those in the church who will still be alive on the earth at that time, still waiting for Jesus' coming as a thief (Revelation 16:15). Instead, they will go into protective chambers which they will have prepared for themselves on the earth (Isaiah 26:20), just as Noah and his family went into the protective ark which they had prepared for themselves on the earth (Genesis 7:11,13).

Jesus will return right after the 7th and last vial is completed (Revelation 16:17,19, Revelation 19:2-21, Matthew 24:29-30), and he will bring the 2nd-coming wrath of God on the unsaved world (Revelation 19:15-21). But before that 2nd-coming wrath begins, the church will be caught up together/gathered together (raptured) (1 Thessalonians 4:17; 2 Thessalonians 2:1, Matthew 24:31) into the sky to hold a meeting in the air with the returned Jesus (1 Thessalonians 4:17).

At that meeting, Jesus will judge everyone in the church (Psalms 50:3-5, cf. Mark 13:27) by their works (2 Corinthians 5:10, Romans 2:6-8, Luke 12:45-48, Matthew 25:19-30). And then Jesus will marry in the clouds the obedient part of the church (Revelation 19:7-8, Matthew 25:1-12), those in the church (of all times) who "overcame" to the end (Revelation 3:5, Revelation 2:26). They will then mount white horses and come back down from the sky (the 1st heaven) with Jesus (Revelation 19:14) as he defeats the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of Revelation's "beast") and the world's armies (Revelation 19:15-21). Jesus will then make the marriage supper of Revelation 19:9 for the resurrected and married obedient part of the church in the earthly Jerusalem (Isaiah 25:6-9; 1 Corinthians 15:54). Jesus and the obedient part of the church will then reign on the earth for 1,000 years (Revelation 20:4-6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29).

iamlamad said in post 228:

The ONLY WAY you will get to heaven and join in the marriage supper, since you will be left behind, will be to refuse the mark and lose your head. It is that simple: there will be NO OTHER ROAD to heaven after Jesus comes FOR His bride pretrib.

Note that nothing in the Bible teaches or requires a pre-tribulation rapture of the church. Instead, the Bible shows that Jesus won't come and gather together (rapture) the church until immediately after the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24 (Matthew 24:29-31; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8). That's why the marriage of the church doesn't happen until Revelation 19:7, in connection with Jesus' 2nd coming and the bodily resurrection of the church at that time (Revelation 19:7 to 20:6; 1 Corinthians 15:21-23,51-53; 1 Thessalonians 4:15-16). Matthew 24:30-31 refers to the same 2nd coming of Jesus and gathering together of the church as 2 Thessalonians 2:1, which refers to the same 2nd coming of Jesus when the catching up together (rapture) of the church will occur (1 Thessalonians 4:15-17).

Jesus won't return and gather together (rapture) the church until sometime after there's a falling away (an apostasy) in the church, and the Antichrist sits in a 3rd Jewish temple in Jerusalem and proclaims himself God (2 Thessalonians 2:1-4, Daniel 11:31,36, Revelation 11:1-2, Revelation 13:4-8), and the abomination of desolation (possibly a standing, android image of the Antichrist) is set up in the holy place (the inner sanctum) of the 3rd Jewish temple (Matthew 24:15-31, Daniel 11:31). For when Jesus returns to gather together (and marry) the church, he will destroy the Antichrist (2 Thessalonians 2:1,8, Revelation 19:7,20). Before Jesus returns, the church will have to go through the future, literal 3.5 years of the Antichrist's worldwide reign (Revelation 13:5-10, Revelation 14:12-13, Revelation 20:4-6, Matthew 24:9-31).

At Jesus' 2nd coming (1 Thessalonians 4:15; 2 Thessalonians 2:1, Matthew 24:30), the church will be resurrected and caught up together/gathered together (raptured) (1 Thessalonians 4:16-17; 2 Thessalonians 2:1, Matthew 24:31), not to remove the church from the earth (Proverbs 10:30, John 17:15,20), but to take the church only as high as the clouds of the sky to hold a meeting in the air with the returned Jesus (1 Thessalonians 4:17).