What has led to this posting/ discussion saints is a recent message that i sat through on a sunday morning service.
The senior pastor ( chief pastor ) of the flock was teaching that it is quite okay to have things in life, goods, material possessions, riches, substance galore etc etc
On the condition we abstain from them for a season and delay from - what he refered to as the "instant gratification " mentality in Society.
The basis for this was he wanted us to use wisdom in our.... " purchase buying "
In other words ( IOW ) he was instructing the flock that if they wait 12 months or 2 years before buying that plasma T.V OR that NEW CAR - then that product will by virtue of time be thousands of dollars cheaper....and this may save you from using those wretched "in-store credit cards" as well.
Now this sounds like he's giving good sound practical advice to the flock...does it not ?? i mean it sounds plausible to the hearer to listen too. And furthermore im sure the majority of people went away thinking that morning - yeah what great advice from our pastor, and what great wisdom, if i only just delay ...my lust... for that plasma or mercedes benz, then i will ultimately save thousands on the original sale price.
yes I think i will heed his advice and practise....this " delayed gratification " ( teaching )
In other words i can have what i want ( no limits ) i can gratify my desire for this material good and that material good....but if im a smart buyer - i will refrain from my urges for a season and wait till the prices dwindle- and then i can rush out and get me the latest plasma, the latest Lexus, the latest digital cameras etc
So basically this pastor of a very large denomination in the earth toDAY WAS not saying that we couldn't have everything that our hearts "desire" - but just be a smart buyer and hold off and delay your lust for instant gratification, and then ultimately you will save lots and lots on the bux, and after all if stops you from using those in-store credit-cards, then do i not... come bringing good sound advice to the flock today ....well i think...i do
Good advice ?? plausible arguments ?? good speech ??
DID not Paul however teach the Corinthians that he knew both how to abound and to be abased ??
And no matter what state i find myself in - that ive learnt how to be content ??
In other words if im in bounty then i rejoice in the abundance i have ( in the Lord ) but conversely if im in want and have needs, then i rejoice in this state also.
Godliness with contentment is great gain !!
Or does your " bible" not have that passage in it ??
Did not BALAAM accept the " rewards" of divination
which in the end totally corrupted him ?? - and even to the point he worked against God's people in attempting to curse them through prayers and words ??
Did not the madness of this one prophet "sell out" over filthy lucre, and indeed he did sell out friends ....so much so that - the angel of the Lord told him that his way was ....perverse before him.
And stood before him ( Balaam ) with an up-raised "sword" to block his going forth....to and with.... the princes of Balak.
Balaam's life ended in tragedy friends and we are told by the apostle Peter that his downfall was " he loved the wages of unrighteousness" further more Jude enlightens us that Balaam ran greedily after reward.
Have you ever heard the lame excuse some proport today and it goes something like this and i quote " i want to be rich - so i can be a blessing to others along the way " in other words the " ends " justifies the means ( of how i will have achieved it ) others call this mind-set " situation ethics " meaning ( the ends always justifies the... means )
Paul states in Romans chapter sixteen regarding deceivers that " with good words/ speeches, and convincing arguments ( plausibilty ) they the deceivers would succeed in ...exploiting the hearts of the gullible.
At first glance and on the surface this senior pastor's advice seems just great, and wonderful ...you can have what you want in life but just delay having them for now - delay your lusts and delay your gratification needs just for the moment, and the reward for you will be "multiplied savings on interest and multiplied savings on eventual store mark-downs"
hmmmm sounds even plausible ....i think ( i think not )
The book of Colossians states this emphatically to all out there who are promoting that abundance is to be satisfied with-out restraint " no coveteous person has any inheritance or place....in the kingdom of God " ( period - full stop )
Just getting back to this argument "that i wanna be rich and wealthy so i can be a conduit blessing to all others that come my way who have needs and are in want"
If that is such a burning desire in you - to have access to lots of funds and money, in order for you to bless the less fortunate in our society - then why do you have to be " rich " yourself in order... to accomplish such feats ??
Is that your justification for wealth ?? let me become affluent Lord so i can get to all those poor ones around me and give till it's over-flowing, pressed down, shaking together - if your motive for having your own wealth is sincere ( meaning you really want it so you can share it around ) then i propose to you that you do not have to become rich in order to do this charity to people.
What i mean is this - if your motive was pure and not tarnished with spoiling yourself in riches along the way to blessing others - as you claim for justification to have wealth ... then i propose to you this " why not start up a christian non-profit charity for the ...less fortunate in the community" ?? and for those poor ones, and those defrauded and robbed of precious goods !! why do you have to get rich yourself ...in order to help others ?? this can all be achieved still ...by starting a non-profit christian charity for the poor - could it not ?? so why then this justification for God to bless you with wealth - so in order for the less- fortunate around you can be helped or be helped ??
If your motives are sincere in wanting to help the poor in the community....there is no need for any of us to "pray" God please make me filthy rich....so i can help and deliver the poor around me.
Brethren be not deceived by these preachers with there good words and plausible arguments !! Peter said they would sneek in...damnable heresies, that would go undetected by casual observers.
And may i conclude with the words of James ....the reason you have not, is becuase you ask amiss....that you may consume it upon your own lusts.
Therefore your requests are denied and your prayers will not rise above the ceiling....you have not becuase you desire to gratify your requests...upon your own filthy lusts. You have not - because you practise "gratification" from a polluted heart.
The senior pastor ( chief pastor ) of the flock was teaching that it is quite okay to have things in life, goods, material possessions, riches, substance galore etc etc
On the condition we abstain from them for a season and delay from - what he refered to as the "instant gratification " mentality in Society.
The basis for this was he wanted us to use wisdom in our.... " purchase buying "
In other words ( IOW ) he was instructing the flock that if they wait 12 months or 2 years before buying that plasma T.V OR that NEW CAR - then that product will by virtue of time be thousands of dollars cheaper....and this may save you from using those wretched "in-store credit cards" as well.
Now this sounds like he's giving good sound practical advice to the flock...does it not ?? i mean it sounds plausible to the hearer to listen too. And furthermore im sure the majority of people went away thinking that morning - yeah what great advice from our pastor, and what great wisdom, if i only just delay ...my lust... for that plasma or mercedes benz, then i will ultimately save thousands on the original sale price.
yes I think i will heed his advice and practise....this " delayed gratification " ( teaching )
In other words i can have what i want ( no limits ) i can gratify my desire for this material good and that material good....but if im a smart buyer - i will refrain from my urges for a season and wait till the prices dwindle- and then i can rush out and get me the latest plasma, the latest Lexus, the latest digital cameras etc
So basically this pastor of a very large denomination in the earth toDAY WAS not saying that we couldn't have everything that our hearts "desire" - but just be a smart buyer and hold off and delay your lust for instant gratification, and then ultimately you will save lots and lots on the bux, and after all if stops you from using those in-store credit-cards, then do i not... come bringing good sound advice to the flock today ....well i think...i do
Good advice ?? plausible arguments ?? good speech ??
DID not Paul however teach the Corinthians that he knew both how to abound and to be abased ??
And no matter what state i find myself in - that ive learnt how to be content ??
In other words if im in bounty then i rejoice in the abundance i have ( in the Lord ) but conversely if im in want and have needs, then i rejoice in this state also.
Godliness with contentment is great gain !!
Or does your " bible" not have that passage in it ??
Did not BALAAM accept the " rewards" of divination
which in the end totally corrupted him ?? - and even to the point he worked against God's people in attempting to curse them through prayers and words ??
Did not the madness of this one prophet "sell out" over filthy lucre, and indeed he did sell out friends ....so much so that - the angel of the Lord told him that his way was ....perverse before him.
And stood before him ( Balaam ) with an up-raised "sword" to block his going forth....to and with.... the princes of Balak.
Balaam's life ended in tragedy friends and we are told by the apostle Peter that his downfall was " he loved the wages of unrighteousness" further more Jude enlightens us that Balaam ran greedily after reward.
Have you ever heard the lame excuse some proport today and it goes something like this and i quote " i want to be rich - so i can be a blessing to others along the way " in other words the " ends " justifies the means ( of how i will have achieved it ) others call this mind-set " situation ethics " meaning ( the ends always justifies the... means )
Paul states in Romans chapter sixteen regarding deceivers that " with good words/ speeches, and convincing arguments ( plausibilty ) they the deceivers would succeed in ...exploiting the hearts of the gullible.
At first glance and on the surface this senior pastor's advice seems just great, and wonderful ...you can have what you want in life but just delay having them for now - delay your lusts and delay your gratification needs just for the moment, and the reward for you will be "multiplied savings on interest and multiplied savings on eventual store mark-downs"
hmmmm sounds even plausible ....i think
( i think not )The book of Colossians states this emphatically to all out there who are promoting that abundance is to be satisfied with-out restraint " no coveteous person has any inheritance or place....in the kingdom of God " ( period - full stop )
Just getting back to this argument "that i wanna be rich and wealthy so i can be a conduit blessing to all others that come my way who have needs and are in want"
If that is such a burning desire in you - to have access to lots of funds and money, in order for you to bless the less fortunate in our society - then why do you have to be " rich " yourself in order... to accomplish such feats ??
Is that your justification for wealth ?? let me become affluent Lord so i can get to all those poor ones around me and give till it's over-flowing, pressed down, shaking together - if your motive for having your own wealth is sincere ( meaning you really want it so you can share it around ) then i propose to you that you do not have to become rich in order to do this charity to people.
What i mean is this - if your motive was pure and not tarnished with spoiling yourself in riches along the way to blessing others - as you claim for justification to have wealth ... then i propose to you this " why not start up a christian non-profit charity for the ...less fortunate in the community" ?? and for those poor ones, and those defrauded and robbed of precious goods !! why do you have to get rich yourself ...in order to help others ??
this can all be achieved still ...by starting a non-profit christian charity for the poor - could it not ?? so why then this justification for God to bless you with wealth - so in order for the less- fortunate around you can be helped or be helped ??If your motives are sincere in wanting to help the poor in the community....there is no need for any of us to "pray" God please make me filthy rich....so i can help and deliver the poor around me.
Brethren be not deceived by these preachers with there good words and plausible arguments !! Peter said they would sneek in...damnable heresies, that would go undetected by casual observers.
And may i conclude with the words of James ....the reason you have not, is becuase you ask amiss....that you may consume it upon your own lusts.
Therefore your requests are denied and your prayers will not rise above the ceiling....you have not becuase you desire to gratify your requests...upon your own filthy lusts. You have not - because you practise "gratification" from a polluted heart.
