Does mass evangelism really work?

[JAS4Yeshua]

And are you saying that, despite the disillusionment and unfulfilled hopes of those many thousands more that mass evangelism produces (something like 95% of the reported “successes”) that will hinder them in a time when the Holy Spirit does speak to them, that this is something to be applauded, that this is good!?!

To hell with the collateral damage at least we roped in a few.

There is a better way, you know.

~Jim

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People with nothing to hide hide nothing.

That isn't the fault of the event, but the fault of those who follow up after the event. Either there is no adequate follow-up, or the enemy snatches them back before follow-up can happen. In other cases the person never really made the commitment to begin with.

Is it collateral damage? There is no evidence of that. Just people that don't follow through with their commitments, which will happen regardless of the size of the event. You just see larger numbers simply because of its size. That's why I say comparisons between other methods can't be properly measured.

 

[JimB]

Ghandi needed to be told that the only one they needed to meet is the one that everybody else had

Tas, God loved Gandhi as much as he loves you—where sin abounds grace that much more abounds—and rather than be cavalier about his failure to receive Jesus Christ I think it grieves the heart of God.

The problem is "Gandhi needed to be told." By whom? Maybe they just didn't. Maybe we (the Church) failed Gandhi. And that also must grieve God.

~Jim

​

People with nothing to hide hide nothing.​

 

[dawnsday]

Ghandi needed to be told that the only one they needed to meet is the one that everybody else had

Christ isn't here to meet and one can not be expected to "meet" him, without first glancing at the so-called examples of him...

...therefore it is on US to show his love...and if we don't, then it is partially our fault that they did not come to Him.

that's just what i think at least.

 

[JAS4Yeshua]

As long as it is done exemplifying Christ. If it is done in the spirit and example of our Lord and not one converts, then we can be satisfied that our efforts were pure...and go back and try to fix our mistakes for the next time...

...but if it is a bad example, if it is done claiming Christ, but goes against His will...then that is flat wrong, because how many of those so-called converts are not actually converts but just have some warped idea of christianity that has nothing to do with Christ/God at all? Then it becomes leading people to Idols.

In my opinion, that is.

Are you saying evangelical events don't exemplify Christ? Billy Graham Crusades weren't speaking about Christ? That is news to me. I know from experience that the Harvest Crusades entire focus is on Christ's sacrifice and the call to turn from sins and accept Christ.

Evangelical events, large or small, will bring others to Christ. It will also turn people away from Christ. But it isn't the event that does it. It is the Holy Spirit working through the event, and the person attending the event's willingness to listen or reject the call of the Spirit.

 

[TasManOfGod]

I remember what the German born African evangelist Reinhard Bonke said once that God sees him as a a "harvester" and is loved but no more than the farmer who goes behind with a scythe doing the edges. It is not so much how effective what you do is but what is the heart behind you doing it.
If God has called you to criticise others than you better make a good job of it so God will be really pleased with you

 

[JAS4Yeshua]

Tas, God loved Gandhi as much as he loves you—where sin abounds grace that much more abounds—and rather than be cavalier about his failure to receive Jesus Christ I think it grieves the heart of God.

The problem is "Gandhi needed to be told." By whom? Maybe they just didn't. Maybe we (the Church) failed Gandhi. And that also must grieve God.

~Jim

People with nothing to hide hide nothing.​

Yes, Ghandi needed to be told. Yes it grieves God. But Ghandi still had the option of accepting or rejecting. He chose to reject, which is truly grevious. That doesn't make any difference towards mass evangelical outreaches, though.

 

[JimB]

That isn't the fault of the event, but the fault of those who follow up after the event. Either there is no adequate follow-up, or the enemy snatches them back before follow-up can happen. In other cases the person never really made the commitment to begin with.

Is it collateral damage? There is no evidence of that. Just people that don't follow through with their commitments, which will happen regardless of the size of the event. You just see larger numbers simply because of its size. That's why I say comparisons between other methods can't be properly measured.

Of course there is collateral damage. I am a pastor who has to deal with disillusioned people all the time who say, “I tried being saved and it just didn’t work.” We all know the probable reasons for that.

And yes, crusade follow would be great—if it really worked. I have worked in four Billy Graham Crusades (even with BG himself) and directly involved in follow-up, even heading a follow-up effort myself, and BGEA are probably the best at crusade follow-up, but it just doesn’t work in real life as it does on paper. Sure, it should. But it don’t.

There is a better way, the NT way.

~Jim

​

People with nothing to hide hide nothing.​

 

[dawnsday]

Tas, God loved Gandhi as much as he loves you—where sin abounds grace that much more abounds—and rather than be cavalier about his failure to receive Jesus Christ I think it grieves the heart of God.

The problem is "Gandhi needed to be told." By whom? Maybe they just didn't. Maybe we (the Church) failed Gandhi. And that also must grieve God.

~Jim

People with nothing to hide hide nothing.​

I completely agree...except one thing...i think Ghandi needed to be SHOWN.

 

[JAS4Yeshua]

Christ isn't here to meet and one can not be expected to "meet" him, without first glancing at the so-called examples of him...

...therefore it is on US to show his love...and if we don't, then it is partially our fault that they did not come to Him.

that's just what i think at least.

I agree with you completely. We need to be examples, and we need to preach the Word. We can't rely on others to do that. We need to be salt and light, as Jim mentioned earlier. The world is lost and dying. We have the answer. Let's not hold the answer back, but share it. Let's follow-up with those decisions made at mass events. Let's follow-up with the decisions made at small events. Let's go out on the streets and preach the good news. Let's use all these things, but in the midst of it all, remember that we need to be used by the Holy Spirit, because it is by His power that anyone gets saved and becomes strong in their walk with God, not by anything that we do.

 

[he4rty]

Is it actually the event or more the fact alter calls are not the best method but look good with lots of people streaming to the front rather than just being quietly prayed for where they sit.

 

[dawnsday]

Are you saying evangelical events don't exemplify Christ? Billy Graham Crusades weren't speaking about Christ? That is news to me. I know from experience that the Harvest Crusades entire focus is on Christ's sacrifice and the call to turn from sins and accept Christ.

Evangelical events, large or small, will bring others to Christ. It will also turn people away from Christ. But it isn't the event that does it. It is the Holy Spirit working through the event, and the person attending the event's willingness to listen or reject the call of the Spirit.

I am saying not all of them do. Actually, I take that back. I am saying MOST of them don't. I think a great deal of them are about money, power, deception and outright scams.

And I stand by that, based on my experiences. I do know there are those out there who do it with honest intent and do their best to show God's love...but I see more of Christ in those who work to rebuild homes, give to the hungry etc, then I do in those who preach.

Not that preaching isn't sometimes good.

But, Christ fed the hungry and knew their spirit could not be fed if their stomachs were pained.

 

[millerrod]

Whatever we do if just one meets Jesus

 

[JAS4Yeshua]

Of course there is collateral damage. I am a pastor who has to deal with disillusioned people all the time who say, “I tried being saved and it just didn’t work.” We all know the probable reasons for that.

And yes, crusade follow would be great—if it really worked. I have worked in four Billy Graham Crusades (even with BG himself) and directly involved in follow-up, even heading a follow-up effort myself, and BGEA are probably the best at crusade follow-up, but it just doesn’t work in real life as it does on paper. Sure, it should. But it don’t.

There is a better way, the NT way.

~Jim

People with nothing to hide hide nothing.​

You'd deal with disillusioned people regardless of the event or not. People expect God to be one thing, and realize that isn't true. It doesn't matter the size of the event, big or small. In addition, I state that we can't state which way is better because we have no numbers for everything to compare against. Your perception may be that it is better, but without numbers, it is only an opinion.

I'm not discounting what you're saying, Jim. Everything has its place. Yes there are pitfalls. That is because we're in a fallen world, and Satan and his fallen angels want to take as many people with them as they can. No matter what method you use, you're going to have collateral damage. It is unavoidable. You just do your best to avoid it, and rely on God and the Holy Spirit for the rest.

 

[JimB]

Yes, Ghandi needed to be told. Yes it grieves God. But Ghandi still had the option of accepting or rejecting. He chose to reject, which is truly grevious. That doesn't make any difference towards mass evangelical outreaches, though.

How can we say, “He chose to reject”? How do we know if he was ever presented with the claims of Christ on his life? How do we even know of he ever met a genuine Christian?

~Jim

​

People with nothing to hide hide nothing.​

 

[JimB]

I completely agree...except one thing...i think Ghandi needed to be SHOWN.

 

[TasManOfGod]

Iagree Jim but people dont do it the NT way because for too long the NT way has been kept out of our churches . (Perhaps the pentecostal movement has gone some way to eliminate that)
What I see as the biggest factor of those dropping away is that many come to the alter with a lot of worldly baggage. Some of that is sin but often there is a LOT more (sickness, curses, addictions, etc) The Jesus they hear about is the Jesus who was a sin sacrifice for them and they receive that (that will get them born again)-BUT they didn't hear the FULL gospel and they never found out ALL that Jesus did for them and nobody else subsequently told them -end result they are drawn away and maybe 7 more come to fill the empty space

 

[JimB]

You'd deal with disillusioned people regardless of the event or not. People expect God to be one thing, and realize that isn't true. It doesn't matter the size of the event, big or small. In addition, I state that we can't state which way is better because we have no numbers for everything to compare against. Your perception may be that it is better, but without numbers, it is only an opinion.

I'm not discounting what you're saying, Jim. Everything has its place. Yes there are pitfalls. That is because we're in a fallen world, and Satan and his fallen angels want to take as many people with them as they can. No matter what method you use, you're going to have collateral damage. It is unavoidable. You just do your best to avoid it, and rely on God and the Holy Spirit for the rest.

Neither am I saying mass evangelism does not win some to the Lord. But what mass crusades do is absorb a lot of energy and money to accomplish such relatively little return. There’s just not enough bang for the buck. And what it does is distract us from the NT pattern of evangelism by thinking that evangelism is what the evangelist does, relieving us of our responsibility to be salt and light and ready to give anyone who asks us a reason for the hope that is in us.

When I hear that a crusade won 2000 souls to Christ, I (who have been involved in too many of them) know that that probably means less than 100 people truly came to know Christ who could have been won more effectively and at less cost by simply giving them, one-on-one, a reason for the hope that is in us. For the most part, mass crusades are more smoke than fire, make us feel like something is really being done (just look at the reported numbers) and we are blinded by the glitz of it all.

There is a better way. The NT way.

~Jim

People with nothing to hide hide nothing.​

 

[JAS4Yeshua]

How can we say, “He chose to reject”? How do we know if he was ever presented with the claims of Christ on his life? How do we even know of he ever met a genuine Christian?

~Jim

People with nothing to hide hide nothing.​

By his own statement. He apparently knew who Christ was and what His claims were but since he didn't find any "Christian" he chose not to be one. His final decision is between him and God.

 

[JAS4Yeshua]

I am saying not all of them do. Actually, I take that back. I am saying MOST of them don't. I think a great deal of them are about money, power, deception and outright scams.

And I stand by that, based on my experiences. I do know there are those out there who do it with honest intent and do their best to show God's love...but I see more of Christ in those who work to rebuild homes, give to the hungry etc, then I do in those who preach.

Not that preaching isn't sometimes good.

But, Christ fed the hungry and knew their spirit could not be fed if their stomachs were pained.

Most of the events you've experienced, perhaps. But you haven't seen all the different types of events out there. I haven't seen them all either, so I refuse to say one way or the other on that. All I know is there are good ones and bad ones out there, just like there are good churches and bad churches and good Christians and bad Christians. Whether there are more of one than the other, I cannot honestly say any more than any other person can.

 

[JimB]

Whatever we do if just one meets Jesus

But if 100 are damaged or disillusioned in our effort to reach one soul, is that a good thing?

~Jim

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People with nothing to hide hide nothing.​